My Pregnancy, My Wine and DH.

[ThymeCrisis]

I’ve namechanged for this but I’ve been around a long time.

Last night DH and I went out for dinner. I’m 6 months pregnant. It was a lovely local Italian place and he ordered a Peroni, I ordered a glass of Prosecco. It was fairly late because he’d watched the first half of the football in the pub after work first, and I’d joined him later, so he’d already had a fair few pints beforehand.

For context, I have been having the odd (125ml) glass of wine or champagne or Prosecco approx once a week (occasionally twice, but I wouldn’t have two drinks on the same night) since I was 16 weeks or so. I felt too ropey before that to contemplate it. Always have the drink with food, always sip very slowly. I was big into wine before I got pregnant and after doing a lot of research (I do have the Emily Oster book but I read lots more research and have come to the conclusion that it’s a negligible ‘risk’ on such a small scale and felt comfortable with my decision. We are talking 1.5 units here.

DH was a bit quiet after I ordered the Prosecco. We had a nice meal and walked home, he then made himself a gin and tonic, and I had a fake version with an M&S seedlip rip off. I asked him if he was ok and why he’d been a bit off. He then said he had ‘come to terms’ with me having the odd drink at home but he’d felt really uncomfortable with me ordering anything alcoholic out in public, because I was visibly pregnant, and he was really worried about what other people in the restaurant were thinking.

I didn’t notice any judgement, and never have, but frankly I wouldn’t care if there was. He also reminded me of the time we had some family round and I had a glass of champagne, and said he’d felt unhappy about it then too.

The reasons he is giving are that he knows of no one who drank in pregnancy (bar our own mothers who drank according to the guidelines in the mid 80’s at the time) and he thinks a big reason I do it is to ‘challenge’ the patriarchy and to go against the rules, not because I truly fancy a glass of wine. This is bullshit but I have ranted before about pregnant woman being infantilised and deemed not capable of critical thought. We don’t really actually know many other friends that have gone through pregnancy either, but he maintains they would have cut out all alcohol. Yes I know what the NHS guidelines say but I’m of the opinion that they say ‘none at all’ because it’s safer than ‘trusting’ women to not underestimate the units in a glass of wine etc or use it as an excuse to binge. Which I would absolutely never do. I know what a unit is.

For what it’s worth I’ve cut down, but not eliminated, caffeine, and I eat soft cheese and Parma ham too, and I have my steak rare or medium-rare.

He is now saying that the drinking is not something he’s comfortable with anymore and just because I have a book that says it’s fine I just have no way to know if we’ve put our unborn son at risk or not, and if he was pregnant he wouldn’t touch a drop. He can’t handle me ordering a drink in public anymore as it just makes him feel too uncomfortable- it didn’t so much when I didn’t have a bump but he hates the fact that ‘people are judging and looking at us’ now that I do.

I fully expect to get some replies about how he’s right and I am being reckless with my pregnancy, and that it’s only 9 months and why can’t I just cut it out all together, and the answer is, I had weighed up or thought I’d weighed up, whether I truly I had to, and considered myself to be in very safe limits. I like the taste of good wine and the foods it goes with. Yes I’ve tried alcohol free wine and it’s rank, I’d be more likely to cut everything out than drink pretend versions.

So I’ve just woke up this morning upset that he’s had all these thoughts about me causing harm to our baby (for what it’s worth I had a miscarriage before this pregnancy, and I know that was not down to alcohol as I hadn’t drunk at all as I lost it in the first trimester, so it didn’t affect my decision to have the odd drink in this pregnancy) and also that he’s inflicting other peoples judgments on me and just generally making me feel really bad. He’s said that if the child has behavioural difficulties down the line then he can’t rule out that it could be down to drinking.

So hit me with it- am I being unreasonable?

But he's not pregnant. I don't know why people insist on making this comparison - it's very odd ime.

I think it's just that if he had offered - whether or not the OP agreed - it would show some consideration for her position and how more difficult it is to do if others around are drinking for those that enjoy drinking socially.

To not even seem to take his own drinking into consideration and get on this high horse after a few seems a bit much.

He’s said that if the child has behavioural difficulties down the line then he can’t rule out that it could be down to drinking.

I was exposed to alcohol and more than a few other drugs while in-utero, my mother was very proud of how she continued her partying and how supposedly people were unable to tell she was pregnant weeks before I was born (to be taken with a cup of salt) - and this annoyed me.

Behaviour is only a part of the issues that can be caused by drinking, and they're among the hardest to tease out if it's just the alcohol exposure or the many other potential factors involved or a combination of things.

There are many other physical and cognitive risks that are easier to make a direct link that I might have had more sympathy for if he'd brought it up -- like if he'd said memory problems or joint issues (both things that are less common and more directly linked, though other factors can be involved too). I'd take issue with the idea he seems to be pre-empting already that any behavioural problems are your fault and - having been that child - that he may dismiss the behaviour problems that way and not take it or other concerns seriously. I had some adults say things to the tune of it being expected with what my mother did during pregnancy which meant I was just left with it largely outside of some schools which put some support in place.

I'm not saying harm has been done, research in this area has to be done retrospectively (it would be unethical to do otherwise) which means we will always have gaps to our understanding, but his focus on the behavioural sides would be a concern for me, as would his lack of consideration of his own behaviour.

And yeah, if he has an issue with people judging now, it's only going to get worse no matter what you do.

@PlanDeRaccordement not that it’s your business, but we don’t drive. But 1.5 units of alcohol doesn’t constitute drunk driving in England.

That should be less common in children, compared to behavioural issues, and more directly linked with drug exposure though other factors can come into it.

...especially if I smoke them "slowly"!

@ThymeCrisis

It’s also not what I said or anywhere near, *@PlanDeRaccordement*

For context, I have been having the odd (125ml) glass of wine or champagne or Prosecco approx once a week (occasionally twice, but I wouldn’t have two drinks on the same night) since I was 16 weeks or so.

So, you didn’t drink at all the first 16 weeks?
You do know alcohol gets progressively more risky the later in the pregnancy you use it?

The responses here are really interesting. I wonder if posters would disagree with the OP more if she wasn't so articulate? The post reads like a well constructed argument. What might the responses be like if she simply said 'i drink once a week in pregnancy as I don't believe it will cause any issues.'

My two pennies worth is I wouldn't, and didn't drink as I'm really risk adverse and it therefore wouldn't have been enjoyable for me. But everyone's different with levels of risk. I also think you asked him what was wrong and he gave you an answer. I think there is research out there to support both of your view points, which demonstrates it's not entirely conclusive? It does read like you've researched to justify your choice, rather than researched to make a decision? Is that a fair assessment?

I also think you are going to get replies here which might be upsetting, it's divisive.

I might say that one glass at Christmas or for a special occasion was acceptable during pregnancy but you're having one or two glasses a week. That's a lot for a developing baby to have to contend with. I've seen, in a professional capacity, the effects on children of women drinking not much more than you during pregnancy. Of course many, many women go on to have seemingly healthy babies, but there are a handful of ones that don't. Do you want to take that risk, just because a book says what you want to hear?

I'm with your husband, I'm afraid.

Honestly...... I agree with your husband. Whether you like it or not and whether it's right or not you will be judged for drinking and being visibly pregnant. Onlookers won't know if it's 1 glass of Prosecco or the whole bottle you've had. You might be comfortable to be judged by others but he clearly isn't. If you must have a drink do it at home - I think it's fair you take your husbands wishes on board

Pretty sure there was an article released in the last year that said no amount of alcohol whilst pregnant is safe

OP sorry but you’re wrong. Someone asked why your OH hasn’t given up alcohol which is ridiculous. Like it or not, you are carrying the baby and what you ingest is what affects the growing baby. Not what your husband eats or drinks. Alcohol foetal syndrome is real and has awful effects. I just do not understand why you wouldn’t give up something that has the potential to do harm (and hopefully of course in your case it won’t) for a mere 9 months? Please do not lean on some research you have read as the risks are real.

Either you have the courage of your convictions, or you don’t.

If you do, the only upsetting thing about this is that your DH cares more about people judging him/you than about your considered decision around your and his baby. That’s miserable. He obviously doesn’t know what he’s talking about either: if he really thought you were wrong, he should have said so rather than have you draw it out of you. Does he care more about raising it with you than about the damage he fears you’re doing to the baby?

If you don’t have the courage of your convictions, that is, if you’re not sure whether you’re doing the right thing by drinking the quantity of alcohol you’ve allowed yourself, why on earth are you taking a risk with the foetus to prove a point about how women are treated during pregnancy? This is undoubtedly an issue. Drinking alcohol in order to be able to say “see? I told you they’re all wrong” is infantile.

Bottom line, neither of you are sure of yourselves. THIS is why most women stop drinking. They can’t be sure, so they choose not to take the risk. Nothing to do with the patriarchy. We’re just not all of us equipped with the necessary scientific qualifications to make a considered decision, so take the most cautious approach in the best interests of the foetus.

I hardly drink at all, but had the odd glass like you throughout my pregnancy and have three happy and healthy children. He needs to get some perspective. You have many many hurdles to get over as parents, much bigger ones that this, he needs to chill out or he’ll wear himself out before the baby is 1!

Are you sure that's true PlanDeRaccordement? I thought the first 3 months were the most dangerous time for drinking alcohol during pregnancy.

[quote ThymeCrisis]@PlanDeRaccordement not that it’s your business, but we don’t drive. But 1.5 units of alcohol doesn’t constitute drunk driving in England.[/quote]
Why bother starting a thread if your replies are just arsey like this? Did you just want everyone to say how horrible your DH is for having a reasonable opinion?

He is now saying that the drinking is not something he’s comfortable with anymore

He's free to give it up then.

There is no evidence that the occasional small glass of prosecco or equivalent in the second and third trimester does any harm. There is considerable evidence that the every growing list of restrictions is being used to limit and control women in pregnancy.

So if he feels that strongly he can cut out the booze too. I trust he won't be downing several pints before facing a night with waking baby or is that your problem to manage as well?

@Slipperrr not at all, but if things aren’t actually factually accurate and in being attacked, I’m well within my rights to respond in defence.

In fact I think you are wrong PlandeR. It helps if your arguments have some foundation in fact and everything I've read says that the first 3 months ARE the most crucial.

Not saying that the op should drink alcohol at all, but no need to give false info.

There is considerable evidence that the every growing list of restrictions is being used to limit and control women in pregnancy

What hyperbole.

@ThymeCrisis

I don't think the small amounts you are drinking are anything to be concerned about.

But if your DH wants you to stop drinking for the rest of your pregnancy it's only fair that he gives up for the duration too. You know - for support and solidarity.

I think he is being unreasonable to worry about what others may think .However I rarely drink now and didnt at all when pregnant .I understand that he is able to drink still ,but he is not carrying the precious cargo you are! He will also not have to give birth ,breastfeed or any thing else like this! It is only for a short while ,and even if you EBF wont be for ever! Maybe try some of the new cordials Elderflower /home made lemonade /Alcohol free cider? Serve in a nice long glass .More refreshing anyway!

@knittingaddict

Are you sure that's true PlanDeRaccordement? I thought the first 3 months were the most dangerous time for drinking alcohol during pregnancy.

Yes and no. Depends on which risks are easier to live with. Embryonic stage and the risk is physical birth defects such as normal sized head and smaller abdomen, tiny hands...so a bit oddly proportioned but the brain then develops alcohol free if alcohol is stopped by end of first trimester. Alcohol use in later in pregnancy, won’t cause physical defects but really affects brain development and the risk is profound learning/mental disabilities.

Of course constant alcohol even at a “low and slow” level is worst of all.

Twice a week is not the occasional drink.

it is regular drinking.

You are minimising, OP.

@C8H10N4O2

He is now saying that the drinking is not something he’s comfortable with anymore

He's free to give it up then.

There is no evidence that the occasional small glass of prosecco or equivalent in the second and third trimester does any harm. There is considerable evidence that the every growing list of restrictions is being used to limit and control women in pregnancy.

So if he feels that strongly he can cut out the booze too. I trust he won't be downing several pints before facing a night with waking baby or is that your problem to manage as well?

What would that achieve? Are you 6?

I'm with your DP. I would never drink in pregnancy and I do judge others who do (sorry, but that's the truth - though I wouldn't say it to someone's face). I feel sorry for your DP as he has to see potential harm being caused to his baby regularly and he isn't allowed to stop it. As well as worried, I'd be mortified if my partner openly in public did something that had the potential to harm our baby.

How much alcohol do you think would be ok to give to a newborn baby? Any at all? It's the same thing. Alcohol does real damage to babies. I think it's a bit worrying that you can't set it aside for a short time and your DH sounds worried too.

here is a good graphic showing there is no safe time to consume alcohol and the brain damage it causes later in pregnancy.

What would that achieve? Are you 6?

It would achieve a bit of solidarity with his partner for one thing. A man drinking significant volumes lecturing a woman for the odd small glass is not supporting her he is undermining her.

I've watched an ever increasing list of controls appear on pregnant women since I had mine, most of which are not evidence based, some have come and gone as they were proven false. Stick to actual evidence before you lecture and judge women. There is none to say the occasional small glass is a problem.