To move away and leave elderly in-laws behind?

[Summerplans7]

DH’s company has been talking to him about the chance of a transfer abroad. His job is perfectly safe here in the U.K., but the opportunity abroad is a country we have both always wanted to live in (although with Covid restrictions almost impossible to get to at the moment), but it would take us far from his elderly parents.

His mother would be devastated as she is close to our children and has been lonely over the last few years due to Covid, and the health of his his father has declined severely (he has dementia and isn’t really “there” anymore). I feel guilty even considering it. So does DH.

Do you think it would be selfish to go? It would be selfish of course, I know, but these chances only come around once in a lifetime (for us anyway).

All the restrictions have made us crave an adventure more than ever. The country we are considering is also frequently on the top of the list for qualify of life, and places to raise children, making it more tempting. And I have a good friend who lives there, so it wouldn’t be totally alien.

MIL wouldn’t want to come, even if FIL wasn’t unwell, so that’s not an option. She has a lot of friends and a community here and doesn’t intend to ever leave her area. She is actually pushing us to move nearer (we’re not far at the moment), has even suggested we all move in together (not an option for me).

I would go. MIL sounds like she will be fine. If she is well off and really devastated she would go, and she can afford the holidays

The level of assumed obligation on children in this thread is astounding.

Yes, it's a very dated, privileged paradigm full of smug virtue signalling. That it's morally superior to stay near family all your life. 'Family is most important' and that people who move for work, to afford cost of living, to better themselves so they can hopefully avoid poverty, afford to have kids, etc. are somehow less than.

I'm glad my family isn't like this.

The fact is, it’s a tough decision because there is no right or wrong answer. It’s not clear cut.
There’s nothing selfish about pondering a good opportunity and weighing up pros and cons.
What about couples from different countries who have to decide which home country to live in? Ultimately one set of parents is going to miss living near their child. It doesn’t make anyone selfish.
Life is full of decisions.

@Penistoe

I would go. MIL sounds like she will be fine. If she is well off and really devastated she would go, and she can afford the holidays

You haven’t read the thread, have you? MiL is caring for her husband with dementia. How can she uproot her life to follow her son? Holidays indeed, she’s probably forgotten such things exist.

'You haven’t read the thread, have you? MiL is caring for her husband with dementia. How can she uproot her life to follow her son? Holidays indeed, she’s probably forgotten such things exist.'

It's awful isn't it. People count more than places.

I mean if the op said they aren't close fine, but to actually have grandparents that have a close relationship then fuck off chasing dreams of beaches and expat perks seems so shallow and fickle tbh. Just to on holiday op

@osbertthesyrianhamster

The level of assumed obligation on children in this thread is astounding.

Yes, it's a very dated, privileged paradigm full of smug virtue signalling. That it's morally superior to stay near family all your life. 'Family is most important' and that people who move for work, to afford cost of living, to better themselves so they can hopefully avoid poverty, afford to have kids, etc. are somehow less than.

I'm glad my family isn't like this.

This is categorically not about encouraging/making people stay close to family always and forever and in every scenario. It is about pondering whether it is the right thing to do to move NOW to another continent, at a particularly difficult stage of life for the OP's husband's parents when even the normal ability to travel back and forth is uncertain. I find your framing of this in terms of privelege is rather bizarre, it tends to be the MORE priveleged, educated etc who have lots of life choices who make the kind of ex-pat move being contemplated here. This family are not moving to escape war or poverty and yes, they may have a better life in some ways but whatever way you look at it, it is at a cost.

You should go. This is also what I would say to my own children. I would hate to think my family had turned down opportunities because of me. Canada is very easy to visit (usually).

I find it hilarious when randoms on the net take others so seriously . This is about a potentially much better way of life for the family. I'm so glad I don't have a family that put that first and doesn't do guilt. Whole lot of posts about how 'selfish' the OP is.

How wonderful your df sounds that he will move with you. He sounds lovely. 😍

Thank you! He really is. I am lucky!

You haven’t read the thread, have you? MiL is caring for her husband with dementia. How can she uproot her life to follow her son? Holidays indeed, she’s probably forgotten such things exist

OP says they are wealthy and he is soon to go into a care home.

@theleafandnotthetree

We get it - you wouldn't want to move away and you wouldn't want your kids to move away. But the thread is not about you - people are different and have different kinds of relationships with their family.

My relative has never regretted moving his family to Canada.

Could they go too or do they need healthcare etc in this country?

@osbertthesyrianhamster

I find it hilarious when randoms on the net take others so seriously . This is about a potentially much better way of life for the family. I'm so glad I don't have a family that put that first and doesn't do guilt. Whole lot of posts about how 'selfish' the OP is.

Why be so defensive. If you're happy with your life and distant family relationships with crap facetime chats, fine.

The op asked for opinions so she's had them. It is voluntary y'know. No one is forcing her to post and ask 🙄

Imo grandparents are more important than overseas job perks but that's just me. HTH.

Why are you "managing" your DH relationship with his mother?

I think you need to step back. It will be your DH decision and if you hadn't been so instrumental in making your DH have contact with MIL how close would they really be?

Sadly if she's all about the DGC give it another 5-7 years and they will probably have distanced themselves from her anyway.

Also she may then come and visit and live with you for 4/6 weeks at a time out in Canada - how would you all cope with that?

OP says they are wealthy and he is soon to go into a care home.
You would have to be very heartless indeed to move away, leaving your own DH in a care home. My dad had dementia. My mum (who was very heartless) would still visit him every day, and always there was some problem to resolve, things going missing, care being forgotten etc etc.

Maybe pop along to the elderly parents section, and you will see the reality of being a carer.

[quote TatianaBis]@theleafandnotthetree

We get it - you wouldn't want to move away and you wouldn't want your kids to move away. But the thread is not about you - people are different and have different kinds of relationships with their family.

My relative has never regretted moving his family to Canada.[/quote]
Actually, I would move away in the right circumstances and I wouldn't mind in the least (would be delighted for them indeed) if my children moved away, again in the right circumstances. This just seems to be a PARTICULARLY bad time for the OP's family to move, I think even if Covid/travel restrictions weren't in the frame it would make a difference. And the OP did ask for opinions, mine are as legitimate as anyone elses!

@WinterIsGone

OP says they are wealthy and he is soon to go into a care home. You would have to be very heartless indeed to move away, leaving your own DH in a care home. My dad had dementia. My mum (who was very heartless) would still visit him every day, and always there was some problem to resolve, things going missing, care being forgotten etc etc.

Maybe pop along to the elderly parents section, and you will see the reality of being a carer.

Indeed, it's not as if the MIL can put her husband in a home, give a whoop of joy and then sprint for freedom, holidays etc as if he were dead. He will still have needs and she will still be his wife and NOK. Money really can't be used to solve every problem, well I guess it can of you don't allow feelings and empathy to come into it

@Summerplans7

Ultimately, I think it is for DH to decide. She isn’t my mother and we aren’t close like that - although I know she wishes we were.

Before my mother died, I wouldn’t have been able to leave her. And I know my DF is supportive, even when the original plan was Aus.

I also know MIL would not be giving any blessing and would be terribly upset. If we don’t go, we plan to take time off over next summer with the kids, DH causally mentioned it to MIL, like no big deal, and she got very upset that we are planning to take the children “for the whole summer”.

I think it’s difficult for DH as he’s only gotten closer to his mother now, but he doesn’t ring her for a chat or pop over or anything, he has to be cajoled into doing that (by me). I think because of their previous poor relationship, perhaps.

I also think it’s difficult for MIL as she didn’t have the best relationship with her children when they were young, but has an amazing one with ours.

I’m not sure I would class that relationship as close if your DH has to be cajoled. into. ringing her.

Rather it looks like you’ve created something that looks like a good mother-son. Relationship when this isn’t the case. You’ve all been living a lie there.

The problem is that your MIL seems to be believing it.

I went through my parents decline and ultimate passing from a 3 hour trip away, including a ferry which can be tricky when traffic volumes are high.

Other siblings lived further away.

Frankly it was a nightmare. My Dad got sicker and sicker. He was my Mom's carer as she had dementia. They were determined nit to have help. I spent many weekends commuting back and forth. I cooked and froze meals. When Dad went into hospital I had to drop everything and go.

It was very stressful and emotional. Even when we moved them to a facility, I would get calls about the falling out of bed etc.

Needless to say this affected my work. I had weeks of unpaid leave.

I am telling you this to help inform your decision. I am not saying don't go, but think hard about how things might unfold. If you can get back easily and quickly that helps but it was a huge strain for me. I had a constant feeling of dread.

Take care and good luck.

Sadly if she's all about the DGC give it another 5-7 years and they will probably have distanced themselves from her anyway.

When DGC live close by that’s not my experience at all, in fact the opposite. My cousins who lived close to my DGM remained very close to her, particularly when they reached the age of doing independent visits, they were a huge help to her as she got older. I also see this with my Nieces and nephews who live close to my in laws.

But you can absolutely guarantee they will grow apart if they move overseas.

The problem is that your MIL seems to be believing it

The kids believe they have a good relationship with their grandparents. Is that a lie too?

I don't think it's about casting aside your hopes and dreams TBH and that seems like a one-sided way to look at it. We all have lots of hopes and dreams. For many people they include spending regular quality time with their family. So for lots of people they stay where they can see their family not because they are 'guilted into it' but because, when you balance up all their hopes and dreams that is what matters to them most. That, for me, is the reason why I'd never leave the UK. Neither would my sister, to whom I am very close. But, of course, that's not the same for everyone.

There's no reason why the dream of spending time with family should be a stronger pull than the dream to live in Canada for OP. Only the OP and her OH can decide that.

As a person with lots of family abroad, the only thing I'd caution is being actually realistic about how you can afford/ spare time to visit and how much family can do the same to visit you. I've had family move abroad with blazingly unrealistic expectations of this and then be hugely upset when actually no-one's visited in a decade as they can't afford it.

Be realistic about what emigration means (e.g. MIL pretty likely to die without you being here, not able to really help her - other than potentially setting up care if she becomes ill - how much technology is really a replacement for actual contact - which depends of course on what you/ MIL actually enjoy about contact etc.). Then you can go in with your eyes open and make the best choice for you.

@bongbigboobingbongbing

My DB has recently announced his decision to swan off to Australia with his wife, without any discussion of the fact this will leave me caring for our elderly DP on my own. I love them dearly and do not begrudge helping them but it does boil my piss that he didn't even give that a second thought let alone have a conversation with me about it.

At the risk of restating what you already know, moving abroad does not just affect the people doing the move, it has a significant and lasting impact on those left behind. Personally I couldn't live with the guilt and it would ruin my experience of living there.

For those focusing so much on the OPs children....the children of siblings left behind may also have a bit of a raw deal if their parent is left with the dull work of caring for/supporting an elderly parent. I know a family with exactly this scenario, one set of cousins (Family A) are off living their best life in a glossy expat lifestyle while their cousins(Family B) have had to sacrifice a lot in terms of time with their mum, her need to use annual leave for caring responsibilities, plans being undone when there's a crisis etc. Not saying Family A shouldn't have gone but in their case they went knowing full well they were dropping their sibling and her family in it as things were already quite bad, don't acknowledge the sacrifice really, and when they come home, are more the 'let's all go out for afternoon tea' when what the remaining sibling would like is the equivelent of the wife work done for a couple of weeks. There are ways of doing these kind of ethically difficult things that is kind, respectful of everyone and that seeks to minimise the burden on those left behind.

@Forgothowmuchlhatehomeschoolin

What a dilemma but l wouldn't be able to do that if it was my mum....l felt bad moving to the other end of town when my dad was very ill. And now l couldn't move her grandchild away which is one of her pleasures in life. Only you can decide OP.

Or rather, OP's DH

@NakedAttraction

Sadly if she's all about the DGC give it another 5-7 years and they will probably have distanced themselves from her anyway.

When DGC live close by that’s not my experience at all, in fact the opposite. My cousins who lived close to my DGM remained very close to her, particularly when they reached the age of doing independent visits, they were a huge help to her as she got older. I also see this with my Nieces and nephews who live close to my in laws.

But you can absolutely guarantee they will grow apart if they move overseas.

I agree. My DMum has a lovely relationship with my nephews. They pop round for a drink or chat and will go shopping and help out. They are mid and late 20's. I had the same relationship with my Nana. It isn't gender or age related, but familiarity and contact. My Nana lived with us and she was my rock.