Not to support DD TTC?

[checkyourpops]

She's 19. Too young, if we are all completely honest.

Last year, she was pregnant with her own DD who died sadly due to a miscarriage at 20 weeks. The pregnancy wasn't planned, although that wasn't making it any easier obviously. I am/was of course devastated for her so I know she's had a hard time. But she needs to be realistic in her choices, as hard as that may be for now.

Her boyfriend is nice enough but I'm not entirely sure he's right for her, for a number of reasons.

Thing is, even if she did let herself down and her prospects down by moving out and finding somewhere to live, that would at least be something.

But she wants to continue living in her large bedroom, with her en-suite. The house is quite big so we have space but her entitlement is so off.

The reason I know she's TTC is because I found a receipt from Boots on the side next to some Vitamins and my prescription I asked her to pick up. On it said Folic Acid. I take a further look and I find it in the cupboard. Upon confronting DD, she says she's very sorry but they feel TTC is the only thing that's easing their pain.

I said fine, (I was quite angry), but move out first at least. She says she wants to stay here. I said she really can't, with a baby. When asked if she also expected her boyfriend to move in too, she said she didn't expect that? To make matters worse yet, H has spoken to her over dinner apparently?! And he says he supports her decision... when speaking to him in private, I said this is absolutely NOT on, she isn't even willing to move out. He says we've got space and the room. I say no. He's very calm about this whole thing. It's actually infuriating. I said well I bet she still expected to come on holiday with us if she has a baby. He says why not?!

Truth is that H doesn't want to downsize and I do. We currently live in a 5 bed house. It's too big for us all. We also have a DS who's 11.

What on earth would you do? H is not supporting me in encouraging DD to find a space of her own. That's before we get into the fact that two 19 year olds are trying for a baby.

She has no proper job, despite very good A Level results. She chose to go to work in some admin role for the NHS and works only 4 days a week 'because it suits her well'. Her boyfriend works in property of some sort in an advanced apprenticeship, think he did a few before that. A

I'm so upset for her. I can't believe she's doing this to herself and us

Now is not the time to beat around the bush and be more supportive. The OP has a limited window of time in which to make it clear to her DD what will happen if she goes ahead with this plan. The kindest thing the OP can do right now is be completely honest so the DD can make an informed decision as to whether to go ahead with TTC. The softly-softly approach might prevent her making her decision with all the facts.

@a8mint

'Because it's my house? Is it not your dh's house too? Why are bis opinions less valid than yours? My opinion aligns much more with your husband's. I would not choose any of my children to have babies at 19, but if my dd had been through something so traumatic and badly needed this to heal, i would be doing everything to make her hurting go awaya and support her to regain her mental health. Presumably they'll be 20ish once the baby is born, i am not sure why you think you will be doing all the childcare

Bet her DH won’t be expected to help with the baby....

And another baby isn’t a ‘fix it’ for her mental health either. She should address that first

@minipie

You can’t decide to have a baby and raise it in your parents’ house just because they were willing to support you with an unplanned baby

Well I can see why a 19 year old would assume that if her parents were happy to support and house her with an unplanned baby, they’d be happy to do the same with a planned baby. After all, the practical impacts on the parents are exactly the same.

But they are in no way the same thing. Her parents supporting her with the unplanned baby was out of concern for a dd whose boyfriend wanted her to abort.

Now dd wants to TTC presuming her parents will support her. It’s incredibly entitled.

[quote ClareBlue]@stackemhigh but you are suggesting that the father and daughter bend to the will of the mother.
There is still a 11 year old in the house so it's not bye bye kids for a while anyway.
The daughter doesn't have to be in the house for ever. She and bf can set up house together anytime. Why not in a year or two when she is obviously traumatized in the sanctuary of the family home, with or without a baby.[/quote]
In this case yes.

Everyone’s lives shouldn’t be turned upside down on the actions of one person

Why not in a year or two when she is obviously traumatized in the sanctuary of the family home, with or without a baby.

It's the mother who is usually expected to provide that 'sanctuary'. Babysitting and other services on tap. What if the OP doesn't want to have to put all her energies into making her home a 'sanctuary' for her DD and a new baby? More female unpaid labour.

@minipie

I presume she would have been living at home had her first baby survived?

Yes this is a good question. OP while she was pregnant, what was discussed about where she would live with the baby? If she was going to be allowed to live with you with that baby then it’s not at all entitled of her to assume you’d be happy for her to live there with a future rainbow baby.

There’s one thing supporting an ‘accident’ and another supporting a deliberate act

I don’t see it’s wrong to chose the career she has, or TTC .

But there is no way she should feel she can live in your house.

Not on at all

If the boyfriend's parents wanted the last baby aborted, they sound like ideal allies - that's three out of four parents making it clear that they have no intention of facilitating this.
I shouldn't think it would take too much to frighten off the boyfriend with a chat about child support coming out of his pay packet.

@Blossomtoes

You’ve no idea what job she’s doing. According to OP - basic wage and not much prospects. DD is not on an apprenticeship scheme where training and career progression is mapped out - the type that some firms offer non-graduates. (The type indeed that the NHS offer medical trainees.)

You can get from market stall to CEO but those who do tend to be the exception not the rule. To get into NHS management it’s much easier on a graduate scheme.A friend of mine heads an NHS trust but she started off at Cambridge.

[quote ClareBlue]@stackemhigh but you are suggesting that the father and daughter bend to the will of the mother.
There is still a 11 year old in the house so it's not bye bye kids for a while anyway.
The daughter doesn't have to be in the house for ever. She and bf can set up house together anytime. Why not in a year or two when she is obviously traumatized in the sanctuary of the family home, with or without a baby.[/quote]
The dd doesn’t get an equal say to OP on whether she can live in the house. She doesn’t own the house and she is a working adult living there through her parents’ goodwill (I lived at home until my late 20s and recognised it was a privilege not a right).

And the person who doesn’t new addition to household should decide.

I get where you’re coming from. I’d be annoyed too as I can bet you’d end up looking after the baby while she does all the stuff 19 year olds want to do.

I’d be absolutely furious with your husband! He’s not doing her any favours. It’ll be a nightmare with them all under your roof. I completely understand your frustration!

Op you are NOT being unreasonable! Who honestly would want their 19 year old to purposely get pregnant while living at home on a crap salary! And no of course you don't want a baby in the house, I'm sure if you did you'd have one. If she's not responsible enough to move out and provide for her own child she obviously isn't responsible enough to have one. Most teen/young mums who have babies while still living at home do so so their own mothers can take over and that's exactly what you would be expected to do let's be honest.

You're not, though, are you? Please do share with us what you know about NHS admin jobs?

Well I did one back in the day when I was at uni.

It was fine, but it was very boring.

If you want to good job in NHS administration, you should join a graduate scheme.

So there are plenty of different views on the thread and that's of value in itself.
We have extreme grief, potential distruption of well made plans, lack of consensus of parenting between parents, potential unfulfilled ambition and the scandal of NHS admin job being undertaken by someone with good A levels.
For any Irish posters, is this the plot for the second serries of Smother?

I don’t see anything wrong with OP voicing what she wants from her life. She has her own plans, there’s a light at the end of the parenting tunnel with a good few baby free years.

Yet again woman saying what they want or don’t want are called selfish for not thinking of someone else. Well no ones thinking of OP.

OP stick to your guns, if she’s old enough for a baby she’s old enough to look after herself. Nothing wrong with that.

Totally agree with you that 19 is way to young to plan a baby! Especially with a bf she doesn’t seem so sure of. And don’t let yourself to be made the bad guy because you were hoping for more ambition.

I wouldn’t be happy too. Your husband needs to come on board here.

I know she's technically allowed to TTC but come on, surely it's ridiculous?

Of course it’s ridiculous. If my daughter got pregnant at 19, accidentally whilst living at home, I’d support her. But actively trying to conceive at this age whilst not being fully independent is fucking ridiculous. I’d tell her to find her own place to live as no way would I be enabling this stupidity.

Its not ideal, but if shes desperately broody for a baby then its going to happen whether you like it or not. The point is whether you kick her out. Shes 20, shes got a job and a working partner. Im sorry your retirement isnt likely to be exactly as planned, but these things happen. Sounds like shes not a bad housemate. You could always see how it goes. 20 is young but its not that young either

I think because ops DD lost a child it's inevitable that she will ttc as she probably feels like that's the only way she'll ever feel happy again.

@im2sad No, it's not inevitable, lots of people don't do it, especially if the circumstances aren't right.

Sometimes we all go through sadness and tragedy, we have good and bad times. We get through them (with help if need be.)

Im sorry your retirement isnt likely to be exactly as planned, but these things happen.

Well they do if you’ve got a 19 year old planning for it to happen whilst living off you. It wouldn’t happen in my house. I’d tell her to grow the fuck up.

Your post has made me feel so sad for your daughter. You use some awful language to describe her and her life, actions etc.

She is grieving still and many women embark on TTC very quickly after pregnancy loss; this iis not unusual.

Can you find a way to be compassionate and encouraging. It is possible to encourage her to move out making it into an exciting 'new start' rather than pointing out everything you think she is doing wrong.

She is an adult. Her chokce of partner has nothing to do with you, nor do her plans for pregnancy. If you want her to move out then be supportive, excited for her, encouraging, positive. Treat her like the woman she is! Try to get your husband onside if need be, but please, stop criticising when the poor woman already feels terrible.

Carry on like this and she'll end up losing respect for you, or worse.

She's 19. Too young, if we are all completely honest. I don't think 19 is too young; if she has had a happy supportive childhood she will be calae, sill cope,and I was going to say make you proud, but I don't think she will ever meet your expectations.

@osbertthesyrianhamster

I'd actually divorce over this. I do not want to live with a baby or worse, a toddler/pre-schooler, again. NOr should your son's life be disrupted by a baby.

I could well imagine it fracturing a marriage.

Apologies OP, but is your husband really dim?
I can honestly say I have never heard the like of this.

Your penniless, part time working daughter being encouraged by her father to have a baby and YOU by extension being volunteered to be Granny!

What an idiot.

You have a massive H problem.

To get the point across I would be forcing the issue of downsizing.

Your daughter has suffered for sure, but the entitlement of assuming she could just foist a baby on the whole family is appalling.

Unforgivable of your husband to encourage this.
Your son is certainly another family member your husband is disregarding.

So the boyfriend won't live with you, but you will be back to parenting a baby at retirement stage.

Hold onto your anger.

I have never known anyone to go through this but I do know a few grandparents that find even visiting toddlers exhausting.

Your husband is the centre of this mess.
Sort him out.

Instigate selling the house, drastic but needs must.

Make it perfectly clear that you will not be spending retirement raising another child.

Encourage your daughter to move out... not easy.

Encourage more counselling if possible.

Your daughter needs a sharp dose of financial reality, something your husband seems determined to deny her.

Wishing you strength OP.

One thing that has come across from posters on this thread is the complete lack of validity given to the position of the father.

@ClareBlue

One thing that has come across from posters on this thread is the complete lack of validity given to the position of the father.

Not just the father but the husband. It’s quite astounding that so many posters take it completely for granted that women run the show and men should do as they’re told.

Completely understand the OP's feelings and would share them.

But do think whether it would really be better to be roped in as a supportive grandparent in 20 years' time, if she had her children at, say, 39 and 41 and needed some childcare help; or if she needed to borrow significant sums to afford IVF.

Bear in mind that young people increasingly see their relationships with parents as contingent. If it feels like emotional blackmail, it partly is. But the upside is having good relationships with your children and grandchildren. That is worth something, and will endure beyond the baby months. The baby period is very short, and your daughter would be doing most or all of the work.

You could maybe make the point that if she just waits a bit, she could have a larger family with the children nicely-spaced. An early child when she lacks skills is more likely to lead to a smaller family later on.