To move away and leave elderly in-laws behind?

[Summerplans7]

DH’s company has been talking to him about the chance of a transfer abroad. His job is perfectly safe here in the U.K., but the opportunity abroad is a country we have both always wanted to live in (although with Covid restrictions almost impossible to get to at the moment), but it would take us far from his elderly parents.

His mother would be devastated as she is close to our children and has been lonely over the last few years due to Covid, and the health of his his father has declined severely (he has dementia and isn’t really “there” anymore). I feel guilty even considering it. So does DH.

Do you think it would be selfish to go? It would be selfish of course, I know, but these chances only come around once in a lifetime (for us anyway).

All the restrictions have made us crave an adventure more than ever. The country we are considering is also frequently on the top of the list for qualify of life, and places to raise children, making it more tempting. And I have a good friend who lives there, so it wouldn’t be totally alien.

MIL wouldn’t want to come, even if FIL wasn’t unwell, so that’s not an option. She has a lot of friends and a community here and doesn’t intend to ever leave her area. She is actually pushing us to move nearer (we’re not far at the moment), has even suggested we all move in together (not an option for me).

Your MIL also has choices open to her, whether she chooses to take them is up to her.
She is the carer of someone of advanced age with dementia. What choices does she have open to her? It's even tough getting paid help to pop out to the shops. When FIL dies, she may have more choices open to her, although she may have sacrificed her health looking after her husband.

Really hard decision. I think a lot depends on where you are actually going. I took a job in the US when I was in my 30s, which was quite hard for my mum as I'm an only child, and I always thought I might come back, but I didn't. For me, east coast US was the furthest I was willing to go - on a good day, it's 12 hours door to door from my US home to my English home and I was lucky enough to have time and money to come back and see my mum several times a year before she died (couldn't attend funeral cos of the pandemic, which was awful.) Australia, where there were brilliant opportunities, just seemed too far away, and too expensive to come back often. The pandemic has made everything much harder now and honestly, if I were starting out now, I'm not sure I would do it.

I think it comes down to how your DH feels about being far away from his parents as they age and decline in health. You’ve been through the death of one parent (my condolences), perhaps you need to think hard about what it would have really felt like to have been far away from her in the final years you had together. I speak from experience. I moved to Asia when my Mum was in her sixties (Dad had died 10 years or so previously) and she was quite fit and had a new partner. Sadly her partner died suddenly and then she got cancer and also died two years later. I dealt with all that from the other side of the world. Fortunately my brother was closer to her and I owe him a lot for being there to give that constant support. Eight or so years down the line I am back in the U.K. and looking at that whole period in hindsight- the emergency flight to the U.K. when she took a sudden turn for the worse, calling my SIL from a stopover in Dubai not knowing if she was already dead, visiting her after her terminal diagnosis and not going back to the airport not knowing if I would ever see her again. But the thing that is saddest is how little time I spent with her in her final years compared to the experience my brother had. On the other hand I did really well at work, had an amazing time, she came to visit a few times and I would not have met my husband if I had stayed in the U.K. Also Mum wanted me to go and expressly told me not to stay for her sake. It is a really really hard decision to make, especially when it’s all theoretical as we never know really how health and life will pan out. Now that I have a child and my inlaws a only a few hours away and getting older, I would find it very hard to up sticks and go back to Asia, with the benefit of hindsight. But I fully understand the draw of a new exciting life and work opportunity abroad. And one thing that is better now that was less good when I lived abroad is Zoom and the ability to share experiences instantly by WhatsApp. I think that would have made me feel much closer to my Mum if we had had that.

This is so hard - and really only a choice that you and your OH can make. I can completely see why the idea of moving abroad is appealing, but personally I think that it's the people that make places. Being somewhere with a family that love you, and that you love is priceless for me. The prospect of sunny weather and lovely views (or whatever the USP is of the location) can sometimes blind us to all of the blessings that we have right here.

If you’re talking far away then you’d be exceptionally selfish. The choice would not only be deeply damaging to the PILs, it would also be damaging to the sister who would have to make up the slack. And you’d be moving with the knowledge that your husband and children might never see parents/GPS again as you’re too far away for regular visits. You’d be choosing to cut family ties for the sake of ???. Grass is always greener, the whole “moving for quality of life” thing is BS when you’re taking about one first world country with great education to another. We’re not in Aleppo!

You say the GPs have good relationships with your kids. Have you considered that they kids might want to retain these wider family relationships?

I think people should be selfish about their lives, but at the right time. You’re choosing a. Time when it looks more like you’re fleeing a dying man and an old lady who needs support. You missed the chance, or need to wait until timing is better.

This is a hard one.

For me, I am perhaps abnormally cold and selfish when it comes to my family, which made it easier for me to decide my duty lay with my husband and children and their best interests, not with supporting my extended family. There are very firm reasons behind that, which I will not go into.

I love my mother, I miss my mother, but I have never, since I left home, lived less than six hours away, and now it's 40 hours and 12,000 miles away. I'm okay that my sister and her kids are the ones providing the material physical support to our extremely healthy and active 83 year old mother. I do provide emotional support by calling weekly - every day while they were in lockdown. She and my sister and her family have always been very enmeshed, and it's a mutually beneficial arrangement.

It's harder for DH, even though he's actually originally from the UK and his family emigrated to NZ when he was three - leaving his grandmother in a care home with no children left in the country. He's got a lot better relationship with his mother and his brother, and does feel a degree of guilt, even though she encouraged us to go, especially since she's not as fit and healthy as my Mum. However, she was already living with his sister, and with his brother, moving between the two. He hasn't lived at home since the age of 13.

It's not easy, especially at the moment. We haven't been home in three years, because our trip last year was cancelled due to the pandemic. If something happened that meant we really needed to get our hineys over there, we can't. This is not going to change in the foreseeable future. You do grow even further apart from your family, and have to accept that, and be able to own your responsibility for that, to accept that there may be a great deal of resentment and frustration, even anger, at the impacts on those left behind of the choices you have made. You have to accept and own the guilt that you may have to feel as a result of the consequences of the choices you have made.

@WinterIsGone

Your MIL also has choices open to her, whether she chooses to take them is up to her. She is the carer of someone of advanced age with dementia. What choices does she have open to her? It's even tough getting paid help to pop out to the shops. When FIL dies, she may have more choices open to her, although she may have sacrificed her health looking after her husband.

This. Total BS people trying to act like the MIL should just abandon the husband in need of serious care! Christ, didn’t realise “live your life to the full” meant “abandon your loved ones at time of need”…

It's clear you want to go but the key decision maker is surely your DH. My DM was insistent that I live my own life and actually made it very difficult for me to help her when I suspected she needed it. She thought she was doing the right thing for me but I actually feel horrendous guilt now she's gone and there have been knock-on effects in other relationships. I'd be very wary of the path your DH might be choosing.

@Flowers500

Live your life to the fullest means take opportunities as they come. It's on offer now. Not in 5, 10 or 20 years.

My PIL were absolutely heartbroken and never got over it when SIL and kids moved to Aus. Even though they were in reasonable health when they left they declined quickly, and both died within 5 years of the move. They only saw them 2 more times after they left.
SIL had to watch her fathers funeral on a live stream because of covid. DH had to nurse his father through terminal cancer, whilst he was grieving his wife. Taking time off for appointments, daily chemo sessions, doing and sorting out personal care. Sorting out POA, probate and all the stuff after the deaths on his own. Hard doesn’t even come into it. It’s difficult not to be bitter towards SIL for that.

Did your MIL stay and live nearby her own parents when raising her family?

I think you should go but ensure you have enough money to come back relatively regularly, contribute towards their care and ensure lots of communication e.g Zoom. You could even send DC back for holidays.

I actually moved closer to my family despite not being particularly involved but elderly parents are a worry. My in-laws moved further away, despite ignoring cognitive issues. It's caused a major deterioration in symptoms and other parent can't manage but won't get help. You have to be very hard (not always a bad thing as guilt sucks) not to worry about them.

I'd normally say go but really it's a PITA being miles away and it may be a case of "great opportunity, wrong time."

Do the thing you'll be able to live with in 10/20 years time.

Who knows how long your FIL may have - it could be another decade. Your MIL sounds quite a handful too, so personally I'd go for it. But ultimately I'd say it was whether your DH is comfortable with it. Life is too short to wait around for others, when in your MIL's case she's certainly not considering you. only her own perspective.

@Summerplans7

Have you spoken to them. If I was your mother in law I would be mortified if I felt you were curtailing your families quality of life for my benefit.

We haven’t told anyone in real life yet, but I know she wouldn’t be supportive. She would be absolutely devastated that we were even considering it.

My DF would probably come with us, though!

I think she's being quite selfish to be honest. I'd be upset if i thought my kids were turning down opportunities because they felt they needed to stay and support me. Your MIL is asking you to change your lives to suit her.

I couldn't do that to my mum.. She's given her life to bring me up. I could move away but not abroad. Never know when I would see her next or what may happen in the future

Is it a country where you have lived or spent a significant amount of time in before? How easy is it to travel back (both during the pandemic and in more normal times)?

Both my siblings moved to Australia some years ago, at the time it didn't seem like a big deal but as my parents are approaching their 80s I realise that any physical support they might need is going to fall to me. At the moment they are still well enough to travel although the pandemic has put paid to that for now, but who knows how long that might last.

One of my family did this to her elderly mother. It meant that her brother bore the brunt of caring for the elderly mother as she became more frail and needed care. Her mother didn’t have dementia so was fully aware that she had a daughter living the other side of the world. The brother hasn’t spoken to his sister since their mother died 10 years ago.

I think it’s a selfish thing to do to your MIL while she is caring for FIL.

So your MIL wants to disrupt your DCs' schooling ?

That's selfish & totally unreasonable of her.

YANBU.... I'd feel bad going but it's not your mother and you aren't close.

It's really how much your DP can cope with the guilt.

Your SIL might not be too happy either.

My brother went abroad and left siblings behind to cope with elderly parents. I did all the legwork etc which he knew I would yet he was still the golden child. Go figure!!!

This is very difficult and I know it won't seem perfect whichever you choose but personally I would let your DH decide but tell him in all honesty I would think it right to stay if it was my mum. I would never leave my mum if I were in that position however I am very close to her and it wouldn't just be from a sense of duty so it may not be quite the same for your DH.

@Birkie248

My PIL were absolutely heartbroken and never got over it when SIL and kids moved to Aus. Even though they were in reasonable health when they left they declined quickly, and both died within 5 years of the move. They only saw them 2 more times after they left. SIL had to watch her fathers funeral on a live stream because of covid. DH had to nurse his father through terminal cancer, whilst he was grieving his wife. Taking time off for appointments, daily chemo sessions, doing and sorting out personal care. Sorting out POA, probate and all the stuff after the deaths on his own. Hard doesn’t even come into it. It’s difficult not to be bitter towards SIL for that.

This is so sad.

I'm surprised by so many 'just go' comments. When did people stop caring about vulnerable relatives.

When dc have a close relationship with their dgp that's what you put first. That relationship, not what snazzy expat package a job offers.

[quote DeathStare]@BarbarianMum She can choose to move house if she wishes. She can choose to move area if she wishes. I'm not suggesting she dies - there are very good reasons why that might be difficult for her. But it is a choice.

It also might be possible for her and FIL to go to the country that the OP is going to (a friend emigrated to Australia and it was surprisingly easy to take her parents - one of whom had dementia). The OP says MIL wouldn't want that, but it would still be her choice.[/quote]
Am I the only one lolling at "I'm not suggesting she dies"

I don't believe that anyone who is saying it is okay to go has actually been through the situation of having elderly parents, one of whom has dementia.

My parents were in this situation a few years ago. They lived in a small village with fantastic friends and neighbours, sympathetic GP and brilliant carers but there is absolutely no way my Dad would have coped at all without me living ten minutes away.

The idea that you could provide the care and support needed via Zoom is laughable.

Your DH needs to discuss this with his DM and see what her reaction will be.

Do it! If Covid has taught us one thing it’s that life’s for living. You can be selfish it’s a fantastic opportunity, grab it with both hands.

Nobody can tell you what to do, as you can only be guided by your own mind.

I wouldn't do it. I had an aunt who relocated overseas and couldn't come back when my nanna was dying. She's never really made her peace with that.