AIBU to ask if the Irish have to apply to stay in the UK post Brexit?

[Weetabixelly]

My in laws say that they have received a card through the post stating that the Irish have to apply to remain in the UK post Brexit. They are a bit vague on exactly who has sent this card.

They came from Southern Ireland to live in the UK in the early 1960s and have lived here ever since.

Looking online, it looks like the Irish don't have to apply for settled status?

When the Constitution named the country Ireland, it was referring to the entirety of the island, as that is what it claimed formed the country of Ireland. When this comes up on MN (weirdly I’ve never seen people get agitated by it in real life) I always think that when articles 2 and 3 were revoked, perhaps they should have renamed the country as now there exists a situation where Ireland can mean either the whole island, or just a part of it. Not sure that would go down too well though!

@Puppalicious yep and the EU state, comprising the 26 counties not including the 6 counties of NI is, as far as the European Commission and other European Governmental Authorities are concerned, definitely just “Ireland”.

In the original post the OP didn’t specify whether she was referring to a country or a general geographical area. Given her in laws came from cork area in the 60s it is very likely they have always said they came from Southern Ireland to differentiate the exact geographical area they were from. Someone from Galway might say they are from the west coast of Ireland.
She then in next sentence asked a direct question and in it referred to the Irish population as relevant to the question.

All the posters just decided themselves what the posters was saying and jumped all over that instead of just answering the bloody question.

It is also wrong to assume or imply that all citizens of any country think the same way, have the same political aspirations, or find the same things offensive.

So if there is only Ireland and Northern Ireland, why do so many people refer to "the North of Ireland"?
Should we ask them to stop doing so? 😗

why do so many people refer to "the North of Ireland"?
Should we ask them to stop doing so?
If they're referring to Donegal they'd be correct.
There is Republic counties in the North of Ireland 6 of 9 counties are under UK rule.
The other 3 are Republic.
Some older generation in the Republic refuse to recognise it as NI and will use the north of Ireland.

@looptheloopinahulahoop

It's always amazing on MN that someone will come on and decide that all Irish people think the same way and have the same opinions on everything.

Funnily enough, like British people, or any other nationality, they all have their own views. Fancy that.

To go back to the point of the thread, this sounds like a scam.

It's not an opinion though is it? Southern Ireland is Cork, Kerry etc. Ireland is the name of the country. That's just fact, what is there to have an opinion on?

Actually, Cork/Kerry people mostly tend to say they're from the 'south of Ireland', not 'Southern Ireland', just as someone from Galway would usually use 'the west of Ireland' rather than 'Western Ireland'. The name Southern Ireland, in particular, was a political term as much as a geographical one (it was part of the UK from 1920-21) and was usually avoided, even by people living in the south of the country. There are probably those who use the term, of course, but it is very unusual in Ireland.
Sorry OP, I know we're way off the point here.

*1921-1922

It's like calling England, Southern Scotland and ignoring any corrections.

@blubberyboo
No she didn't specify, however if someone was from Cork the vast majority would say they're from the South of Ireland, just like Dubliners would say the East of Ireland and people from Donegal would say the North of Ireland, Southern Ireland really isn't used by Irish people.

I don't see anyone that has implied everyone thinks the same / same political aspirations etc. It's not exactly an opinion, it's simply incorrect, and yes, perhaps some people wouldn't be offended, but if a large proportion are, for extremely valid reasons, surely you would understand and aim to not use it again or try to invalidate their feelings.

@Dutypaid

It's like calling England, Southern Scotland and ignoring any corrections.

It would be the same if England was actually called Scotland and Scotland was in reality called Northern Scotland. And even then it wouldn't be quite the same because England and Scotland are both part of the United Kingdom.

Northern Ireland and Ireland may both be part of the same island, but they are fully independent of one another.

@Crocodilesoup

So if there is only Ireland and Northern Ireland, why do so many people refer to "the North of Ireland"? Should we ask them to stop doing so? 😗

Maybe because Northern Ireland is in the North of Ireland, ACTUALLY, maybe it's because all of Ulster is in the North of Ireland. Maybe it's even because Malin Head, the most northerly part of Ireland, is actually located in Donegal!!!!! Who could have guessed 🙄.

When I moved to England from Ireland at the age of 8 I called it Southern Ireland. It was my British teachers who kept correcting me until I stopped. My family in Ireland still call it Southern Ireland 🤷🏻‍♀️

@TacoSunday

Using Southern Ireland instead of ROI is ignorant, and in my opinion, has the potential to be offensive. You only have to ask the people of Donegal.

Indeed. And I can’t believe we’re still having to have this conversation in 2021.

I've heard plenty of people use Southern Ireland or the South in casual conversation with other Irish people, distinguishing from the North. Ireland is the name of the state, but it's ambiguous in some contexts. The Republic works for disambiguation too of course.

I don't know anyone who'd be offended by use of the South / Southern outside a formal context - like back in the day when the Irish government used to refuse extraditions etc unless the British government used the right names.

@belleager
There's absolutely nothing wrong with 'the South / down South' if you're in NI and maybe going down to Offaly or similar, anyplace that is geographically south of you, just like someone in Galway might say they're going up North. Lot's of people say it, usually they are physically going south, depending where you are they might say 'we're going down South to Leitrim for a few days', with Donegal most usually say 'across to Donegal', again geographically correct.

It's only really Southern Ireland that is offensive when referring to the entirety of the ROI, Donegal, Galway, Meath, the majority of the counties just aren't in 'Southern Ireland' and due to it's historical connections, it is offensive.

Can see why people in Donegal might not like the terminology, absolutely, and the border counties maybe. But there are regions in Ireland where this is everyday use of language. And I find British people often use it for politeness, when trying to place me - i.e. not wanting to sound political with Republic in case my allegiances are elsewhere. Not their fault the names are complex. The (Great) Britain / UK distinction can be tricky too, and how many people get Holland / Netherlands right? We should cut each other slack.

I don't believe any Irish person would refer to their country of birth incorrectly.
Down south is okay if you're in NI.
Calling the Republic as a whole Southern Ireland is beyond rude.
Certain PP's always have Irish relations whom use these anti Irish phrases so in their opinion its fine.
I wonder have they misheard or are they lying.

@belleager
Maybe, however if someone from the Netherlands referred to it as 'Southern Ireland' most people wouldn't mind as it's just a mistake, they might correct them, or just let it go. You wouldn't expect them to know the meaning behind it.

I suppose if it's someone from the Britain you expect them to know, or at least acknowledge they've made a mistake. It's especially annoying, coming from an English person, if people argue as to why it is correct and inoffensive.

Out of curiosity where is it that you hear Southern Ireland used in conversation meaning the whole of Ireland?

Not lying, didn't mishear. Irish-born and resident myself. Do a search for the term on boards.ie - you have at least one thread debating the terminology but lots of casual, unremarked use of Southern Ireland too. Don't doubt your statement that there are people who find it offensive. You can construct an argument from history that it could be used with intent to offend. But lots of Irish people use this terminology happily and casually - no lie.

[quote 5566rfghh]@belleager
Maybe, however if someone from the Netherlands referred to it as 'Southern Ireland' most people wouldn't mind as it's just a mistake, they might correct them, or just let it go. You wouldn't expect them to know the meaning behind it.

I suppose if it's someone from the Britain you expect them to know, or at least acknowledge they've made a mistake. It's especially annoying, coming from an English person, if people argue as to why it is correct and inoffensive.

Out of curiosity where is it that you hear Southern Ireland used in conversation meaning the whole of Ireland?[/quote]
In Ireland

Midlands, West, Dublin.

I've spent less time further north and south - makes sense there could be regional differences

I did look on boards. And yes some do use it when referring to somewhere that is geographically south of them. However I didn't see much referring to the whole of the ROI, Donegal, even Galway as "Southern Ireland".

@belleager

Not lying, didn't mishear. Irish-born and resident myself. Do a search for the term on boards.ie - you have at least one thread debating the terminology but lots of casual, unremarked use of Southern Ireland too. Don't doubt your statement that there are people who find it offensive. You can construct an argument from history that it could be used with intent to offend. But lots of Irish people use this terminology happily and casually - no lie.

I have never heard anyone here in the West say it. In what context? I can't imagine someone saying Southern Ireland in conversation when referring to Ireland? It makes no sense for anyone to add a pointless word onto Ireland surely.Maybe, just maybe, if they were talking to someone who was born outside of Ireland but to another Irish person it would be bizarre?

I'm not saying you're lying but in what context have you heard this? My experience is entirely different, I'm from the West, live in the East and have never ever heard somebody from Ireland say Southern Ireland when they mean the Republic.

@Aloethere
Exactly