AIBU to expect an apology?

[SpeedRunParent]

DC 12 goes to a naice grammar in Kent. One boy in her year group has physically assaulted her twice ( with witnesses) and has called her a slut; reiterating that slur after the second incident.
The first time he put his hands around her neck and squeezed, leaving her shocked and breathless, because someone ( not my dc) had annoyed him somehow. This is the occasion on which he called her a slut. (Not that it makes any difference but my dc loathes all the 'he fancies you', this one loves the other nonsense).
On the second occasion, same boy ( part of her wider social group) had an umbrella taken from him by two other group members and it sounds like the umbrella was damaged. My DC absolutely did not have anything to do with this either ( the school has assured me of that). This time the boy slaps one girl in the face, throttles a boy and punches my DC hard in the gut - resulting in her needing to go to the med. centre.
The only sanction this boy has received has been days isolating during lessons.
AIBU to have expected that my daughter receive an apology from this child? If a person does not acknowledge their misdeeds and make amends, how is he going to learn not to repeat them?
P.S. there is no suggestion that this child has any SEN, all we know is that the mother says things like 'boys will be boys'.

I’d involve the police

Your child and other children have been physically assaulted.
If that's the schools response I'd notify the police.

It sounds like several parents have good reason to feel as you do.
Go on the school website, check their bullying protocols. It should have a list of people who you contact if the school aren't dealing with the situation as you feel they should be. Go straight to them, copy in HOY and HT, explain that because of the seriousness of the situation you want all to be aware and they need to ensure this never happens again, and that on this occasion you have decided not to go to the police, but DD NEEDS an apology, and you want to know the schools plan of action if he assaults another student.

All of the parents with similar issues should also write a letter explaining what has happened with this child and what the outcome was.

In your position I would be ramming every single time this child has acted this way down their throats, and demanding that they act to deter this behaviour, or remove him.

And whilst your at it, enroll DD into self defence classes, and tell her if he touches her again to floor him.

Oh wait, I see you are going to the police. I apologise, I didn't read the thread!

copper I don't know as my dc not at this age yet, so how does the school stop him approaching the dd on the school grounds, is he kept completely separate for the rest of their time at the school then?
Yes, that's what an internal exclusion is. Often students internally excluded will come to and leave school slightly earlier or slightly later too - and then they sit in a room all day. They either bring a packed lunch or are escorted to the canteen before/after lunch time. Internal exclusions should mean no interaction between the excluded student and others whilst also ensuring that the excluded student is safe and supported. Often the student won't be disciplined at home at all and won't do any work - it's a much nicer punishment to stay in bed all day and game.

He is now back in their band practice sessions ( self-organised by the kids themselves, at school but not school run) as the main guy doesn't want him kicked from the band. So now my DD has to leave instead.
In the kindest way, what on earth do you want the school to do about a student wanting to include/exclude another student from a non-school social interaction?! They have absolutely no ability to prevent this without completely banning the band entirely (and, in the interest of fairness, banning all other activities of its kind for all students) - would you prefer that?

I have been told of the disciplinary measures taken against another child. I know exactly how they dealt with an issue including bringing in the parent of the perpetrator.

Like others have said, I'd start speaking to the police.

It is clear that you have no idea just how much "paperwork" has to be accumulated to be able to to exclude a pupil. Even a violent one

If it were my daughter I literally wouldn't care how much paperwork or admin there is to put a stop to it.

You and the other Poster seem supremely unconcerned about the victim here. Glad my DCs went to a school with a very good bullying policy that didn't centre the poor little bully

@Hereward1332 that's actually an really interesting perspective, not that it excuses this violent behaviour.

Really bad advice Pumpkin

Bloody hell an apology would be the least of my concerns. I would want protection for the DC from this violent child. I would also want to know why the hell this DC is violent and make sure it's investigated. Are there issues at home? Does he have emotional issues? Is he just a violent little twat? Either way the other DC need protection from him.

In the kindest way, what on earth do you want the school to do about a student wanting to include/exclude another student from a non-school social interaction?! They have absolutely no ability to prevent this without completely banning the band entirely (and, in the interest of fairness, banning all other activities of its kind for all students) - would you prefer that?

So who is responsible for safeguarding in this case? The children?

@AmaryllisNightAndDay

In the kindest way, what on earth do you want the school to do about a student wanting to include/exclude another student from a non-school social interaction?! They have absolutely no ability to prevent this without completely banning the band entirely (and, in the interest of fairness, banning all other activities of its kind for all students) - would you prefer that?

So who is responsible for safeguarding in this case? The children?

Yeah, pretty much tbh. It's nothing to do with the school who is in a non-school music group. It's not a school activity. The school cannot force all of the students in the school to not be friends with another student. Like, seriously?! Do you honestly expect a school to go to all the students and say X student did a bad thing to Y student so X student is no longer allowed to be friends with anyone anymore and no one is allowed to invite them to anything?! That's not insane in your mind?!

3. Permanently exclude them - this is a nightmare. It requires many, many, many documented incidents and co-operation with a whole host of people and organisations. Schools cannot just kick out a student - they have to go somewhere and that somewhere is paid for by the school, meaning less funding for everyone else

Permanent exclusion does not have to involve "many, many documented incidents". The rules expressly allow for PE for one-off very serious incidents. In this case there have been four separate physical assaults, two of them involving the same child, and witnessed by others. A number of elements of those assaults have been very serious, especially the repeated use of strangulation. Permanent exclusion could certainly be justified, particularly given the school's safeguarding duties. Deciding not to do so because it would involve paperwork and they'd surrender the funding for that child for that year would be a serious dereliction from those duties.

OP's DD is just as safe whether he's isolated in school or at home - either way, DD is not in contact with him

But the isolation was only for two days. So presumably OP's daughter is likely to come across him just as much as ever.

Yeah, pretty much tbh. It's nothing to do with the school who is in a non-school music group. It's not a school activity. The school cannot force all of the students in the school to not be friends with another student. Like, seriously?! Do you honestly expect a school to go to all the students and say X student did a bad thing to Y student so X student is no longer allowed to be friends with anyone anymore and no one is allowed to invite them to anything?! That's not insane in your mind?!

So as the boy who assaulted the dd is 'popular' its pretty much guaranteed that he'll be chosen to stay in the group as per ops post, and the dd loses out?

3. He was temporarily excluded... I never said it wasn't possible to temporarily exclude for this, I said it was exceptionally difficult to permanently exclude.

I wonder how on earth schools managed to achieve the 7,894 permanent exclusions recorded for the last school year before the pandemic?

In the kindest way, what on earth do you want the school to do about a student wanting to include/exclude another student from a non-school social interaction?! They have absolutely no ability to prevent this without completely banning the band entirely (and, in the interest of fairness, banning all other activities of its kind for all students) - would you prefer that?

It's an activity taking place on school premises and, probably, using the school's equipment. Of course they can prevent it or, in this case, impose conditions on the boy himself which would deal with this. If the band members would rather disband than continue without Mr Popular Strangler, then maybe that's not such a bad thing.

Did you hear back from the grad regarding a meeting? I think If I had t heard today I’d be sending a warning that I expect a meeting in the next 24 hours or I will go over the school to the police and LEA / Academy trust.

I think the apology is the least of your problems. I'd also be calling the police. He's tried to throttle her, called her a slut and punched her in the stomach. That's awful. I'd also want assurances from the school that this child and your dc aren't ever left alone or sat next to each other

Yeah, pretty much tbh. It's nothing to do with the school who is in a non-school music group.

OK, if you say so. But it's on school premises and with the school's agreement. Don't they have a required code of behaviour for any group meeting on their premises? It's not about "being friends" it's about more than one dangerous physical attack by one student on one or more others. Wouldn't the school find themselves a certain distance up shit creek if someone really got injured?

So many parents aren't aware that schools have a police liaison contact. Now, while they rarely take action against children, they can put enough fear in them to behave
DD in year 7 (now nearly year 10) was told by a boy at lunchtime that he had a knife. She was with 6 friends. One ran away. DD said she needed to check this child was OK and was allowed to leave by the child with the knife

With that, she calmly walked to the nearest classroom, found an adult and got help.
However, school were very keen to downplay it and did nothing but tell the boys parents.
My view was this didn't go far enough. In fact, DD had gotten a days on school exclusion over a silly incident with a puddle where she splashed a girl. So them doing nothing about a knife threat did not impress me.
I contacted 101 to ask them was it something they should be aware of. Yes indeed it was.
They sent their liaison in, boy was called out of class and liaison called me later that day saying her full uniform and badge suitably scared the boy and she was satisfied he wouldn't do it again. She did, however make his parents aware his name was logged for potential knife crime and she also contacted social services.

What that boy has done to your child is serious assault. Putting his hands round her neck and punching her over things that are nothing to do with her are inexcusable and I would be straight on the phone to the police
What a vile boy.

OP

Go to the police station.
Don’t just email, or ring them.
Go there in person.

I can't believe you didn't go straight to the police.
He throttled your DD.
My DD was assaulted by 3 girls when she was younger. The police issued cautions, 2 accepted them . The third who didn't touch DD but egged the others on, refused a caution and ended up in court.

The school I work for would have expelled him the first time. Really.

You should be going after more than an apology

@CopperBear

copper I don't know as my dc not at this age yet, so how does the school stop him approaching the dd on the school grounds, is he kept completely separate for the rest of their time at the school then? Yes, that's what an internal exclusion is. Often students internally excluded will come to and leave school slightly earlier or slightly later too - and then they sit in a room all day. They either bring a packed lunch or are escorted to the canteen before/after lunch time. Internal exclusions should mean no interaction between the excluded student and others whilst also ensuring that the excluded student is safe and supported. Often the student won't be disciplined at home at all and won't do any work - it's a much nicer punishment to stay in bed all day and game.

He is now back in their band practice sessions ( self-organised by the kids themselves, at school but not school run) as the main guy doesn't want him kicked from the band. So now my DD has to leave instead.
In the kindest way, what on earth do you want the school to do about a student wanting to include/exclude another student from a non-school social interaction?! They have absolutely no ability to prevent this without completely banning the band entirely (and, in the interest of fairness, banning all other activities of its kind for all students) - would you prefer that?

It's not unreasonable to ask the violent child to give the victims some space whilst they are on school grounds where possible. If that means him giving up a lunchtime activity so that the girl he assaulted twice can carry on with it then I don't see why you think that is so difficult to achieve. I work in a school and we would be happy to do the same for our kids.