I genuinely don’t know if I’m being unreasonable

[DoolallyBinzes]

There is so much to this story but the bare bones of it are that when I was with my ex we borrowed money from my Mum to pay our rent. We had only paid a small amount of it back when he left me. I had no money, no job, nowhere to live and 3 children to look after.
10 years later, Mum has died and my brother says I have to pay all the money back. I’m happy to pay half but I don’t see why I should pay for my ex’s share especially when he now has plenty of money.

Do it’s
“Personally I’d say it’s fair for you to repay £2000 to each brother and keep the other £2000 as your share from the inheritance.”

That makes sense to me OP. You did say your mum had written down that she’d lent you the money, presumably before her dementia. So I think you should take it that she expected it back and you should pay it back.

If the £6000 were back in the pot, then that would be £2000 to each of you. So you owe them £2000 each.

I hope they haven’t had loans they are just keeping quiet about though.

Tell him you already paid it back. its none of his business if its not mentioned in the will.

The quote was from Donitta. I apologise- the auto correct went wrong.

You could clear the air with a family talk, OP.

Explain your dilemma, that you were your mum's carer, that cost you a fortune I expect, and that you wouldlike them to lay out what, if any, sums of money they too may have borrowed from your parents over the years.

Tell your one DB that you appreciate his insistence and will indeed pay the money into the estate but that if he thinks the £2K he will get from this is worth rocking your relationship over then he needs to look at himself long and hard! He needs to consider why he felt it necessary to do this over a relatrively smal amount of money.

I say that as one whose BIL walked away with £75K of MILs money and STILL thinks he was right to stop repayments!

Tell him you already paid it back. its none of his business if its not mentioned in the will.

Also, just let it roll. If he wants the extra money which is a drop in the ocean to what he is getting anyway, let him get a solicitor etc as its up to him to chase it. Dont waste yr money on legal advice. Citizens advice is perfect for this!!

@ScrollingLeaves

Do it’s “Personally I’d say it’s fair for you to repay £2000 to each brother and keep the other £2000 as your share from the inheritance.”

That makes sense to me OP. You did say your mum had written down that she’d lent you the money, presumably before her dementia. So I think you should take it that she expected it back and you should pay it back.

If the £6000 were back in the pot, then that would be £2000 to each of you. So you owe them £2000 each.

I hope they haven’t had loans they are just keeping quiet about though.

If you read the posts the letter was requested by OP’s solicitor in the divorce process in the hope ex would pay his share. It wasn’t something DM wrote off her own bat.

But for that, there would be no record.

I should think it highly likely the brothers were loaned/given money too.

If you were your mums carer it makes your brothers seem pretty mealy mouthed but I have been really shocked myself about how people can behave around inheritance. You did a great thing for your mum caring for her. I think grief makes people very antagonistic and it would be a shame to have a big altercation with your brothers on top of the distress of losing your mum. It’s amazing how quickly after someone dies people will start behaving badly about money and laying claim but when that person was alive and help was needed they had much less to say then.

@DoolallyBinzes

I am the Executor of Mum’s will. Her estate (house) is equally shared between me and my 2 brothers. One brother wants me to pay the money back to the estate. He had independent Power of Attorney as did I but hasn’t mentioned this money until now. The house is being sold. I have been able to pay the money back over the last 5 years but I was looking after Mum’s account. Sadly she had dementia so totally forgot about the money. She did sign a letter saying she had lent the money to me and my husband.

I won't going to say that by this time the loan would be a statue barred debt that you wouldn't have to repay, because your mum hadn't asked for it - but if she had dementia in later life this may complicate things.

Having said that, the loan was with your mother, not her estate, so you are possibly not liable.

Why not post in legal and ask opinions there?

I should think it highly likely the brothers were loaned/given money too.

I'll bet they were, too!

When my mother died, my DS tried to hound me for £35 that I had owed my DM for an exercise bike - I could prove that I'd paid it, fortunately for me.

However, the car that she bought from my DM and hadn't paid for was, apparently, none of my business because it was an arrangement between her and DM.

I didn't pursue it, as I can't be arsed, but often wish I had, just out of devilment.

I think it's good you are paying it all back, I think it's the easiest and most sensible decision.

If you did owe it, you should not forgo half of it because of your ex. I can understand how your brain went there - especially as your solicitor tried to legally split the loan to get him to pay his moral share.

It would really sour my relationship with my brother if he did this, especially as you cared for your Mum for so long. It's miserly and your life circumstances sounds like they were dreadfully tough at the time. You gave a lot of yourself to look after your Mum when you didn't have much to share.

Be kind to yourself OP

Been there, got the t-shirt. Parents lived with us. I had to give up work a number of times post hospital stays, my siblings called once a fortnight. They live 17 miles away. When my father died my ds asked for his share of the rental deposit back when we gave up the bungalow we were forced to rent to keep him with us. The alleged sum? £6000. We had to pay his rent after he died plus damages from his mobility equipment. She asked for proof! None of my three siblings have school age children or mortgages. My brothers said if there was anything left it was mine. My sister accused me of theft and abuse. She wouldn't speak to me for two years until last Christmas when my younger brother had a terminal diagnosis. My father's care cost us £100k in lost earnings. Give your brother the £2000. Be the bigger person. It will make you feel better. I offered my sister the £500 and never got the courtesy of a response.

Tell your grasping brother to sod off!

I had the same situation. My aunt loaned me money to pay off my mortgage when I was diagnosed with breast cancer. She did not want the family to lose our home in case I did not survive. Fortunately, all turned out well with radiation.
I repaid some but she died before it was all repayed. Her other niece wanted it all paid back to the estate, but the lawyer said that the loan was person-to-person and if there was no written and signed document that I repay estate, then the debt died when one of us died.

My condolences OP your brother sounds like a bit of an arse.

@BillyTodd

I wonder if the brothers helped any with the care and looking after the estate of the mum while she had dementia. I'm guessing not. And they'll perhaps express insincere platitudes of thanks that OP did it, excuses why they would have done but couldn't, but the sad fact of the matter is that it's so often the daughters who do all the bloody care legwork, sacrifice their time, energy, career opportunities and money for zero payback. It makes me so angry how it is almost always left to the women and the men very rarely if ever even consider that they perhaps either help physically or financially, or recognise and give a % of their inheritance to the sibling who did all of the harrowing hard work.

Rant over. And before anybody misreads me I agree with what OP has decided to do. I entirely recognise that the brothers have zero obligation to, but wouldn't it be nice if they'd have written off the debt because the sister did everything (I'm assuming she did, it certainly sounds like she did the majority of it) and/or recognised her contribution with a financial contribution from their part of the estate to her.

Totally agree! And in reality they owe her a huge debt of gratitude as if she had not lovingly cared for their mother they would have had to sell the house to pay for the nursing home fees and that would have been very expensive. In reality the brothers probably owe the sister min £40k per year of round the clock care which also meant she could not have her own career. They should give her a portion which reflects this.

@MustardRose

Surely it's obvious?

Say the estate is worth £300k and is to be split three ways, or £100k each. You take £94k which leaves £206k for the other two, so they get £103k each.

Having said that, I think your brother is being a bit of a bastard.

Obviously not that obvious! I’m struggling to understand why so many people can’t do the arithmetic.

Your calculation would mean that the Op would only get £100k (the original £6k plus £94k), whilst the brothers would each get £103k!
She OBVIOUSLY then loses out!

If the estate was actually worth £300k, the proper calculation would be either -
a) The most OP repays the original £6k into the estate, making the estate worth £306k. Split 3 ways each get £102k or
b) The OP gives each brother £2k (each then has received 1/3 of the £6k in dispute). The estate (still worth £300k) is split 3 ways, giving each sibling £100k, meaning each sibling has got the same amount (£102k).

Totally agree! And in reality they owe her a huge debt of gratitude as if she had not lovingly cared for their mother they would have had to sell the house to pay for the nursing home fees and that would have been very expensive. In reality the brothers probably owe the sister min £40k per year of round the clock care which also meant she could not have her own career. They should give her a portion which reflects this.

Sorry, but did the OP name change? Where are you getting that she lovingly cared for the mum more than the brothers did?

“TatianaBis

ScrollingLeaves
Do it’s
“Personally I’d say it’s fair for you to repay £2000 to each brother and keep the other £2000 as your share from the inheritance.”

That makes sense to me OP. You did say your mum had written down that she’d lent you the money, presumably before her dementia. So I think you should take it that she expected it back and you should pay it back.

If the £6000 were back in the pot, then that would be £2000 to each of you. So you owe them £2000 each.

I hope they haven’t had loans they are just keeping quiet about though.
If you read the posts the letter was requested by OP’s solicitor in the divorce process in the hope ex would pay his share. It wasn’t something DM wrote off her own bat.

But for that, there would be no record.

I should think it highly likely the brothers were loaned/given money too.“

You were right TatianaBis, I see I hadn’t read all OP’s information.

It is different if the letter was only written because the lawyer requested it during the divorce.

In that case I don’t think your mother expected the money back. Also, as you were caring for her, it would be very understandable that she would have wanted to help you in return. ( A full time carer costs about £1000 per week I think - so imagine if she hadn’t had you.)

Your brother is being odd. I am sure your dm gave your siblings things too which they are conveniently forgetting.

Power of attorney died with your Mother btw

I'd ask Citizens Advice what your legal position is, but if you're not legally obliged to give your brother/s any money outstanding to your mother, I'd tell him to jog on.

As someone else stated earlier, your Mum had 10 years to insist you repaid and clearly she realised you couldn't, since she did not do so.

Your brother is being greedy. You needed help: your mother gave it. I expect if he's needed help too, she'd havedone the same for him.

Without knowing more about his circumstances it's impossible to tell, but I expect that as a single parent to 3 children, you need it more than he does!

The paperwork was for the Divorce settlement sadly the judge wasn’t interested so your mother just wanted to look after you she did not hold you to it . You looked after her when she needed you in return. You are leaving the cancer / ex behind in the past. Sorry your brother has let money reveal the ugly side and been so tactless of course you will do things with legal advice to the book and treasure your recovery and wonderful mother daughter relationship hold on to that let go of the bad misfortune past and do something wise with your mother’s savings she left you. At least you don’t have to share it with the ex going forward your mother would have been happy about that . My mother put her inheritance into my father’s business and he ran off with all the money by hiding it in his other woman’s estate . Too long to explain but stress from your Divorce , money worries is just toxic as u know. I think you are clear of that and it’s not worth letting your brother put you back into another battle. Your wiser and a survivor. Your grieving and all the drama your brother is creating is completely uncalled for considering what you have been through shame on him no wonder you were put in charge keep a steady nerve and get through it by keeping the peace with proper legal advice. Morally you’ve probably paid back in kind but as u know the legal profession is not interested in morals just learn the lesson going forward your in good prospects for your future and your mother would want you to enjoy that freedom.

I’m interested to know how much care your db provided.

Personally I wouldn’t pay it back. Your dm never asked and I am sure that is because she appreciated what you did for her.

In the US, the executor of a will is paid a percentage of the estate. Check with a lawyer/solicitor in your area. The percentage you would get for executor duties might well wipe out any debt your brothers think you owe. (Which you really do not.)

@GeorgiaGirl52

In the US, the executor of a will is paid a percentage of the estate. Check with a lawyer/solicitor in your area. The percentage you would get for executor duties might well wipe out any debt your brothers think you owe. (Which you really do not.)

This couldn't be more irrelevant. This isn't the US and executors don't get a percentage of the estate.

@GeorgiaGirl52

Everything you've posted is entirely nonsense.

She isnt in the U.S.

Executors over here do not get a percentage or fee or anything.

If you owe someone a debt here, and there is written proof that she does, and that person does, you still owe the estate that debt. It diesnt deisppear just because the person dies.

The mum wanted her whole estate split evenly between her children. That's what she has chosen to do. She also wanted that money paid back. So she wanted that money back and split evenly between her children.

Getting dementia and forgetting doesnt undo that, and her daughter shouldnt take advantage of her illness.