To be cross with our childminder?

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Name changed.

DD has been going to the same childminder since she was 8 months and she is now 2.5. She absolutely loves it there and she's very kind and friendly, I get lots of crafts home that DD does and they go out and do a lot.

DD is going through a challenging phase, not doing as she's told, very stubborn, sometimes hitting and biting.

When I picked her up on Friday, the childminder said that she had taken her shoes and socks off in the car and was refusing to put them back on, so she took her out the car and put him on the (wet and muddy) ground in her bare feet and told her basically that's what you get for not putting your shoes on. She apparently got upset by this and then finally allowed her to put her shoes back on.

I was a bit taken aback by this, AIBU to tell her I am not happy about this at all? I'm not sure if this is an ok tactic to use with a toddler but I never would and don't want anyone else to treat her like that either.

You mean actions have consequences is a bad thing for a toddler to learn? I'm sorry but that's exactly what needed to happen. I've never liked accepting bad behaviour simply because of something like a child's age or a 'phase'.

My own DD at around 7 or 8 was starting to refuse to move her arse and get her school uniform on and mornings were becoming hellish. Me yelling at her to eat her breakfast, brush her teeth, get dressed etc instead of sitting doing nothing or trying to put the tv on.

One morning we were going to be late so I physically dragged her to the car, barefoot in her pyjamas. I drove her to school, kicking off in the back seat and told her to get out. She was so horrified at the thought of being hauled into school in her pyjamas that she never ever dared pull that shit again. She put the uniform on that I had brought with us and that was the end of it.

She's a teen now and completely self sufficient getting up for school. She's often up before I am and has never been late for school.

So they needed to get out of the car, DD point blank refused to put her shoes and socks on. Childminder eventually said fine, have it your own way and DD learned through experience why she needs to wear them. Seems a good, harmless lesson to me. Not punishment or discipline, just a natural consequence of DDs choice and behaviour.

What would you have preferred? The other choices as far as I can see were only 1. Pin her down and fight her to bet her shoes on - unacceptable. 2. Negotiate and bribe her for as long as it took 3. Carry her like a spolt princess.

Well hopefully it will have helped her learn to do as she's told go your childminder. What wishy washy approach would you have taken?

Dont think the OP is coming back.

I would say yabu. Not like kid was made to walk with no shoes on.... It was a brief thing to make the kid want the shoes on. Bit of a non event

Good luck on the next 16 years Op eh

Excellent use of natural consequences. I would be fine if my childminder did this.

I think very reasonably done. She now understands the ‘why’ behind the instruction.

YANBU I agree with you, OP. This is clearly punishing behaviour, not some sort of inevitability or “natural consequence” (what?! So if I decide I don’t want my shoes and socks on, someone much bigger than me is going to force me to stand on cold muddy ground?!). There were other ways of dealing with the incident, which I wouldn’t even notice if my son did... so what if he doesn’t want his shoes and socks on? What’s the big deal if he’s in the car? Or I’d just be trying to think about what the bigger picture is: is the child tired/hungry/overwhelmed? It’s interesting that you mention your daughter is going through a tricky phase and it makes me wonder whether this punishment was done out of anger/irritation at the child, and I’d be wondering if I were you whether this sort of physically retributive (“that’s what you get”) behaviour towards your child is happening in other ways under the childminder’s care (which might help to explain some of her own frustrated physical acting out like hitting and biting). For me, Janet Lansbury is queen of dealing with moments of toddler stubbornness and I’d be looking for a childminder with a childcare practice and philosophy more aligned with my own.

Seems like a very sensible childminder. Your child learned safely and through direct experience why she needs to wear shoes outside. It wasn’t a punishment, your daughter learned with no need for cajoling/ shouting/ threats.

I doubt your DD will try being awkward again over shoes and socks again. Or else its going to be a constant battle every time in the car. Your CM did the right thing.

Childminder dealt with it perfectly imo. What would you have done OP?

I'm with the childminder. Natural consequence.

Its always difficult when someone else disciplines your child as a parent you want to defend and protect your child. As the childminder is caring for your child she obviously felt that was the right thing to do at that given time. If your child is having behavioural problems are you working with the childminder to discuss ways of managing it? I find my childminder so helpful as an outsider for advice on any challenging behaviour my child has and we work together as best we can. I know it sounds awful you child stood in cold wet and muddy ground but the outcome had the right result with no harm done.

I think its perfectly acceptable a d it worked. Children are not in charge, adults are. They have to learn this and she was not in any way harmed.

It might be something a parent would do, but it's way out of line for a child minder.

@BarryFromEastenders you're going to find the next few years very tiring if you put that level of introspection into every tiny incident when your dc doesn't do as they're asked. God help you when they reach the teenage years and God help their poor teachers when they start school.

Sounds like an appropriate way to teach a toddler why they need shoes and socks on. As long as her feet were wiped clean and dry before putting the shoes and socks on, I don't see the problem.

@BarryFromEastenders nobody’s going to make you stand anywhere, you’re an adult. We’re talking about a toddler, who has learnt that adults don’t insist on shoes because they’re bullies, they insist on shoes because a) they offer protection against cold mud, and b) it’s the responsibility of adults to keep children safe.

And I’d suggest that leaving a toddler alone in a car while the CM takes the other children wherever they were going is a much bigger deal than a couple of seconds standing barefoot!

YANBU I agree with you, OP. This is clearly punishing behaviour, not some sort of inevitability or “natural consequence” (what?! So if I decide I don’t want my shoes and socks on, someone much bigger than me is going to force me to stand on cold muddy ground?!)

Rubbish! They needed to get out of the car. Staying in the car wasnt an option. In your example, how would you get out of the car and into the house?

I don’t think the childminder ‘did’ anything to the child. The child refused to put shoes and socks on, but they had things to do so childminder was ok with it and got on with the job of getting everyone out of the car, the toddler realised they wanted shoes on and childminder assisted child with this. You can’t force a child to keep shoes on. They may have been on a school/nursery run and needed to be moving. The child is allowed to make decisions about their own body, in this case it was no shoes, then shoes.

I think it’s petty to bring this up and you risk ruining a good childcare relationship

Your childminder did the right thing.Your daughter wouldn't have been too cold for just a couple of minutes. Now she knows she has to wear shoes and socks.

Having muddy feet for a few minutes on a cold day is never going to kill your child.

Maybe I am being precious/overreacting. That was the whole point to my post.

To me, it seemed punishing and the thought of my daughter being uncomfortable or cold isn't a pleasant one. In life, the consequence of not wanting to wear socks or shoes is not a person much bigger than you forcing you onto the wet, cold, dirty ground.

I would have put DD in the buggy (which she often goes in).

I love our CM and think shes brilliant, I just wanted to make sure I was reacting in the correct way before saying anything.

I am not wishy-washy with DD at all, her current behaviour has me at a loss because her poor behaviour always comes with consequence.

God help their poor teachers when they start school.

Absolutely!