To think modern life is shit for mums

[barelycoping1]

I have a 1 year old son and would give anything to be a SAHM. I don’t want to put him in nursery or with a childminder, I’m his mum and I want to bring him up myself - not pay someone else to do it. I want to spend every precious moment with him because he’s our first and last and I’ll never get to experience this special time again.

Sadly though I have no choice but to return to work so we can pay our mortgage and bills. I don’t earn that much more than the cost of nursery, but it is about £350 difference every month so worth it.

I just feel sad that I don’t have a choice in the matter thanks to the sodding cost of living and sky high rents/mortgages now. I wish we were back in the days where one salary could easily cover the mortgage on an average home. Hose prices have essentially adjusted now to mean that both parents need to work to keep a roof over their heads.

Also because I’m back at work, my free time is a constant battle trying to keep the house in order and deal with life admin. I’ve lost touch with quite a few friends because I have so little time.

AIBU to hate the fact that I have to go back to work and to feel sad that I’m missing out on time with my son? I know some people will say to find a job I love, but there’s no job in the world that I’d rather do than be a SAHM.

I feel so stretched all the time and like I’m on a hamster wheel and can’t get off. If this is what having it all means then it’s just shit, sorry. What can I do to change my life for the better?

I am older. I used to have a job trying to get women into further education when we had a further education sector. I used to visit SAHM who had lost all confidence. Some would be shaking just talking to me.

And there was no soft play or baby classes back then. There were mum and toddler groups. Usually a group of mums sitting on plastic chairs in a draughty church hall, with some toys for the children. That was it. And yes most families were poorer than today so did not have the money for day trips.

I am sure some enjoyed being SAHM. But those I knew who did had a small business on the side so were not strictly SAHM, more part-time working mums.
There was a reason valium was known as the housewives drug or mother's little helper. There is a lot of rose tinted spectacles on this thread.

And women of this age were taught to hide any unhappiness from their children, so many did and plastered on a smile. Still when working with children at 17 I would get young children tell me that mum is crying at the kitchen table.

@Naunet

I read threads like this and wonder why the suffragettes even bothered. So many women who don’t value their rights and take no responsibility for their own life choices.

Exactly this.

You mentioned that once childcare is taken off your salary you only take home about £350 a month, but you are looking at it as though it's only your income that childcare is for. Childcare is to enable both you and your husband to work and allows you to have two salaries coming in. You should only be paying 50% of the childcare costs. When you look at it that way paying childcare isn't as bad. You also have to remember the benefits of staying in work as your lifet earnings will generally be higher for those who stay working. It's often really hard to get back into the work place after a career break.
Also look at the positives of nursery. My children are thriving at nursery, they learn all sorts, they are social and confident, they do a variety of activities and do way more than we would achieve at home. Even learning jolly phonics etc so have a head start for school. Just ensure you have quality time when you arent working.
Housework is hard when juggling children and work but I've learned toliwermy standards quite a bit! But as long as we can eat and have clean clothes then I think I'm winning!!

*to lower

All the research show s children start to really benefit from nursery once they reach 2.5 and 3 years old. Up till that point the only children who actively benefit from nursery are those who are neglected or whose parents can't cope.

@fruityorange

All the research show s children start to really benefit from nursery once they reach 2.5 and 3 years old. Up till that point the only children who actively benefit from nursery are those who are neglected or whose parents can't cope.

Could you share that research please?

@fruityorange

All the research show s children start to really benefit from nursery once they reach 2.5 and 3 years old. Up till that point the only children who actively benefit from nursery are those who are neglected or whose parents can't cope.

Bullshit.

@fruityorange is this research based around the social systems and lifestyle in the UK or is it Scandi-based?

It is based on the UK. I am surprised at people calling bullshit. Before age 2 certainly, children benefit from good care from a caring adult. After 2 or 3 children benefit from group care with other children. This is not under dispute and is very well researched.
So telling OP her baby would benefit from a nursery is not true unless she is unable to care for her baby properly.

This is not under dispute and is very well researched.

I’m calling bollocks on that.

Mine come from a loving, supportive home, but got a huge amount from nursery from a young age, certainly from 18 months. I always suspect people dissing nurseries have never come across a good one.

It certainly is under dispute. I don't think you know how research works.

@fruityorange
The research I could find is here assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/738725/SEED_Impact_Age_4_Report_September_2018.pdf
and I think it provides a very mixed picture tbh.

I also think there are nuances that are probably missed through this study - i.e. the impact of siblings on language development, the quality of formal childcare and outcomes etc. I don't think some of the conclusions are as easily reached as the study suggests. Just my opinion.

Sorry posted wrong research - this is the most recent follow up study
assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/867140/SEED_AGE_5_REPORT_FEB.pdf
but again there are a lot of caveats and surprising findings.

@fruityorange

It is based on the UK. I am surprised at people calling bullshit. Before age 2 certainly, children benefit from good care from a caring adult. After 2 or 3 children benefit from group care with other children. This is not under dispute and is very well researched. So telling OP her baby would benefit from a nursery is not true unless she is unable to care for her baby properly.

I'm a university academic based in an education faculty and have some understanding of the research on this subject.

I've not come across research that suggests only children that are neglected or live with parents that can't care for them properly benefit from childcare. I'd love to see the research that you have read.

@TheKeatingFive

This is not under dispute and is very well researched.

I’m calling bollocks on that.

Mine come from a loving, supportive home, but got a huge amount from nursery from a young age, certainly from 18 months. I always suspect people dissing nurseries have never come across a good one.

Absolutely. All of the research I have read states that the quality of childcare is key.

I work in research as a senior consultant and I would say - listen to no research.

Either sample too small (number of people) or the way it is analysed makes the numbers skewed. I reckon I can pull apart most of 'researches'

I'm not saying they are all wrong, I'm saying it's very easy to manipulate the result how you want it to look - and we don't know if it was genuine analysis result or the skewed one.

It can be shit for women. In fact I don't think it's great for anyone unless you are at the top atm. Erosion of working rights, higher house prices etc.

I also don't think there has been a golden age to be a mum, it's always been hard. People's circumstances vary wildly. Things that make it easier:

Stable flexible job
Being senior enough negotiate return/ flexible working ( it took me 10years of working to be at that level)
Having both parents working together and sharing the load ( mental and physical)
Having fit, willing and able grandparents/ family locally to help out
Financial security

The early days back at work are hard. I didn't want to go back to a job I loved before. My kids didnt sleep, juggling constantly illness/ covid, the expense of childcare. It was worth it long term.

My youngest starts school this September and I am so grateful I stayed and work pt. Although career took a back seat, I feel I can now pick it up again and push it forward.

In hindsight my eldest benefited from nursery (from age 1) loads in terms of friendship groups who she still sees now years later. The youngest has had her nursery time disrupted by covid and I can see the detrimental effects of this with them.

Up till that point the only children who actively benefit from nursery are those who are neglected or whose parents can't cope.

I’m going to assume the “research” doesn’t claim the the other cohort of children are not harmed by going to nursery either.

@DelBocaVista It is funny you are an academic researcher and so misquote me and make false claims.
I did NOT talk about childcare. I talked about nurseries i.e. being in a group setting with other children.
Yes research talks about the quality of childcare being key. But before 2.5 what matters is the quality of care from a caring adult whether that is a parent, nursery nurse or childminder. After that age children do benefit from being in group settings with other children.
I am not sure I believe your claim you are an academic researcher when you misquote me to such a horrendous degree.

And no of course this does not mean that nurseries are harmful. It means that there is no benefit to putting a baby in a nursery unless you can not provide good quality care. So those saying the OP should put her baby in a nursery to benefit the baby are wrong. It won't do any harm, but there is no benefit either. Whereas if her child was 3 it would be right to say that some nursery sessions or other group setting would benefit her child. Again that can be nursery as childcare or a group setting that a SAHM takes her child to.

This is NOT a SAHM versus working mother comment. Just do not recommend someone put a baby purely for the babies benefit when there is no evidence to support that benefit.

Do you know what? I grew up poor, I love my parents, but I knew I was missing out on stuff I was interested in. I never went on the trip to France that everyone else seemed to experience. I missed out. I wasn't allowed trips to the cinema (and it was cheaper in those days).
I used the library (which was great, it was a mobile library), but there are certain books that I wanted to keep in my collection.

Did I love my parents and value them of course, but they were poor. I like experiences, I like material things (it's not a sin to like the material things the world has to offer).

Frankly, if £350 per month after paying everything, not counting pension contributions, I'm trying to unmderstand why that is an issue? Money now isn't the issue. Time flies and that missing pension contribution counts for a lot.

Btw I'd never tell my parents there was anything lacking in my childhood, they did the best with what they had and I'm grateful, but all it taught me was to graft to get what I want. Everyone around thinks I'm never satisfied and I'm not. I don't even have a profession (yet).

Maternity leave was boring as hell for me, but my first DC was born when mat leave was less than 6 months. I've suffered enough, I've missed out on loads and I want to do stuff with and without my kids. Camping will never be a holiday to me. Now everyone who gets in their feels about the cute and cuddlies, that's fine. But I know of too many people who give it up, go part time and what not and 15 years complains it isn't fair. It's a choice, know what the choice means and have at it. I support any decision that works for your family.

I understand you, OP. I have two masters and am hovering at / near the worshipped six-digits salary category, but if I could, I'd drop it all tomorrow to be a SAHM to my children.

@DelBocaVista It is funny you are an academic researcher and so misquote me and make false claims.

Where have I misquoted you or made false claims? I asked if you could share the research you referred to as it isn't a specific finding I have come across.

I did NOT talk about childcare. I talked about nurseries i.e. being in a group setting with other children.

Childcare and nursery are often used interchangeably - i was using the word childcare in the generic sense.

Yes research talks about the quality of childcare being key. But before 2.5 what matters is the quality of care from a caring adult whether that is a parent, nursery nurse or childminder. After that age children do benefit from being in group settings with other children.

I don't disagree.

I am not sure I believe your claim you are an academic researcher when you misquote me to such a horrendous degree.

In what way have I misquoted you? I just asked you to share the research you have read. I'm interested!!
No need to be so rude to me!

And no of course this does not mean that nurseries are harmful. It means that there is no benefit to putting a baby in a nursery unless you can not provide good quality care

Benefit to whom? It's important to consider the bigger picture. Research does show that there are wider benefits to women returning to work after mat leave which can have longer term benefits for the family as a whole. Not for all women or all families though.....

So those saying the OP should put her baby in a nursery to benefit the baby are wrong. It won't do any harm, but there is no benefit either.

At no point have I said this.

This is NOT a SAHM versus working mother comment. Just do not recommend someone put a baby purely for the babies benefit when there is no evidence to support that benefit.

I haven't so please don't misquote me....

I saw that report some time ago now, years in fact.

It was saying that children benefitted from aged 2 if they came from poverty, and had barriers etc.
Otherwise there was no overall benefit for children being in nursery over being at home with a caring parent.
It wasn't saying that nursery wasn't as good as being at home, it was the same benefit.

Faultymain5
Some of what you said resonated with me, especially this:
But I know of too many people who give it up, go part time and what not and 15 years complains it isn't fair. It's a choice, know what the choice means and have at it. I support any decision that works for your family.
I don't mind what other women do, as long as it's an informed decision and in years to come they don't complain about any obvious consequences of their decision.

I have to divert conversations with one family friend because I have to bite my tongue when they start lamenting about how we are so 'lucky' to have savings and she never had savings. We are very fortunate to have savings, but if I gave my job up for a decade and then worked part time for another decade, I sure as hell wouldn't have savings. Different choices have different consequences.