Moral Dilemma

[freerunner75]

My partner and I have been together 12 years. Both married previously, my marriage ended horrifically, my husband blew a tonne of my savings and left me in £25k debt. My partners marriage was similar, his ex left with an extremely large settlement.

We moved in together to a rented place with a view to buying something together. His marital home was sold to settle the divorce agreement, but he had one other property in his name at the time which he kept and rented out. The house we now live in - was bought at an extremely low rate from family. I had no say in this and was not given the option to be a part of it as he classes it as his 'inheritance' and is protective over the equity given what happened with his divorce. I pay half towards the bills and we have both designed and improved the house since we have been here - i have paid for only soft furnishings and a few bits of furniture as I earn a lot less than him and most of my money goes towards the bills and my kids. The house we live in has tripled in value since we have been here and made improvements.

So, we are not married, no mortgage together, no life insurance for each other, nothing. Together 12 years.

The whole lack of financial security is a big issue to me and has caused us endless arguments over the years. But he won't budge. Recently we had a huge bust up and I was looking into my options but they are few given my current situation and budget limitations.

Am willing to take a bashing on this - however am I being unreasonable to request for him to set aside some money for me in case our relationship does break down irretrievably so that I have a safety net? I was thinking perhaps £1000 per year for every year we have lived together - signed and agreed by both and by a solicitor so we both know where we stand?

I am currently earning more than I have for a while and am starting to be able to save again - but my biggest concern is that if we do finish.. i am out on the streets with nothing to my name despite contributing for years... yet he is sitting pretty. I know it sounds bloody awful, but it would take a lot of stress off me and our relationship and I don't think I am being unreasonable.

But I am expecting to be told that I am..... thoughts please.

[quote Fixitup2]@musingloud £600 for 3 people’s bills and food is not a lot at all.[/quote]
From previous comments it sounds like food costs are separate from that £600?. £600 minus food is absolutely enormous!

She also works for her partner's business for free

And if this bit is true he owes a serious amount of back pay for her time doing this!

My biggest concern would be what happens if he dies? Are you in his will to inherit or would you have to leave the house with just a sofa? Do you have children together?
You've given him 12 years of your life, if he dumps you tomorrow you're left with nothing. Can you put it like that to him? Tell him how vulnerable you feel, not that you want half the house signed over but you just want to have some security if he were to leave you or to die? Surely if you loved someone you'd want them to be ok and make provision for them?

I don't think the step dad who doesn't pay for his step children's holiday abroad while his children are going multiple holidays would give you the money just because you want security.
You need to start saving, at least you didn't have to pay any rent or mortgage for nearly/over a decade.

OP are you still paying the debt from your ex husband?

Only paying 50% of the bills when you represent 3/4 of the household is insane and freeloading. I know you do some work for his company for free, but until those hours are enough to cover your fair share then not getting a wage is fair.

Look into buying your own house to either live in or to rent out.

He’s been clear that he isn’t going to trust anyone ever again and after 12 years still doesn’t really view you as his life-long partner, so I think you have to accept that’s his line in the sand. However, it doesn’t mean that you should carry on living as you have been. Stop paying towards his bills and start putting your money into buying your own place.

My DH had also been left high & dry by his ex and he was living in a 2 bed terraced house when we met. I moved from north to south so my house of a similar size was worth much less and after we’d been living together for 10 months, we sold our respective houses and bought a property together jointly. I contributed less than a third of the amount DH paid towards it. I also earn less.

Thankfully, he wasn’t a selfish git and didn’t insist on owning 2/3rds of the property but wanted us to own it jointly. He was clear that he viewed our relationship as a permanent one. We later had a child together then got married but I wouldn’t have hung around if he’d treated me as your ‘partner’ is doing to you.

Seriously, move out if he isn’t prepared to treat you as a long term investment!

Hi thanks for all your feedback. To clarify, there is a huge disparity in our income, he pays his mortgage and we split the bills with me paying 75% and him 25%. I pay my way so I wouldn't class it as rent free. I do the housework, cooking, shopping etc just like any other household.

I was living on my own in a rented place and supporting myself and my kids just fine before i took the leap and moved in with him - my security was meant to be us buying a place together and then hopefully getting married. Building our life and finances together as a team. I help him run his business and I put as much as I can towards things for the house. But no, i receive no money for my children from my ex husband and have only recently been able to increase my income. Majority of my income goes towards the house and my children. I pay for more than my share - except the actual physical mortgage.

I am not expecting him to fund my lifestyle at all - I managed before and if it comes down to it I will again - I know I have been foolish not agreeing sometihng at the beginning of all this but stupidly - i thought our plans were joint dreams.. clearly I was wrong. My heart ruled my head and yes now I am feeling very stupid.

I am not planning on asking him to sign this or any agreement/ and then upping sticks and leaving, its just that recent events hit home that in fact there should be something fair in place. As he is putting a roof over my head, equally he wouldn't have been able to live the life he has lead over the past 12 years without my financial input taking a lot of pressure of him. So how is that fair?

Thanks for your comments - good and bad! I appreciate it.

*I pay half towards the bills and we have both designed and improved the house since we have been here - i have paid for only soft furnishings and a few bits of furniture as I earn a lot less than him and most of my money goes towards the bills and my kids. The house we live in has tripled in value since we have been here and made improvements.

Are they his children as well, or just yours? Have you paid any rent? Have you and your children effectively been living in someone else's house rent free? If that is the case, then you have saved an enormous amount of money over the years. How much did you pay towards the improvements? Because if all you've done is buy soft furnishings, you don't have a leg to stand on.

Are the children not 18 and 20? Are they working/studying/claiming any benefits?

Does he give you a wage for running his business?

As he is putting a roof over my head, equally he wouldn't have been able to live the life he has lead over the past 12 years without my financial input taking a lot of pressure of him.

But you, by your own admission, only pay towards the bills and food. If you and your 2 children weren't living there, these would be substantially lower.

If you are paying half the council tax I'd stop and pay the difference between what you are paying and what he would pay as a single person. But to be honest you've had it pretty good not having to rent somewhere for you and your children.

One post says you pay half the bills
Other says 75%
Either way he's paying the mortgage on his own you're not paying any rent so yes you're living rent free.

equally he wouldn't have been able to live the life he has lead over the past 12 years without my financial input taking a lot of pressure of him

I bet he would. The bills for one person are significantly less than they are for four people and he’d be able to live in a smaller property. You’ve paid no rent for 12 years, it’s pretty obvious who’s been the beneficiary of this arrangement.

@BertramLacey

*I pay half towards the bills and we have both designed and improved the house since we have been here - i have paid for only soft furnishings and a few bits of furniture as I earn a lot less than him and most of my money goes towards the bills and my kids. The house we live in has tripled in value since we have been here and made improvements.

Are they his children as well, or just yours? Have you paid any rent? Have you and your children effectively been living in someone else's house rent free? If that is the case, then you have saved an enormous amount of money over the years. How much did you pay towards the improvements? Because if all you've done is buy soft furnishings, you don't have a leg to stand on.

I pay for more than my share - except the actual physical mortgage.

If you are paying 75% of the bills, and there are four of you, three of which you are responsible for, I don't understand how that is more than your share? If you were living somewhere else you'd still be doing the cooking, housework, etc.

I would think it more appropriate to say that you need to take the financial pressure off you a bit so you can make plans for your future and therefore you need to contribute less than you have been. If you agreed to halve your contribution (from £600 to £300) for 3 years, that would be a little over £10,000. That is certainty, and money in your pocket. I don't think any legal agreement you came to would be enforceable anyway if he decided he didn't want to honour the agreement.

My partner earns 10x more than I do and we split everything 50/50.
He did recently buy us a house (and I will contribute to the mortgage and bills) but that was because we had a baby. All the years we were together without the baby, I worked and saved and have my own property which I let out.

Sorry @BetramLacey, I quoted you by accident!

Tbh I’m in a similar situation. DP has suggested us moving in together and him paying the mortgage but that would give him more rights over any increase in the value of the property, even if I put in a substantial deposit.

Due to being on a low income I receive tax credits and if we moved in together that would stop, and I’d be beholden to him to support my low wages. As much as I don’t like being reliant on state support as a full time worker and single mum the help is there for me, so I’ll take it rather than put myself in a more precarious situation relying on a man.

As others have said, the best way is to keep your finances separate, try to earn more if possible and accept that being on such disparate incomes, marriage is unlikely as he will want to protect himself. I would never have DC with my DP as - apart from all the other reasons - I know that would put me in a difficult position financially and I know he’s reluctant to commit to marriage for many reasons. If more DC is a possibility for you then FGS make sure you have this sorted before that.

No problem @mobear

You only pay for your food and fuel usage though. So you are asking him to fund you. You're not worse off by being with him. But you want him to be worse off by being with you if you split.

You haven't enabled him at your own expense. And you haven't contributed to the house. So why should you be entitled to anything of his. Because you've been dating for a while?

I have to ask why you don't have a lot of savings if you're only contributing towards the bills and paying no mortgage. Surely you can save some decent money and either buy yourself a house, with a mortgage and rent it out or save for your future if your relationship goes pear shaped

I think the best option for you both would be for him to sell and then you both buy a house together.
Rent/mortgage is a massive cost and so you are lucky you don’t have that expense but I do also see what you mean by not having any security if you broke up.

You do live rent free, though - you don’t pay rent, just bills.

Why are you paying 75% of the bills and he’s paying 25%? That’s not 50-50.

You don’t need to do all the ‘housework, shopping, cooking’ - not all other households work like this, you know. You don’t need to be the domestic facilitator - he’s an adult. He can pay for a cleaner. Get a rota with the adult kids and that frees you up to maximise what work you do.

If you can’t save for your future security you are paying too much out. You say you pay more than your share, that your contributions have taken financial pressure off him.

You need to prioritise yourself now. He’s not going to.

Kids to pay their way, you stop subbing them. You can’t afford it.

As he is putting a roof over my head, equally he wouldn't have been able to live the life he has lead over the past 12 years without my financial input taking a lot of pressure of him. So how is that fair?

If this is true then you've both benefitted from the arrangement over the past 12 years. I still can't see why you think this means he should give you some of his inheritance. I can't believe that you are paying more in bills then you were paying in rent and bills when you were living in a rental before you moved in together.

Housework etc. is irrelevant. People don't get paid for that and if you think he was not pulling his weight you could have moved out.

I'm not sure why you didn't buy a place together like you originally planned but as you seem to have gone along with that situation, he can't really be held responsible for that. Are your children paying their own way now or are they still students? If they are then perhaps you need to invest that contribution so you can start to secure your future.

He needs to be paying you for the work you do for his business.
If the children are adults, they need to pay their share of the bills.
Don't pay "more than your share" of soft furnishings, food, etc. Save that money for your future.

Do you have a pension?

Doing the housework and cooking doesnt make up for lack of rent, you’d have to do that anyway.

There are three of you and one of him, so you should be paying more if the bills.

If you were paying your own rent and bills before him then you could have easily put the savings you made paying no rent and less if the bills into savings.

Given you’ve only lived with hm for six years, not sure how you’ve taken financial pressure off him for twelve. Not sure how paying a share of bills is perceived to be a benefit to him. Did you think it should all be free?

If this was posted by a man who was wanted £1k despite paying no rent and only a percentage of bills despite there being three of his family he would be torn apart.