Not to support DD TTC?

[checkyourpops]

She's 19. Too young, if we are all completely honest.

Last year, she was pregnant with her own DD who died sadly due to a miscarriage at 20 weeks. The pregnancy wasn't planned, although that wasn't making it any easier obviously. I am/was of course devastated for her so I know she's had a hard time. But she needs to be realistic in her choices, as hard as that may be for now.

Her boyfriend is nice enough but I'm not entirely sure he's right for her, for a number of reasons.

Thing is, even if she did let herself down and her prospects down by moving out and finding somewhere to live, that would at least be something.

But she wants to continue living in her large bedroom, with her en-suite. The house is quite big so we have space but her entitlement is so off.

The reason I know she's TTC is because I found a receipt from Boots on the side next to some Vitamins and my prescription I asked her to pick up. On it said Folic Acid. I take a further look and I find it in the cupboard. Upon confronting DD, she says she's very sorry but they feel TTC is the only thing that's easing their pain.

I said fine, (I was quite angry), but move out first at least. She says she wants to stay here. I said she really can't, with a baby. When asked if she also expected her boyfriend to move in too, she said she didn't expect that? To make matters worse yet, H has spoken to her over dinner apparently?! And he says he supports her decision... when speaking to him in private, I said this is absolutely NOT on, she isn't even willing to move out. He says we've got space and the room. I say no. He's very calm about this whole thing. It's actually infuriating. I said well I bet she still expected to come on holiday with us if she has a baby. He says why not?!

Truth is that H doesn't want to downsize and I do. We currently live in a 5 bed house. It's too big for us all. We also have a DS who's 11.

What on earth would you do? H is not supporting me in encouraging DD to find a space of her own. That's before we get into the fact that two 19 year olds are trying for a baby.

She has no proper job, despite very good A Level results. She chose to go to work in some admin role for the NHS and works only 4 days a week 'because it suits her well'. Her boyfriend works in property of some sort in an advanced apprenticeship, think he did a few before that. A

I'm so upset for her. I can't believe she's doing this to herself and us

@Blossomtoes

What if a woman who'd lost a baby was also left infertile or menopausal? Would we just say well that's it then, you can't have another baby so there's nothing else that can be done for you

That’s exactly what happened to me. 🤷‍♀️

Sorry about that Blossom That must have been devastating.

Did you ever have children?

I don't mean to be insensitive, I just wasn't sure if that also meant IVF etc are out.

OP. You need to be strong.
She is already getting manipulative with her last statement. You will be left doing the vast bulk of the childcare! (Unless you literally move out, as she will leave the baby with you and you’ll have no choice.)

If women suffering the loss of a baby aren't getting anything better or even different than the "rainbow baby" stuff then that's really fucking terrible.

Yes, I already had a son @stackemhigh so I had to endure the “Oh but at least you’ve got one” comments too. It was the year before the first ivf baby and it wasn’t conception that was the problem, it was carrying another baby, they thought my liver might pack up completely. If I hadn’t already had a child I’d probably have take the risk.

The point I’m attempting to make - and clearly failing dismally - is that you’re expecting adult rational decision making from a very young woman in complete emotional and probably hormonal turmoil. Dismissing or minimising her perfectly normal response is really not on.

Out of interest you said she does lots around the house but what do you do for her, washing, cooking? It maybe that you tell her she needs to start doing all her own cooking and washing, asking for rent (that you can still surprise her with) and get her to start to act more self sufficient. She can see what time she has left to herself then and money. No doubt she is really hurting but she sounds very immature. Does she go out with her mates a lot?

OP, you are not wrong.

I wouldn’t want this for my 19 year old, nor would I be facilitating it. I wonder what your daughter’s boyfriend’s parents think? I have sons and, if at 19, with their entire lives ahead of them, they were TTC, I would be devastated.

I can only assume that some posters are projecting here, because the general consensus on MN is very much that grandparents are not obligated to provide childcare, and that it is perfectly fine and okay for them to be disinterested in being active grandparents because they wish to enjoy their retirement years. But somehow you are cold hearted and can’t possibly love your daughter because you don’t want her living in your home with a baby she is planning, where you will no doubt be expected to “stand in” for the father who your daughter has no intention of living with.

Madness.

@Blossomtoes

Yes, I already had a son *@stackemhigh* so I had to endure the “Oh but at least you’ve got one” comments too. It was the year before the first ivf baby and it wasn’t conception that was the problem, it was carrying another baby, they thought my liver might pack up completely. If I hadn’t already had a child I’d probably have take the risk.

The point I’m attempting to make - and clearly failing dismally - is that you’re expecting adult rational decision making from a very young woman in complete emotional and probably hormonal turmoil. Dismissing or minimising her perfectly normal response is really not on.

Very insensitive comments about you already having one, people should just keep their mouths shut in that situation. Platitudes aren't always necessary.

I do get your point.

@Laiste 20 years between oldest and youngest. That's like 40 years child rearing.
That really is dedication.
Well done

Some online groups are wonderful support, others can encourage very negative things and I'm wondering if that's what's happening here.

I agree, and I bet she is spending a lot of time listening to some daft views online.

[quote ClareBlue]@Laiste 20 years between oldest and youngest. That's like 40 years child rearing.
That really is dedication.
Well done[/quote]
Why thank you ! No one's ever said that before :)

I'm very lucky. 4 fantastic DDs. They make it easy. I find great pleasure, peace and a sense of achievement from parenting.

@Blossomtoes all this talk of another baby being the only thing to heal the grief of a miscarriage is ridiculous. Someone who’s like this should be in grief counselling not rushing along to have another baby regardless of the consequences.

Source : Me, the ‘fixer baby’. Hahahaha that turned out brilliant. Children are not objects to placate the feelings of another human being.

Hi OP, my heart breaks for your daughter and for you and your family.

I've lost 3 babies so I really get it. That yearning to get pregnant was so so intense. I'm a year along from my most recent loss and only had my first counselling session on Wednesday. It's a hard road and often feels very lonely even when surrounded by my wonderful DP and supportive loving family.

However, I completely agree with you. I think sound like a very supportive mother who has absolutely not tried to brush her loss under the carpet. But having a baby means that you and your partner alone are ultimately responsible for covering both the financial and emotional needs of that child. It does not sound like she is able to do that. I would be tempted to sit down with her and make a list of all the things she will need to pay for, where that be shelter, food, childcare, clothing, equipment, etc etc and just pose the question of how she intends to pay for this? It is not fair to ask your parents or anyone else for that matter to fund a child. I would also talk to her about her career, could you investigate ways of developing her skills to increase her earnings to a level that would facilitate her having a child in the near future. Maybe this would help her to realise she can have a child again but there are just some steps to help her get there first.

I don't envy you OP it's very hard. I think it is important for you and your DP to be on the same page and I think you need to help him understand that the vast majority of practical help he is offering to DD will fall to you! And not him. It is unfair

Children are not objects to placate the feelings of another human being

If you were right about that the human race would be long extinct.

I'm very lucky. 4 fantastic DDs. They make it easy. I find great pleasure, peace and a sense of achievement from parenting.

Not sure you're in a position to judge OP then, she isn't having an easy time of it all.

Not everyone wants to be raising children or helping raise them for decades.

@Blossomtoes nope, children would be seen as a valuable resource and raised as necessary to ensure the survival of the species. Just as nature intended 🙃

I am 100% with you with this one OP except perhaps with the comment on her job. I think that I would give her a month to find her own place and then I hope that she would realise that she is too immature and financially insecure to get pregnant. She does seem that she needs some counselling as her mind is in a very strange place at the moment.

I'm really struggling with so many people agreeing this young woman is 'lazy'. Maybe my bar is lower as my 19 year old lives at home, doesn't work at all, doesn't do much round the house but because they had a breakdown last year I'm just glad they are getting stronger and better. A MH episode is on a par with having a devastating miscarriage at 20 weeks so she's doing very well.

I'd be cock-a-bloody-hoop if mine had a lowly, lazy four day a week admin job in the NHS. And yes he's clever and got 'good A levels' too so what?

All that said, it's your house and your life OP and that part of it I whole heartedly agree with you on.

@sixthtimelucky but how would you feel if your DC decided to have a baby under these circumstances?

That's the issue. It's not a thread about DD being lazy so much as not equipped or intending to raise a child herself.

Yanbu. You have done your time. You can still support from "afar" with her and your grandchild. You are under no obligation to offer house room to a person who is actively trying for a family without making the necessary arrangements first.

It's a different situation supporting a surprise unplanned pregnancy and making those steps to independence together, but she is choosing now to start a family.

Creating her own life to bring a baby into is step one.

@Raindancer411

Out of interest you said she does lots around the house but what do you do for her, washing, cooking? It maybe that you tell her she needs to start doing all her own cooking and washing, asking for rent (that you can still surprise her with) and get her to start to act more self sufficient. She can see what time she has left to herself then and money. No doubt she is really hurting but she sounds very immature. Does she go out with her mates a lot?

She does her own washing and her brother's, as it goes - By choice. I do try to nudge her to leave him to it but she just does it automatically. I do cook for her but I make family meals. Something I myself like doing but everyone is welcome to make their own food if they don't fancy what I'm doing, which happens fairly regularly I suppose

Her friends are much older than her - And she's quite close with a few work mates. I know one is around 25, the other in early thirties. They both have DC already

She doesn't actually have any friends less than 2/3 years older than her

Just got this off of DD. I said since she's living with us, I'd like her to do another test please.

She handed me this... all tearful. Big long speech about how she will work beyond hard and even do housekeeping for me if I let her stay.

Says she is absolutely thrilled, she knows I'm not but tried hugging me and saying this baby could be the making of her I said it isn't really that clear a positive so might not stick anyway, but she needs to tell her boyfriend. She said she will tomorrow.

I wasn't impressed. I said what's done is done but you need to find somewhere to live now. I've yet to tell H. She started yelling 'Please mum, let us stay!'. I haven't seen her since 7 now and she didn't want dinner

Going to come off this thread for a while whilst I process this. I now feel God awful, letting my future grandchild grow up in a small flat, because that's all they could afford reasonably

I'm so upset, I really am

georgana Yes I get that and no my 19 year old obviously couldn't support a child on any level but someone on a lower income like OP's daughter can absolutely start a family. I don't think that's naive, lazy, wrong, ridiculous nor do I think it ridiculous for a 19 year old to want a child. I fully agree with is that she cannot have a baby in her mum's house because her mum does not want that so they will have to support themselves and have some very lean years. I personally would partially support them financially outside of my house - just my choice, not something OP or anyone else should do.

And there has most definitely been a sniffy attitude towards a four-day lower paid job, by OP herself who has mentioned her not fulfilling her potential - it's her life and this is what she's choosing to do. That in isolation is offensive to me.

Stay firm, OP. Maybe the baby will be the making of her but she has to move out.

Oh OP this is so upsetting, I really feel for you. My eldest is 16 -not so far from 19 , and I can only imagine how I would feel in your place.
I have never known anyone have a planned pregnancy and want to carry on living with Mum and Dad !! She needs to do a lot of growing up before the baby is born, has she grasped that she will be completely responsible for a tiny new person, with a boyfriend who seems fairly casual ?