AIBU to expect an apology?

[SpeedRunParent]

DC 12 goes to a naice grammar in Kent. One boy in her year group has physically assaulted her twice ( with witnesses) and has called her a slut; reiterating that slur after the second incident.
The first time he put his hands around her neck and squeezed, leaving her shocked and breathless, because someone ( not my dc) had annoyed him somehow. This is the occasion on which he called her a slut. (Not that it makes any difference but my dc loathes all the 'he fancies you', this one loves the other nonsense).
On the second occasion, same boy ( part of her wider social group) had an umbrella taken from him by two other group members and it sounds like the umbrella was damaged. My DC absolutely did not have anything to do with this either ( the school has assured me of that). This time the boy slaps one girl in the face, throttles a boy and punches my DC hard in the gut - resulting in her needing to go to the med. centre.
The only sanction this boy has received has been days isolating during lessons.
AIBU to have expected that my daughter receive an apology from this child? If a person does not acknowledge their misdeeds and make amends, how is he going to learn not to repeat them?
P.S. there is no suggestion that this child has any SEN, all we know is that the mother says things like 'boys will be boys'.

btw did your DD report the first incident (throttling) as well as the second? They are both very dangerous but if the school only know about one then they can't act on the other.

For a child whose behaviour is so extreme and so dangerous, an apology isn't really the point. I mean yes, it is good for a child to apologise for dangerous aggression but the apology wont make him safer to be around. And just because this boy is smart enough to go to grammar school and seems popular and his mother is in almighty denial, that does not mean that he is not profundly disturbed and/or that he doesn't have a whole raft of special needs. Goodness knows what is going on at home, maybe that is her "normal" for male behaiviour. Or if his mother is in denial about SEN then she wont have fought for SEN assessments, she may not have agreed to get them done even if the school asked and they wont have been done without her agreement. Making it very clear just how dangerous his behaviour is, is a good step to him getting whatever help he needs in the long run.

if the police feel this is a matter they need to be involved in.

It's your decision as to whether the school's response is good enough to safeguard your DD or whether you want to involve the police as well.

My DS was assaulted in school last year. The police did get involved and attended the school with the other child and the parents
Definitely worth reporting

.. and IMO this is bad enough that if the school don't involve the police, as a parent I would myself.

@chickenyhead

OK so because the police did nothing for you x years ago, you are going to let your child learn that this is ok?

I live on a different planet.

Clearly I do too.

I would call the police first.
Then call the school to inform them this is a police matter.

I cannot imagine doing anything else after someone would assault my child.

Astounding.

I'd call the police never mind the apology or the school

The police will get involved; but they may leave it to the school to deal in the first instance. However, given that there has been more than one incident, they may act in this case.

Most schools would (temporarily) exclude for this sort of behaviour - no tolerance policy.

Ask for an urgent meeting with the headteacher, head of year and class teacher, to discuss how they are going to safeguard your child and make absolutely 100% certain there is no repetition. Before the meeting download copies of their bullying and discipline policies and ask them to explain to you precisely how they operated them in this case.

If possible, take someone with you to take detailed notes and prepare minutes afterwards recording everything that has been agreed. If you can't take someone with you, record the meeting. If the outcome of the meeting isn't satisfactory, enter a formal complaint and take it to the governors.

I would see a 12 year old putting hands around other children's throats to be really serious and an indication that he needs help and that at some point he might really hurt someone. He either has no clue how to behave, or he is doing it on purpose - either way not ok for a 12 year old. I really think it sounds like he needs help and I would not want my dd around him at all.

I might be overreacting, but that is definitely how I'd be seeing it. I would go in an talk to the head face to face about it and if I weren't satisfied remove my dc.

I have heard pretty awful things about the Kent grammar school, incidentally - too high pressure, counterproductively so, and pastoral care absolutely terrible. Again, not sure if that is right or not.

Formal complaint to the police. A formal letter to the Headteacher, copy in the local authority education welfare department. Alarm bells should be ringing about the boy. That level of abuse must come from something, and safeguarding inquiries should be made about his background. He is a bomb waiting to go off, and needs to be in treatment for what emotional-behavioural disorder underpins this conduct. If nothing is done by the school, consider consulting with a solicitor qualified in family law (with specialism in abuse/ child-welfare issues). There maybe civil remedies that provoke the school to act upon this.

I have heard pretty awful things about the Kent grammar school, incidentally - too high pressure, counterproductively so, and pastoral care absolutely terrible. Again, not sure if that is right or not

All of them? Kent isn't a tiny county and it has a lot of grammar schools.

all we know is that the mother says things like 'boys will be boys'

The mother - and father! - might like to be reminded that in a couple of years time, their “boy” will be deemed of an age of criminal responsibility for assault.

@CopperBear

I'm skeptical of this because, as a teacher, we're absolutely NEVER permitted to tell a parent what discipline or measure has been taken against any student (other than their own child). Flat out, I have never, ever, ever seen a parent told of another students' disciplinary measures (nor would you be told of their SEN or additional needs) or what their mother says Where are you getting your information from for this? Regardless, a school cannot force a student to do or say anything - we cannot force an apology unfortunately. Everyone, including students, have a human right to freedom of expression and we have no power to make them apologise for anything (no matter how awful their behaviour was). There are very few options here to be honest: 1. isolate the student outside of the school - often not an option because they won't engage or are at danger at home. School must provide a teaching environment to students and if they won't engage at home then, because schools have an obligation to provide education, they'd need to be on school site. Additionally, many students come from abusive or negligent households and sending them home risks their welfare. 2. isolate them in school - this is what they did. 3. Permanently exclude them - this is a nightmare. It requires many, many, many documented incidents and co-operation with a whole host of people and organisations. Schools cannot just kick out a student - they have to go somewhere and that somewhere is paid for by the school, meaning less funding for everyone else.

I was also told of the other child's punishment too, when my DD was punched for no reason last year.

I feel it is needed to know at least the basics, as I have tbh had they had not have dealt with it appropriately I would have gone to the police.

I hope you get this sorted OP. I agree with others that an empty sorry will not mean much but it may be worth seeking advice from governors etc., in relation to how this is being dealt with.

Brefugee

So because paperwork a violent boy gets to stay on school? Blimey

It is clear that you have no idea just how much "paperwork" has to be accumulated to be able to to exclude a pupil. Even a violent one.

@looptheloopinahulahoop

I have heard pretty awful things about the Kent grammar school, incidentally - too high pressure, counterproductively so, and pastoral care absolutely terrible. Again, not sure if that is right or not

All of them? Kent isn't a tiny county and it has a lot of grammar schools.

@looptheloopinahulahoop No just one, ha - I didn't realise that there were many, it was always referred to as "the Kent grammar school" by the people talking about it, all of whom moved their dc.

Through my work I hear lots of cases of domestic violence and in almost every case one of the acts of violence has been strangling. It really sounds as if this young person needs to be stopped in their tracks so that he doesn't hurt any more of his peers and doesn't go on to be an abuser to future partners. An apology is no good.
Contact chair of governors, police and perhaps mention contacting ofsted with a complaint. That often gets attention.

You may not agree with this but if you could find- pay a few older boys to ruffle this bullies feathers with a know message if he touches your kid or others again he will really not know this week from next. TBH I would take matters into my own hands and go see the mother! Report to the police if your not one to confront them.

@pumpkintree

You may not agree with this but if you could find- pay a few older boys to ruffle this bullies feathers with a know message if he touches your kid or others again he will really not know this week from next. TBH I would take matters into my own hands and go see the mother! Report to the police if your not one to confront them.

Please don't do this your kids don't need to learn that violence is an acceptable solution

As others have said definitely police for 3 reasons :-

1. Its a serious assault, a criminal matter and needs to be treated as such.
2. Strangling is usually learnt behaviour. It should trigger a safeguarding referral to find out what this boy has been exposed to.
3. This sounds like a pattern of behaviour with your daughter targeted. It has to stop for her, now, and when he repeats this behaviour in a relationship and tells her he's sorry and he's never done it before the police will have this on file to give her the information she needs to, hopefully, leave him.

NameChange2PostThis
@SpeedRunParent I suggest you also invoke safeguarding procedures at the school for your DC but also for the boy who has done this. A teenage boy strangling another child and calling her a slag is a red flag warning that he has learnt this abusive behaviour from watching porn (via abusive/neglectful parenting) or from seeing it acted out at home. Insist the perpetrator is referred to social services for a safeguarding assessment.

fridgepants
The kid could as easily have copied it from Bart being strangled by Homer in The Simpsons - something which always makes me uneasy to see in even the newer episodes.

@fridgepants remind me in which episode Homer calls Bart a slag.

@SpeedRunParent as other posters have confirmed this behaviour is a red-flag for abuse. I appreciate your DD is your primary concern, but this boy is exhibiting dangerous learnt behaviours. His mother’s apparent attitude suggests she condones this type of behaviour - another red flag. A safeguarding referral to police/social services would be doing him a favour - and might help create a safer environment at school for your DD.

When my daughter was repeatedly attacked by a boy at school I tried everything within my power with the teachers, governors and even the L.A to stop it.
In the end I cornered him and his mum as they were getting into their car one day and told them very calmly and coldly (probably without blinking for added freakish rage) that if anything was to happen to my child again that I knew where they lived, where the mum worked, what their pets were and said “I will ruin you. I will kill your cat, I will hurt you both and I will inflict every bit it pain and upset you have inflicted on my daughter on you tenfold. You have no idea what I’m capable of”.

Extreme I know, but it did the trick. And to an extent I was willing to follow through with it and they knew it (bar the killing the cat obviously, I would never hurt an animal). The cold, calm animalistic rage i felt is like nothing I’ve ever felt before or since.

I also gave my daughter my unreserved permission to fight back in anyway she felt necessary and I would not punish her.
I would not have her being victimised. Luckily it never came to that, but I would not have punished her at all if she had done something extreme back to him.

ASD and ADHD springs to mind.
But that is no excuse. You need to be shouting loudly and requesting meetings etc. Take it higher if you need too. Unacceptable

@cherrybonbons

ASD and ADHD springs to mind. But that is no excuse. You need to be shouting loudly and requesting meetings etc. Take it higher if you need too. Unacceptable

Home with domestic violence springs to mind. The kid who did this to my daughter came from a violent home. It's learned behaviour, not neurodivergence.

Honestly, I would put this into the hands of the police. That is an outrageous level of violence. God help any future GF .

Being choked is a massive red flag in domestic violence and is taken very seriously by the police, I remember seeing somewhere.
It is a very quick way to kill someone.

I can't get my head around not taking it seriously.

I wouldn't give a damn for an apology.

This is 100% a police matter.