You just cannot talk about Palestine on this forum

[Faffandahalf]

Why has the last thread been taken down with a ‘goady op’ message?
What’s so goady about asking why we can’t criticise the actions of Israel?
Don’t even give a shit this is a TAAT and will get zapped.

Palestine exists. Ethnic cleansing is happening. And every single thread gets taken down.

Only one person on that thread shouted anti semitism. Every one else was mostly in agreement about what is happening and it still gets zapped.

I’ll once again direct people to friends of al Aqsa on Instagram and Twitter in the hopes people see this and would like some real information.

Israel is an occupying oppressor committing genocide and the Palestinians are an oppressed people. There is no comparison in the force power and might of these two groups esp when one has the backing and funding of the US.

Seriously pissed at MN for refusing to allow truths to be told about the situation

@WhyDontWe

I think it’s an extremely important aspect of current world affairs which more people need to understand.

The narrative of bad Palestinians bullying poor Israel has gone on too long.

Evil exists on both sides and calm and rational discussion on sites like this is extremely important.

The other area I’m trying to learn a lot about is Afghanistan as that is another utter clusterfuck and I suspect in a few years the impact of the US policy in Afghanistan (for past 40 years) is going to have major worldwide consequences. (And yes the Taliban are evil, but the road to giving them the opportunity to rule needs to be understood to see that they are a result, not the cause, of the US policy - which was driven initially by Cold War strategy). USSR very culpable too.

I am just going to leave this here. This is Hamas firing missiles towards Tel Aviv. But by all means - go and tell all these poor people running to bomb shelters that they are bullying Palestinians. No wonder this country is full of anti semites - they are right here on this thread.

twitter.com/kann_news/status/1392182923277766659?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1392182923277766659%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_c10&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fmignews.com%2Fmobile%2Farticle.html%3Fid%3D110521_212424_73947

@Quincie

The USA is the most powerful country in the world. There are many more Jews in the US than Palestinians and they fund Israel (happy to be corrected) so for the sake of the future of young Palestinians the Palestinians need to be pragmatic and accept the situation. Possibly they would given the chance but whilst Saudi is funding Hamas to keep things going that can't happen, but it is at the expense of Palestinian lives. This would not be right or fair but Palestinians deserve decent lives somewhere else.

There are many more Jews in the US than Palestinians and they fund Israel...

Instead of making things up, posting as if they're fact, then adding "happy to be corrected", it might be a good idea to check your facts first.

Israel is one the wealthiest countries on the planet, by GDP/capita.

Wealthier than the UK, UAE, France, etc., etc.

They're not funded by the US.

I don’t see this thread but have seen others taken down for what there was no real explanation

Once again Palestinians are being moved or rather pushed aside for an Israeli settlement

How can that possibly be considered fair or right

Acidburn

I find your passive aggressive accusation of anti Semitism to us posters to be offensive and quite frankly racist.

As I said, targeting civilians and children and places of worship by any side is a violation of human rights. The issue here is not who is to blame for the feud. The issue here is, the Palestinian side IS being condemned for these violations. We are asking for the same condemnation to Israel for the same - or more appalling, more impactful, more effective violations.

It doesn’t matter who you think is to blame. We want boundaries to “retaliation”. On both sides. And those boundaries to be asserted by the countries in power.

@Acidburn that's shocking!

I think it was you who posted about family in Israel on the deleted thread?

I hope they're safe and well.

@Faffandahalf

I agree it’s a disgrace

The only solution I can see would be a pan Arab approach that guarantees Israel’s security and recognises a Palestinian government. However, there is no appetite for that. Egypt keeps its border with Gaza closed and is a deeply repressive and corrupt state. Syria is a failed state and Saudi Arabia is pushing its own agenda. The shadow of ISIS lurks in the background.
DH is North African and has nothing positive to say about Egypt or Saudi Arabia.

Israel is also at fault. The US needs to step in and say enough is enough.

Unfortunately both the Israeli and Palestinian authorities seem to define themselves in the context of the struggle for existence. So the power structures are predicated on the the struggle continuing. The ordinary people seem to have been forgotten.

@SofiaMichelle thank you so much! Yes, that was me. I am absolutely terrified for my famipy and friends - it is bad at the moment, they just closed the airspace.

JustFedUp
I think Afghanistan and Syria are effectively the Cold War by proxy. The big powers are still slugging it out but in other people’s countries with all the death and destruction that brings.

@piddocktrumperiness

I'm British Palestinian and for the life of me cannot understand the double standards and hypocrisy when it comes to airing views on the volatile region. I am sick of the conflation of antisemitism with anti Israeli. One is a religion the other a government. I feel gaslight every time I voice my concern over the situation in the region and utter the word Israel.

Enough is Enough.

It invalidates my family's experiences, my views, saying that we don't exist. Israel came to us. We were always there. I do not want a two state solution because I think we might muck it all up. I want to live, alongside all my Israeli cousins, in peace AND be regarded as AN EQUAL- EQUAL to them. That unfortunately, won't happen- in an apartheid state, a fundamentally racist one.

How can someone evict a family that has been there for 70 plus years for the reason that 'God' gave them the land??? Since when was God into real estate??

I agree that we Palestinians are not perfect either and goodness knows how much I detest Hamas and Hizbollah. I don't trust the neighbouring arab countries either and wouldn't trust the Saudi's or anyone in the gulf with anything.

So what needs to happen is the US needs to finally FINALLY hold the Israeli govt accountable and put repercussions in place. They also need to do something about the evangelical Christians while they're at it who perpetuate the blind support for the govt- laughable really considering how that slaps the faces of Christian Palestinians.

The British govt have blood on their hands and will never admit that, admit they botched this whole thing up from the get go- Boy do they love their straight lines on maps. Will they hold the Israeli govt to account- Not in my life time.

Great post I am 100% with you.

@Acidburn

I hope your family and friends are safe too. No one needs to be enduring this trauma any longer. I really dislike Hamas but I'd like to add that this does not let the IDF nor the Israeli govt off. Hamas targets civilians, that's their MO- not holding a govt to account feeds into their hatred only perpetuates their belief that Israel is evil when it is not, it is the actions of the gov, that fuels hatred on both sides- this gives Hamas ammunition. So let's not give it to them. Let's hold the govt to account, call a spade a spade, be allowed to talk about all of this, freely.

I want this all to end.

Our children did not ask to be born into this.

Enough is Enough

@JustFedUpOfThis. Israel is a democracy (unlike most of the countries in the region), and they've supported these policies over many years.

Sadly, if/when the tables turn at some point in the future, and they surely will given demographics and tech, I doubt Israel itself will be treated any better.

It's never a great topic for English people to discuss though given our history, even in recent decades.

Ok a few things. I was on the thread that got deleted. Most of us were talking/ debating fine on both sides. But there were 1 or 2 posters who were being downright goady and I agree with @SimonJT, there were at least 1 poster basically saying muslims want to turn everything into Islamic state. That's what the main issue is they actually mentioned.
I unfortunately did not see any replies after my last post as by the time I went back on, it had gotten deleted.
What I did say is that condemning Israel is not being anti semite as that was also bandied about alot.
I have no issues with any race or religion as long as they are as respectful to me as I am to them.
I have friends from all walks of life.
I however do have issues when I mention that I feel that Palestinians are being bullied right now and none of the leaders seem to say anything.

They are quick to say " both sides" yet when it is Hamas, then the blame is solely with Hamas.
Or you get people start talking about what happened 50 years ago as defence.
I was not there, I do not know, I have heard from both sides and they equally say they are right.
Either way 2 wrongs do not make a right.
Also Palestinians have a right to live there as well as Jews, why are they being evicted from their homes?

Here here Faff. If I could like comments here I'd 'like' every one of your posts here a hundred times over. And Samphire also. What's happening is atrocious. It is genocide and most of the worlds governments just sit idly by as they are too chummy chum chums with the prime minister of Israel.

[quote SoftParade]@JustFedUpOfThis. Israel is a democracy (unlike most of the countries in the region), and they've supported these policies over many years.

Sadly, if/when the tables turn at some point in the future, and they surely will given demographics and tech, I doubt Israel itself will be treated any better.

It's never a great topic for English people to discuss though given our history, even in recent decades.[/quote]
Ironically it seems that Netanyahu has cranked up the heat in order to shore up support from the hardliners in the upcoming elections. Sometimes democracy doesn’t produce the best governments.

@Acidburn
I really feel for your family. No one should have to live through this. I cannot even begin to imagine how fearful they must feel going about their normal lives.

@Lottie2shoes thank you so much!

@Quincie

Happy to be corrected - Arab countries like Saudi are the richest in the world but Palestinians who are also Arab are left in refugee camps, imv, to continue to maintain the Israel conflict. Why don't rich aArab countries sort out the difficult lives that Palestinians have to live. Put the Pal people first . They prefer to see them miserable. If Arabs won't help them the Palestinians should be working towards a truce and move on.

The Palestinians are in refugee camps (more like permanent settlements) because they uphold that they have the right to return to home to Palestine. Many of them still have the keys to their former properties in what is now Israel. Under international law, refugees have the right to return home.

Again, more "What about the Arab governments?" We know they are all trash, but the discussion is about Israel and Palestine. Other countries being poorly run does not mean Israel is not accountable to international law and human rights treaties.

@Lauren15, you are right about democracy isn't always what we wish for, Trump being a recent classic example.

But even in our own own case I'd never heard of that incident below until reading it earlier. Now I understand the context of the recent amnesty proposal. It's all democracy I guess ...

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/may/11/the-ballymurphy-shootings-36-hours-in-belfast-that-left-10-dead

Israelis and Palestinians have one shared situation.

Israelis are up against it every day. Significant powers in the region want to crush and annihilate the entire population.

Palestinians are also up against it every day. Significant powers in the region also want to crush and annihilate the entire population.

@MyOctopusFeature seems to have hit the nail on the head as far as I can see (from my admittedly limited understanding).

I don’t know why this comment 'God' gave them the land??? Since when was God into real estate?? makes me feel uncomfortable, but it does. Maybe it’s the dismissiveness of the Jewish faith? Isn’t the whole area contested because of faith on both sides?

@MyOctopusFeature nice sound bite but unfortunately massively oversimplified to the point that it bears no resemblance to the truth.

Let’s think about the average Palestinian in Gaza, compared to the average Israeli in Tel Aviv...
and the death rates
The prison sentences
Education and literacy rates
Who gets kicked out of their family homes
Who gets their land taken or a massive wall put in the middle of their grazing land.

It’s not a balanced situation at all.

I don’t know why this comment 'God' gave them the land??? Since when was God into real estate?? makes me feel uncomfortable, but it does. Maybe it’s the dismissiveness of the Jewish faith? Isn’t the whole area contested because of faith on both sides?

No it really isn’t. Making it faith based for the Palestinians is quite dismissive of their human rights, and very othering.

don’t know why this comment 'God' gave them the land??? Since when was God into real estate?? makes me feel uncomfortable, but it does. Maybe it’s the dismissiveness of the Jewish faith? Isn’t the whole area contested because of faith on both sides?

Palestinian people owned homes that were seized or demolished. They were sent away from their homes and country, on threat of death.

This situation has very little to do with religion or race; EVERYTHING to do with power, land, rights.