The expectation of daily sex.

[Chillionice]

Being 44 yr old mother of 3 (13/11/10) with husband for nearly 15 yrs I would love some advice or reassurance about how to manage the sexual expectation.

My husband & I have may incompatibilities and underwent counselling 5 yrs ago. He has begrudgingly accepted that our sex life is not going to be as colourful or plentiful as he would like. A daily morning session seems to have been settled upon yet I still struggle with this. Eroticism was never a part of our marriage, kissing ended years ago & we are left with this daily session that seems to placate my husband but still fills me with dread and sadness.
I write this at 7.21 on a Monday morning having started the day, the week etc exactly the same way once again. This interaction between us to me confirms the loneliness of our relationship - both sides wanting something so different and kind of compromising on this middle ground. I frequently try to put off a dawn toilet visit incase my husband stirs and feel a lot of resentment that I can seldom start the day relaxed, dozing, contemplating bird song etc. Nor am I excused if I’ve been up with the kids in the night or have a challenging day ahead. It feels relentless, unwaning, an appetite I can never sate.

One of our incompatibilities that counselling could only do so much to resolve was poor communication. My husband is emotionally very distant and easily offended meaning I really have to just accept this situation and be grateful try to think it’s only 5 minutes of the day.
So anyone in the same boat with any advice of how to keep a positive mind for 5 mins daily to hold a marriage together, please let me know how you do it!!! Thanks.

@tara66

I don't think anyone has suggested yet that he ''does'' it all in the shower/bathroom (alone of course) - never mind if he takes all the hot water!

He doesn't want to quietly wank in the bathroom. The wanking next to her in bed was on purpose to make her feel uncomfortable and to punish her for refusing sex. This is not an issue about where he orgasms, it's a sexual abuse issue.

@Chillionice

Thank you for sharing this. My husband says (& said in counselling) that I am controlling his sex life when I refuse/reject/negotiate. I obvs say agreed consent is fundamental. The daily morning is the outcome. I guess with wildly differing libidos that seemed a compromise. But I struggle with even that. If he had what he wanted it would prob be 10 times a week including anal, oral etc which is just off the agenda for me in light of the weight of this problem in our marriage. So that prob makes me a prude too. Tracey bloody Cox would defo say so 😂!

And your counsellor was ok with this ‘agreement’ between you.

She must have been monumentally shit not to have seen this ‘agreement’ was pure coercion.

Jesus if DH started getting sex every day he would (a) wonder what on earth I'd done (b) think all his birthdays had come at once. He's lucky with us both working 24/7 shift patterns, a disabled parent on my side that needs lots of support and all the usual life business to get it once a month ! Every day is frequent sex !

But that's just the tip of the iceberg OP, the sulking, coercion etc is much more worrying

Does he even put any effort into making sure the sex is enjoyable for you? Not that I would find coersion enjoyable, but does he care if you orgasm/enjoy it? Is he tender with you?

Here's another person who is strong enough to control his wife and coerce her into sex she doesn't want yet is "easily offended."

Think about it. It is another controlling aspect in my opinion.

It can be soul destroying when one wants sex and the other doesn't but a decent person would not want to have sex with someone who wasn't 100% consenting and enjoying it. Sex isn't supposed to just be about gratification.

I've only read the OP but please make this morning the last time your husband takes what he wants with no thought for you. Please. He'll destroy you otherwise .

I'm so sorry OP. Reading this makes me feel sick to my stomach. You do not have to make your husband happy, thats his own responsibility, I know you say your kids are at play here but what an unhealthy relationship to model to them :( being miserable like this really isn't worth it.

I'm so sorry, OP. My heart hurts for you. I have been where you are right now, and I promise healing comes.

I am now with a partner who respects my bodily autonomy in every way. Unreservedly, immediately, without negotiation or petulance. You deserve the same.

I hope one day you read your opening post and feel very glad that you left all this shit behind, OP. You're more than an orifice to be used. He's not a good man and this is not right.

@Chillionice

3 weeks

Is this in reaponse to the question about pregnancies??

Dear God! I wasn't ready for sex for at least a year. ITS NOT OKAY AND ITS NOT NORMAL!!

Are you scared of him? Do you work?

No way should you be putting up with this. Marriage isn’t about a list of sexual demands you have to fulfil.

Most marriages aren’t the way you describe, certainly not among my peers. I’m ten years older than you, been married nearly 30 years. At your age and stage we were having sex once or twice a week - only when I wanted to. DH was well aware he was getting more sex than many his age. All my friends are in healthy happy marriages, many on way less sex than that. Plus, I’ve never done many of the things your DH has on his ideal list, never will do, and don’t consider myself a prude at all. Just someone who has strong healthy boundaries with a DH who respects those.

You can’t carry on like this. You’re married to a selfish dickhead. At the very least, get him into a separate bedroom and make him wank out of your earshot. Personally, I’d leave.

Relationship counselling with an abusive husband just doesn't work quite often. Our Relate counsellor was just suggesting ways for me to placate him. It's only in one of our last sessions that she was starting to see through him and of course that's when he decided he didn't want to attend any more sessions.

Actually maybe it does work as I realised I didn't want to keep placating him and I decided to leave.

I do know a woman whose husband saw her as available at all times. To the outside world he seemed fine but she would wake up with him inside her. I didn’t know this until I had known her for many years and after she mentioned it this time she would never ever ever talk about it again. She was a much older friend and her husband died a few years ago. Her transformation was amazing. She had eaten her misery for the 30 years she was married and was very overweight. She lost five stone and ended up in a healthy relationship. My poor friend has so many regrets. She can never get those years back.

Some of my friends who are single parents do have some sort of sadness as do my friends who have partners.

Each set of circumstances is unique. What you are modelling to your children is that staying in abusive relationships is ok. You may think your hiding your misery but I guarantee you are not. The children of my friend have all had huge issues in relationships, very unsuccessful, they are all in their forties now. They have no idea what a healthy relationship is supposed to be like. Is that a risk you are prepared to take?

I had something similar, although not as full on. ExH would get sulky if he didn't have sex regularly, I would be made to feel guilty, at one point I sent him to the bathroom to sort himself out. He would quote figures at me of "average" amount of sex for couples. He couldn't figure out that the more he sulked and behaved like a child, the less I wanted him.

Divorcing, although difficult, was life changing in so many positive ways and I have a very healthy life in so many ways no.

OP, it really isn't healthy, and I know that feeling of lying still so you don't wake someone and have to deal with it. Or pretending to be tired so you can go to sleep instead. It is wearing, miserable, and a weight on your shoulders. Nobody can tell you what to do, but think seriously about your options.

And in the meantime big hugs.

@Chillionice

Yes. Discussed this with the counsellor years ago. My husband said I was dragging our daughters into a theoretical question that had nothing to do with them. Counsellor agreed that drawing parallels with our daughters was unhelpful.

'Drawing parallels with our daughters'

Sorry but I don't see what you mean here @Chillionice.
What parallel? Abusing them too?

I've had counselling.
I have at least 3 colleagues and friends who are BACP counsellors.

I've never known any of them 'agree' with any client especially where abuse is concerned.

What exactly did this counsellor say and are they a BACP counsellor?

I agree with coercive control. This is absolutely no way to live. Do you have a spare bedroom? In which case you could sleep separately and he could wank to his heart's content. If he punishes you with sulking and bad moods that's also coercive control.

@Chillionice What advice do you want?

You opening post was very eloquent. You described your life in very emotional language.

But your subsequent posts seem in comparison almost light-hearted and on a different level (eg the Tracy Cox comment.)

Do you appreciate the opinions here and how posters are trying to help?

What is your plan of action?

What would you say to one of your daughters if they were in this situation? Stick it out for the sake of the kids?

I really hope not.

Best wishes in getting on the path to happiness. You seem to think it’s an impossible dream. It isn’t.

This is just grim.

He is an awful man and you need to get away from him. You are not modelling healthy relationships to your children.

Please leave him OP. You do not have to have sex with this man ever again. Starting now. He does not have to agree.

You know that you deserve a good sex life if you want one. Your DH is fundamentally absolutely shit in bed. Sex is between 2 people and he does not seem to realise that.

It will take you some time to recover from the sexual abuse in this relationship, so be kind to yourself.

What an absolutely shit counsellor.

OP, this sounds so hard. Your counsellor sounds spectacularly shit and has not picked up on the abusive element here...

But even without any abuse or coercive control - Sex drive differences are very common but the normal reaction to that is to explore how to bridge the gap CONSENSUALLY. How to make sex more appealing for the lower desire partner, discussions around responsive vs spontaneous desire, how the lower desire person can learn to be more open / explore their “maybe” feelings (but never ignoring their own NO), and how the higher desire can change their approach to help the lower person... but also how the higher desire can manage their own needs, and how to deal with their own sense of loss & disappointment about their sex life.

Therapeutic professionals should NOT be recommending you just suck it up and subject yourself to daily sex that you dread, to the extent you fear waking up in the morning. Daily sex is also well above “average” by the way.... most studies suggest that for long term couples, 1-2x week is average.

Can you get yourself some individual therapy for a little while to explore this, away from the sulking and grumpiness of your husband?

@JinglingHellsBells I think OP might be putting up barriers because the truth is too difficult to work with right now.

The fact is no one here is going to give advice or suggestions on how to stay in such a horrible situation.

Rapists need eradicated from society. Do not normalise your rapist, do not attend counselling again with it, it should t be anywhere near women, or kids, can you go to a refuge? Or literally anywhere else?

You need counselling on your own, OP, to build up your self esteem enough to realise that you don't have to live like this.

You can't live the rest of your life in this state of apathy.

@JinglingHellsBells

The OP had a few hours on MN - hardly time to formulate a plan of action. Leave her be, she’s got a long and difficult road ahead of her, whatever she decides to do.

Sex is supposed to be about unity and bliss and tenderness. It should leave you suffused with joy, not filled with sadness and dread. Please stop doing this. Say no, and let his reaction be his own choice. Reclaim your body and reserve it for loving touches only.