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A message from a trans friend. International Day Against Homophobia, Transphobia and Biphobia .....

999 replies

Biber · 18/05/2021 09:59

Apparently today is the International Day Against Homophobia, Transphobia and Biphobia...

I shall do my part, so here are a few things that might help others to understand better.

Everyone has to go to the toilet at some point. I think even for many non-trans people, public toilets are often only used as a last resort (has anyone ever actually been inside a "nice" public toilet?). This is also the case for trans people. No one uses them unless the really have to. Trans people aren't thinking about what's down there on other people or anything like that (only perverts are). Trans people just want to avoid making a stinking mess in their underwear, without having to prove what they themselves have (or haven't got) down there (i.e. some dignity would be nice). No one should feel uncomfortable doing their business and everyone is entitled to privacy. That applies to both trans and non-trans people. If someone does make you feel uncomfortable through their actions (not by how they dress or present themselves), then you should do something about it, because you in fact are likely not the only one who will be uncomfortable.
In short, why aren't all public toilets individual and completely private? Do spare a thought for those of us with more generalised anxiety disorders...

There are some people who are quite happy to include trans people once they have fully transitioned, i.e. undergone surgery. That's great, we just need to tell our doctors and the trust who is going to fund the surgery and the surgeons and the hospital where we will be having the surgery that they all need to bloody well hurry up so that we can have the surgery and be finally be included. Don't they realise that if we have to wait another year, we are going to continue to be excluded? That some people will still deny us the right to use certain facilities (the loo in some cases)? Forget the fact that it would be great to have the surgery as soon as possible so that we can be comfortable with ourselves and get on with our lives... So, trans people are being "temporarily excluded" because they cannot speed up a system (that they themselves so badly want to speed up), which is already under-resourced and overwhelmed saving people's lives.
Oh, and btw, trans people are aware that it isn't the surgery that finally makes them the other sex/gender. They know they are more likely to see a properly funded and resourced NHS under the Tories than they are to ever have children once they have had the surgery; that it's all a sort of compromise/this is the best that can be done with your body. But until or unless huge advances are made in medicine and surgery, this is the best that can be achieved for now. Well, it is better than nothing. After all, it hasn't even been 100 years yet since the first sex reassignment surgery was performed.

Of course, that is assuming all transgender people can have surgery, or even want surgery. As surprising as it may sound, transgender people come in all sorts - old and young, short and tall, all sorts of ethnicities, cool, boring, fun, smart, stupid... Oh, and they also differ in terms of their gender identities and presentation (the clue is after all in the term). Some of them might just not be very conventional in terms of their presentation and behaviour, have no interest in taking hormones, and definitely do not want surgery. Others will go all the way and do it so well that you will doubt they are telling the truth about them being trans, even as they shove a copy of their birth certificate and their baby pictures in your face. A lot of people are somewhere inbetween. One does have to wonder how a single term can be used to describe such a diverse range of people! With that in mind, I propose we rename it to "gender-diverse" (like "neuro-diverse"), because "diverse" seems like such a good word at the moment, right?

Trans people exist. Always have, always will. Everywhere. If you have a friend who is trans and is happy to speak to you about it and answer any questions you have, then do speak to them about it. This is important. Why? Because not all trans people are so happy or willing to talk about it. Why? Because how many times do you have to explain the same things over and over again to people who will, despite their best intentions, never really get it? To a society that at present, partly excludes you at best, and at worst tries to kill you. A society where your rights and existence are denied, where people don't believe you, and you spend a long time waiting in uncertainty. Speaking of uncertainty, trans people have one thing to thank covid-19 for: every single person in the world now knows what it is like to have their live on hold for a long period of time, faced with uncertainties in a situation far beyond their control, in a system that is not prepared to deal with them. Now you all have an understanding of what it is like emotionally to be trans (though without the gender bit), and I'm sorry because I would not have wished that even on my worst enemies (ok, well maybe for a few weeks at most for the worst of the worst).

And with that, I bid you all a happy International Day Against Homophobia, Transphobia and Biphobia!

OP posts:
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Rmka · 18/05/2021 11:31

@Biber, happy belated International Day Against Homophobia, Transphobia and Biphobia to you!

I hope one day the majority of people on Mumsnet will understand what you're talking about and show more compassion. The discrimination against trans people in 2021 is a disgrace.

Regarding the toilets in my opinion they should all be private and gender neutral, this way there's no exclusion and it's nicer for everyone.

And to some of the PPs - it's not true that female toilets are cleaner, I used to work as a cleaner and all toilets were disgusting. And giving equal rights to trans people is not taking rights away from others. Men used to tell that to women (and some still do). Educate yourself.

CuriousaboutSamphire · 18/05/2021 11:31

Or even yesterday, which actually was IDAHOBIT day! Grin

AlfonsoTheTerrible · 18/05/2021 11:31

On the basis I doubt any of the people getting their knickers in a knot have ever met a trans person, let alone been assaulted by one, I fear this is an issue which we will never convince them of.

Ah, yes. The famous:
1 It never happens.
2 Even if it does, it's only rarely.
3 When it does, it's not that bad.
4 Get over it.

UnluckyMe · 18/05/2021 11:31

@Eyesofdisarray

Patronising much??? Women don't object or persecute trans people, or attack or vilify them. We just want single sex- that's sex not gender- facilities, sports, refuges. Why don't you understand that women are infinitely more at risk of violence from men; and that trans-women retain male patterns of offences? Regarding the NHS: what about people waiting for operations? Cancer treatment? Mental health treatment? And you didn't mention gay/bisexual people either This reads like "educate yourselves" and I'm getting sick of it, really really sick of it
Hear hear 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
NativityDreaming · 18/05/2021 11:32

OP you and your friend may find this interesting and illuminating: m.youtube.com/watch?v=d2YZwK6TOaw

CuriousaboutSamphire · 18/05/2021 11:32

And giving equal rights to trans people is not taking rights away from others. Men used to tell that to women (and some still do). Educate yourself. Watch this year's Olympics and then come back and tell us how you are wrong.

Women's weight lifting specifically.

Educate yourself, indeed!

Caplin · 18/05/2021 11:33

@CuriousaboutSamphire I have a large number of good trans and non-binary friends, and I have seen the nonsense they have to put up with to just live their lives quietly. Frankly the stuff that people get upset about should be a non issue. They have been through enough and forcing transwomen into male spaces and vice versa is wrong.

Ihatefish · 18/05/2021 11:33

But it’s not about ACtual assaults. It about people being comfortable and feeling safe. A high number of women have been raped or sexually abused as adults and children. It’s about not feeling safe pulling your knickers down in an enclosed often nearly deserted space near a person with a penis. I don’t have a problem if people have had full surgery using facilities which match their genitals. But women have a right to feel safe.

5zeds · 18/05/2021 11:33

Only got as far as the toilet point. People aren’t opposed to trans people using the toilet of the opposites sex. They’re opposed to anyone using the toilet of the opposite sex. It’s not a trans issue. Let’s stop pretending it is. this exactly. As ds’s main carer we haven’t used either male or female only toilets for years as I would intrude in the gents and he would in the ladies. It isn’t a trans issue it’s a sex issue. These are sex exclusive areas and as I have to send my other children in solo I’m very pro keeping them that way.

BrumBoo · 18/05/2021 11:34

@Caplin met plenty of trans and gender nonconformist. Much like I've met many Christians and Muslims. Some anti-vaxxers. Possibly some Flat Earthers as well. Just because I don't agree with their personal and very deeply held beliefs, doesn't mean I deny them or disrespect them. I just fundamentally disagree with their certain beliefs which I find to be anything from strangely illogical to flat out offensive. Individuals are entitled to their individual beliefs, they are not entitled to try and implement it on to the rest of society, especially with zero proof or tangibility of its existence. It does nothing but cause a regressive, harmful society to build our laws and actions around unproven belief systems.

GreyhoundG1rl · 18/05/2021 11:34

@MaxNormal

To a society that at present, partly excludes you at best, and at worst tries to kill you. A society where your rights and existence are denied, where people don't believe you

The experience of women, right there.

The irony...
Still peddling "the most oppressed minority eveerrr" line. Never gets old.
Bluedeblue · 18/05/2021 11:34

Is there an International Heterosexual Day?

BuntyCarmichael · 18/05/2021 11:34

As usual the OP will plop back on later after of course getting screen shots for one of the many sites that hates women and say they been busy at work blah blah blah because that's what PLOPPERS do.

Tibtom · 18/05/2021 11:35

Educate yourself.

Many of us have and are horrified by the destruction of women's rights.

5zeds · 18/05/2021 11:35

AND just to ram the point home I am pretty sure there are far more carers caring for the opposite sex than trans people who are bent on accessing female toilets.

ANewDawnANewDay · 18/05/2021 11:35

@IsThePopeCatholic

The day women are no longer attacked or killed by men, I’ll support mixed sex toilets. Until then, I’ll keep my spaces safe.
This!!
IsThePopeCatholic · 18/05/2021 11:35

Maybe there should be a government campaign to show men how to keep their toilets clean, then all biological men would be able to use men’s toilets.

Op, are you there?

2020in2020 · 18/05/2021 11:37

Any suggestions on how we tackle homophobia or biphobia OP? Or do they not matter?

PronounssheRa · 18/05/2021 11:37

OP, I agree with you, but on Mumsnet there is no empathy for trans people, just dogma for a risk which is miniscule at best.

How many women and girls need to be harmed or excluded from public life for the risk to become less acceptable to you?
1, 10, 20, 100?

Wishbonebutterfly · 18/05/2021 11:38

Why does this always focus on transwomen? Transmen seem to just get on with things. It’s always the furore about transwomen. When we talk about trans that’s always what we seem to mean, the poor transwomen.
After seeing Laurel Hubbard being allowed to enter the Olympics in the female category whilst we all tiptoe around the fact that it’s horribly unfair for fear of being labelled transphobic, I become more and more convinced that the trans agenda is more about shutting up women and eroding their rights than anything else.
Transwomen are one of the most protected groups in society. How ridiculous to suggest that men can self Id as women and then enter female only spaces. The whole thing makes me full of rage.

A message from a trans friend. International Day Against Homophobia, Transphobia and Biphobia .....
CuriousaboutSamphire · 18/05/2021 11:39

[quote Caplin]@CuriousaboutSamphire I have a large number of good trans and non-binary friends, and I have seen the nonsense they have to put up with to just live their lives quietly. Frankly the stuff that people get upset about should be a non issue. They have been through enough and forcing transwomen into male spaces and vice versa is wrong.[/quote]
And forcing women into single sex spaces with men is wrong and the EA2010 is quite clear, no matte what TRAs and Stonewall might say.

Again you have missed the point.

That 'nonsense' they have to put up with is the natural consequence ANYONE has when they step outside societal norms, like tatoos, piercings, going naked. The point is to ask society to acknowledge and accept what it will. Not to demand that it does and to persist even when you are told you are scaring people.

Which is why those with even the most extreme tattoos and piercings are becoming more the accepted, and going naked is not!

Ask those TRAs/StonewallAs to shut the fuck up and let society find it's own level, as it used to, for accepting transwomen in female spaces.

All that is happening now is that the TRA/Stonewall behaviour is closing doors that useed to be open, shutting down that tacit agreement.

Point you finger of blame where it really belongs - male behaviour and TRA/Stonewall agitation and lies!

ghostyslovesheets · 18/05/2021 11:39

As a woman I just love being edumacated on oppression and stuff Hmm

Claire4567 · 18/05/2021 11:40

The T with the T and fuck everyone else it would seem.

BlackForestCake · 18/05/2021 11:42

Is it me or is International Day Against Transphobia celebrated roughly every three weeks?

CuriousaboutSamphire · 18/05/2021 11:42

Come on @Rmka

Now you have seen a picture of Laurel Hubbard explain to me how some female weight lifters have not had their right to compete taken from them .

Come on! Stand by your words. Look at Laurel, Google Laurel and come back and tell us how all is well and nobody has lost anything by allowing Laurel to compete in female weight lifting.

As usual I shall not hold my breath!