I was 15 he was 23

[Blissbiz]

I was 15 he was 23 and was my "boyfriend" for about 3 or 4 months although thinking back he was obviously sleeping with other people.
He is famous now, really famous and in the media alot.He didn't force me, actually I was flattered but now I can't stop thinking about it. My daughter is now 15 and I can't imagine her with someone this age or why he would want to be with her!
Do I need to just forget about it and move on, he doesn't come across as creepy or sleazy, quite the opposite in interviews but I'm struggling to see him without feeling angry.

@Naunet

Yeah it’s wrong OP, creepy as fuck. I slept with a 35 year old when I was 16 (and looked a lot younger). I thought I was mature, flattered by his attention, now I look back and cringe. I couldn’t imagine being attracted to a 16 year old at that age, it’s so predatory. He had a daughter just 2 years younger than me too 🤢

It must be weird to look back and realise it was very predatory. I think some take advantage of the younger person feeling flattered, needing to feel loved and wanted or even 'grown up' enough to attract an older person. In reality they are predatory and it's very odd.

When I was 15, many of the girls at school were shagging older boys. Only up to 20 or 21.
There was no grooming, the girls were chasing the boys!
Illegal, but was normal back then, and nobody thought the boys were paedophiles. None of them are famous, maybe that's the difference.

It's odd, my husband and I were saying this morning that Elvis was 24 when he got together with 14 year old Priscilla, yet neither of us ever heard anyone say that he was clearly a paedophile.
I never understand what a man in his twenties sees in a teenager apart from the sex. Most of them have little or no interesting conversation, because they have no life experience.

I think what you have to think about is is why a 20 odd year old man would want a 15 year old who might have not lost her virginity but she will be sexually inexperienced. Women his own age are more sexually experienced so their muscles would be lesser than a 15 year olds. When you put into context it is sickening.

@81Byerley

It's odd, my husband and I were saying this morning that Elvis was 24 when he got together with 14 year old Priscilla, yet neither of us ever heard anyone say that he was clearly a paedophile. I never understand what a man in his twenties sees in a teenager apart from the sex. Most of them have little or no interesting conversation, because they have no life experience.

Even more shocking is that child marriage is still allowed in some states in the US.

I haven't read the full thread, but I understand feeling triggered by seeing him. When we are teenagers, we don't understand that the relationships are inappropriate - only looking back.

I dated a 22 year old when I was 15, and a 33 year old when I was 18. Both made me feel really grown up and respected... but looking back I feel so icky. Again, neither forced me, but I was almost desperate for their approval and did whatever they wanted.

The 22 year old's friends actually stopped speaking to him when we got together as our relationship made them uncomfortable, at the time I thought they were horrible people but looking back I'm really impressed that they didn't just allow an inappropriate relationship to happen without saying anything (like A LOT of young men do). I bumped into one of them a couple of years ago with their mum at a garden centre and thanked her for raising a good man!

I had a 22yo boyfriend when I was 14 in 1984. It made me something of a celebrity at school. I don't think it was that normal.

I have no idea what he got from it, but we never did anything remotely sexual.

Such an interesting thread. Of course this is partly about the nature of consent as well as changing social attitudes. Even now though, the law says at 15 you are child and cannot consent to sexual activity, but overnight at 16 you can.

And I agree that the view of these sorts of relationships have changed over the decades. I've my own story from the 80's of a relationship at 16 with a 26+ year old friend of older sibling. Loads of my friends at the time went out with older guys from 14 onwards. It was normal in our friendship groups.

Has anyone seen the movie " The Tale" with Laura Dern in it? It's based on a true story of a woman realising her view of a past relationship at 13 with an older man was in fact grooming and child abuse and not a sweet coming of age story. Cleverly when you first see the flashbacks the girl playing her is older more like 18, as in her mind she was sophisticated and mature. Later the the adult character sees photo's of herself from that time and is shocked at how childlike and small she really was. The scenes from then on are played by a younger actress and it's far more disturbing. Really good exploration of the nature of memory and the stores we tell ourselves about the past. Laura Dern is fantastic in it too.

@81Byerley

It's odd, my husband and I were saying this morning that Elvis was 24 when he got together with 14 year old Priscilla, yet neither of us ever heard anyone say that he was clearly a paedophile. I never understand what a man in his twenties sees in a teenager apart from the sex. Most of them have little or no interesting conversation, because they have no life experience.

Look at the ‘perfect’ woman in most books, tv shows and films aimed at men. Particularly those made in the 80s and 90s. Physically tiny, slightly naive, needs protecting, defers to the man. Most women IRL are not like this. Teenagers are though.

I remember after my first time with him, I was nervous and hurt, he said he would mark me a grade E but would get me up to an A. Why I didn't kick him in the bollocks and walk out I have no idea. I cringed at the time but its so humiliating when I think about it.

The paedo apologists on this thread have left me open-mouthed. Just vile.

OP, I’m sorry for your trauma. What he did was wrong, and I hope you can work through it with the support of a therapist, then decide how you want to proceed x

Looking back were you actually groomed? It's okay other posters saying move on. Although he didn't force you does not mean he did not groom you.

The fact he knew you were 15 rings alarm bells for me.

I'm sorry you're affected by this and I hope you heal from this.

This situation is not okay x

It sounds as if he knew what he was doing.

@ElleAitch

The paedo apologists on this thread have left me open-mouthed. Just vile.

OP, I’m sorry for your trauma. What he did was wrong, and I hope you can work through it with the support of a therapist, then decide how you want to proceed x

Exactly my thoughts.

It wasn't unusual when I was young (I was a teen in late 80s/ early 90s). I went to a strict all girls grammar school and it was a badge of honour to get an older boyfriend. I'm ashamed to say bonus marks if he'd also been to prison. I have a daughter now and this makes me feel a bit ill.

As for the men themselves. I dated a 26 year old when I was 14. No full sex just snogging and a bit of groping. Only lasted a few weeks and he got bored with me which was just as well. I was hugely flattered and excited at the time but he was in fact decidedly odd. All his friends, male and female were teenagers. He popped up now and again wanting to be "friends" and as I grew to adulthood it dawned on me that he was actually very weird. After I met my husband he sent me a valentines card with naked photos of himself (prints; this was before digital cameras). I felt pretty horrified I'd once been proud he was my "boyfriend" and counted myself bloody lucky that I'd got out relatively unscathed. Very very odd person.

I also had a 26 year old boyfriend when I was 17 and that was a full on sexual relationship. I don't think of that as odd/weird at all. I also looked much older than I was (could have passed for 25) and was quite mature and stoical by then. Lads my own age seemed too boyish if that makes sense. I definitely don't feel I was "taken advantage of" in that relationship.

There's a world of difference between 14 and 17!

I only realised that I was groomed (and ultimately raped) by my abuser when I was an adult. I feel terrible now. Thinking about it, being an undiagnosed autistic, maybe the grooming and techniques that he used weren't obvious to me. The worst thing is that he was VERY old, much older than anyone has mentioned thus far. Sometimes I do blame myself because I should have known better.

When you are being psychologically manipulated as a teen though, you really don't understand why this is so bad.

I think the fact he knew you were 15 and met you first on your way to school are major red flags. Also him “grading you as an E” - that’s awful!

By contrast, at 15 I had a relationship with a 28 year old - but I pursued him, and I lied to him. I was an old looking 15 but told him I was a young looking 19. I had a fake drivers licence that I “accidentally” dropped from my wallet. I actually still feel very fondly towards him, but feel hugely guilty for the trouble he could have got into completely unknowingly.

@Blissbiz

I remember after my first time with him, I was nervous and hurt, he said he would mark me a grade E but would get me up to an A. Why I didn't kick him in the bollocks and walk out I have no idea. I cringed at the time but its so humiliating when I think about it.

Eww, what a vile pig. So sorry OP.

@579qkghs

Giving away my age here, but I was 16 in 1996 and it was certainly not acceptable then. Yes, it happened and still happens but everyone knew it was creepy and wrong.

I'm a similar age to you and I remember the SCANDAL in our all girls school when on of our 16 year old classmates was with a 28 year old. They're married now.

@Blissbiz

I remember after my first time with him, I was nervous and hurt, he said he would mark me a grade E but would get me up to an A. Why I didn't kick him in the bollocks and walk out I have no idea. I cringed at the time but its so humiliating when I think about it.

Think I'd be tempted to report him for that alone, the vile pig.

Bullet dodged, though.

Just for context Diana Spencer was born in 1961 Prince Charles was born in 1948.
Was obviously perfectly acceptable at the time to the royal family

@Blissbiz

Yes he knew I was 15 I first met him on the way to school! I'm not sure why I'm angry now, I suppose because my daughter is 15 and I would definitely not want this happening. I can see why a 15 year old would fancy a 23 year old but why would a 23 year old man think that it was OK. I suppose because he's on the telly coming across as a family man it annoys me, I've never read anything bad about him and I was wondering what other people's views were really. I'd like to name and shame him but I wouldn't want to bring the hassle on myself but I do wonder if it was a 1 off of if he has slept with lots of underage girls. I also wasn't sure if this was normal back then, it didn't seem strange to me, I felt quite flattered to be honest.

I spent a lot of time working in forensic roles..

Men rarely ONLy have sex with underage girls once... (and that's if it is a 'genuine' mistake-thinl girl in nightclub rather than in school uniform walking to school..).

Sadly you'll be one of many... Its compulsive in men who want to fuck children... This is what you were...

I know its not what you asked but please consider reporting this to police...given his high profile, its likely other victims have come forward... Yours may be the evidence that tips this into a prosecution..

I look back and think about now - I can only explain by times have changed.

We dressed up, we lied to get into nightclubs, we met older young men. It wasn't an issue.

Does it also sit with the information ( not even sure if it is true?) that girls mature more quickly than boys. Were we looking for a similar level,of maturity to ourselves?

Although I met young men, I actually didn't sleep with anyone until I was 20 because I respected me.

With operation yewtree, as you know, many previously thought of 'family men' have been prosecuted for raping children

@Starisnotanumber

Just for context Diana Spencer was born in 1961 Prince Charles was born in 1948. Was obviously perfectly acceptable at the time to the royal family

I don’t think the royals are great people to look to, to guide society! They did a virginity check on her too, but that wasn’t something men generally put their fiancé’s through back then.