You just cannot talk about Palestine on this forum

[Faffandahalf]

Why has the last thread been taken down with a ‘goady op’ message?
What’s so goady about asking why we can’t criticise the actions of Israel?
Don’t even give a shit this is a TAAT and will get zapped.

Palestine exists. Ethnic cleansing is happening. And every single thread gets taken down.

Only one person on that thread shouted anti semitism. Every one else was mostly in agreement about what is happening and it still gets zapped.

I’ll once again direct people to friends of al Aqsa on Instagram and Twitter in the hopes people see this and would like some real information.

Israel is an occupying oppressor committing genocide and the Palestinians are an oppressed people. There is no comparison in the force power and might of these two groups esp when one has the backing and funding of the US.

Seriously pissed at MN for refusing to allow truths to be told about the situation

[quote Lottie2shoes]@AnnieLofriar
I feel for your family. That is so sad for them.
Which is why I also feel sad for the Palestinians.
1 thing i would like to ask though as i am unsure of this. The current people living in their houses, are the ones that kicked them out? If they are then they most definitely need to give the houses back if this is what happened.
If it is the government or someone else though, I am unsure as to what I feel should be done because they too have lived in this house and created memories. Just as it was not right for your family,I don't think it is right for them to be kicked also.
But I honestly do not know what the solution is here.[/quote]
Thank you. I certainly also feel for the Palestinians and their plight. While I think the situation by 1947/8 had become 'us or them' in the civil war. there's no doubt that the creation of the State of Israel was a catastrophe for the Palestian people (although I similarly have no doubt that it would have been the same or worse for the Jews if they had won - the massacres and displacements where Arabs did hold or win territory are testament to that such as in Kfar Etziyon massacre, the Hasassah medical convoy masscre or the Old City of Jerusalem ethnic cleansing).

Recognizing the suffering of the Palestinians due to the creation of Israel is an important first step in my opinion. I grew up with a narrative that the Palestinians had all just voluntarily left. It didn't quite make sense to me at the time (all sounded way too convenient) and, of course, the truth is far more complex - some fled in fear, some were forced out.

Sheikh Jarrah is complicated. Yes, the houses did belong to Jews who were ethnically cleansed during the Jordanian occupation. Jerusalem is also annexed to Israel and the people living in those houses have full Israeli civil rights. THe houses did belong to Jews, the tenants do not own the houses. The courts had told the tenants that they should declare themselves 'protected tenants' due to the length of time they had lived there and then they couldn't be evicted for non payment of rent. But to do that would be to acknowledge the hosues do not belong to them. While the tenants had been prepared to do this, the cause was hijacked (surprise surprise) for political purposes. The tenants were evicted for refusing to pay rent or to allow themselves to be protected tenants. However, where I have a problem with this all is the hypocrisy. In West Jerusalem, there are also many houses which used to be owned by Arabs. There was a law passed in 1950 which turned all the property of those who had fled into state property (yes, I do see the injustice in this but again, in the context of the time I can also understand it). This means that even Palestinians living in Jerusalem with Israeli residency rights couldn't demand the return of their own property in the same way since that property had been turned into state property in 1950. So were the evictions legal? Well, yes they were as rent hadn't been paid to the legal owners. But I do also think they underlined the injustice of the law and the hypocrisy involved and the Israeli government should have intervened to leave well alone since it would clearly ignite problems.

Sorry this may sound goady but how can you call Palestinians anti semite when they are also descended from semites, would that make them anti anti semite. 🤔 They'd kinda cancel each other out then

It's a red herring because antisemitism does not mean hostility to Semites, it means hostility to Jews. That's all it's ever meant since the term was invented.

A point I would like to also point out is that does anyone not think it strange that Benjamin Netanyahu was on his way out by the sounds of it and suddenly he started showing his hand of attacking Palestine and now it seems he will be staying in power much longer. Seems to be this
"war" was very political on his part. A means for him to gain support from his national parties to stay in power

Exactly - though I didn't find it strange, just highly predictable. A well used tactic.
This was all started by the Israeli Government - and now they are bleating 'their security'. Heard this so many times.

@DeepThinkingGirl i absolutely believe lands grabbing need to stop

It needs to be reversed - not just stopped.

@StoneofDestiny oh, so you think its best to take homes away from the Jewish kids as a revenge then? Nice one.

Acidburn
I think that land and homes need to be returned to Palestinians by the illegal expansion of Jewish settlements. To not do that is to continue to break International law and ignore Human Rights.
It's not beyond the wit of 'man' to do this.
As I said previously, huge international efforts are going into repatriating art work and property stolen by the Nazis from Jewish families during WW2. Rightly so. Surely much more essential right now is to return homes and land stolen much more recently by the Israeli Government from Palestinians.
It was this action that triggered what is an escalating tragedy right now.

Oh and acid burn, turn off the Jewish kids and revenge language - it's as low a blow as anti semitism accusation when critical thinking people are on here talking about natural law, international law and human rights.
It doesn't work on us, and you've been populating the whole thread with such tactics.
If you can't think fair minded, you can't think.

@Adventureswith

The only way to get rid of Hamas is to start treating Palestinians as humans, with equal rights to Israelis, and give them an alternative. Not to bomb Gaza and kill hundreds of civilians, politicising the next generation and the next and the next.

^^ This.

Successive Israeli governments have been trying for years to push Palestinians out of the Holy City of Jerusalem, and the latest round of Israeli attacks fall in line with that goal. But to understand the roots of the current escalation — and the possible threat of all-out war — one must examine the U.S.-backed, foundational Israeli government policy of using strategies of “terror and expulsion” in an effort to expand its territory by killing and displacing Palestinians, Noam Chomsky 2021 May

Zionist policies since have been opportunistic. When possible, the Israeli government — and indeed the entire Zionist movement — adopts strategies of terror and expulsion. When circumstances don’t allow that, it uses softer means. A century ago, the device was to quietly set up a watchtower and a fence, and soon it will turn into a settlement, facts on the ground. The counterpart today is the Israeli state expelling even more Palestinian families from the homes where they have been living for generations — with a gesture toward legality to salve the conscience of those derided in Israel as “beautiful souls.” Of course, the mostly absurd legalistic pretenses for expelling Palestinians (Ottoman land laws and the like) are 100 percent racist. There is no thought of granting Palestinians rights to return to homes from which they’ve been expelled, even rights to build on what’s left to them.

Israel’s 1967 conquests made it possible to extend similar measures to the conquered territories, in this case in gross violation of international law, as Israeli leaders were informed right away by their highest legal authorities
Chomsky 2021 May.

In September 2019 The Guardian 'predicted'

Benjamin Netanyahu’s plans to annex Palestinian territory in the occupied West Bank – and, crucially, seize the bread basket of the Jordan valley – if he wins the Israeli election next week are not only illegal under international law but would, if enacted, make peace impossible in the Holy Land. Neither of these things appears to bother Mr Netanyahu, who refuses to recognise the Palestinian right to national self-determination and statehood

If children in Palestine had equal rights to a similar level of education, medicine and jobs as their oppressors then a large amount of the violence would disappear - just like it has in NI and both sides could co-exist but they have to be treated the same

Exactly - equal rights to housing, healthcare and travel.

The Israeli Government could not be doing what it is now if it was not for the financial and political backing of the USA.

What is said about Hamas was said about the PLO, about the Intifida, about BDS, about Naji al-Ali, Hanan Ashrawi, Dr Pauline Cutting, Rachel Corrie, Tom Hurdnall, Rouzan al-Najjar, Amnesty International, War on Want, Action Aid and countless more.

I've heard years of the same old stuff. Anyone who speaks out is an antisemite, any Jews who speak out are self hating.

Nothing is ever acceptable except the Palestinians conceding to their own dehumanisation and extinction.

@StoneofDestiny i really enjoyed reading your one sided bullsh*t. Just proves how much hate you have inside of you - maybe consider a therapy.

Acidburn
More emotive language from you that cannot challenge fact.
I hate nobody, not even you.

Why should non-citizens be given equal rights to citizens?

Israel and Palestine are not one country.

There are 1.9 million Palestinian citizens of Israel (as of December 2019), comprising 21% of Israel’s population

There are more than 60 Israeli laws that discriminate against Palestinian citizens of Israel.

There’s a lot of one sided anti Israeli PR going on on this thread

31 Palestinian children dead now, and that will only rise .

@StoneofDestiny

Acidburn More emotive language from you that cannot challenge fact. I hate nobody, not even you.

Bullshit.

Remember, we are all watching what you post in this thread.

@Ikeasucks

There’s a lot of one sided anti Israeli PR going on on this thread

No there’s not.

We have yet to hear any cogent argument justifying Israel’s actions. Because there isn’t one. The Israeli government’s actions are disgraceful and I hope one day they are tried for war crimes.

Remember, we are all watching what you post in this thread

Who are you? Mossad?

Crack on then.

www.btselem.org/ is an Israeli human rights organisation for those who are interested.