To think we won't see a Labour Government again for many years?

[Rosehip10]

Even discounting the changes in the ex-industrial former "red-wall" seats, no Labour leader has ever become Prime Minister without winning at least half the seats in Scotland. Even if Scotland does not vote for independence in the next few years, Labour is never going to recover there. If independence comes then it is academic anyway.

Combine that with the changes in the former Labour seats in the north (which I think will only continue) then a Government cannot be formed of London MPs, a few larger cities and some seats in university towns/cities.

I don't think Starmer is the most charismatic leader but I think any ppolitican would struggle to solve this. Very hard to try and appeal to ex-industrial seats AND young, metropolitan, middle class voters in London etc.

One of the best comments I saw yesterday was Labour trying to make traction of the conservatives being corrupt and stuffing money into places that voted for them, was people thinking "well all politicians are corrupt anyway, so we may as well vote for Boris to get some of that too!"

[SteveArnottsCodeine]

We are a traditionally conservative (small C) nation and FPTP gives the Tories an advantage, as does the split vote of the left. Our current system is unfit for purpose and doesn’t allow for a fair system for meaningful opposition to form (because only the leader of the Labour Party is given the right to reply really).

The whole thing needs burning down and starting again.

[the80sweregreat]

I could never vote conservative but many of my friends and family do and read the daily Mail and sometimes quote it...
these people were traditionally Labour voters.
Where I live in the south East people don't consider themselves' working class ' anymore even though they are!
Lots of money from property floating around too. Made people selfish and ' I'm alright Jack ' attitude. Moan about cuts to vital services but also make excuses for it.
We are now a right wing country.

[onlyconnect]

The only way to get the Tories out of power is for the centrist and left-wing parties to work together. They need to have pacts in place not to stand against each other. I appreciate that it feels somewhat anti-democratic, but it’s the only way I can think of to oust the Tories. On the right the conservatives are the only (slightly) sane choice. On the left you’ve got Lab, SNP, Plaid, LibDems, Green...it splits the vote too much in our antiquated FPTP system.

I agree with this. To win, Labour has to get people who sometimes vote Tory to vote for them. This means occupying the centre. They need to get mass media on board- Blair won because he realised this. Those on the left need to accept that they will never win if the Labour Party is a left wing party. All the evidence points at that. Fine to follow ideals, but accept you won't be in government

[PatsArrow]

I urge anyone to read Depised (Why the modern left loathes the working class) by Paul Embery (fire fighter and ex union leader)

[Biker47]

Fingers crossed.

[Donitta]

I don’t give a shit about other people. Labour needs to represent ME. And it doesn’t. It represents the minority not the majority, with the result that only the minority votes for them and the majority votes for someone else.

[NinaMimi]

I remember all this snobbish in the UK around the time of Bush about how American voters choose the candidate they’d most like to have a beer with. Well England is no better. Labour should get a loud abrasive leader who talks without thinking through what he says (“he tells it like it is”), but is seen by many as charismatic and charming. That’d be my advice.

[grannycake]

We in Wales have just re-elected a labour government . Drakeford is anything but charismatic but he is competent and obviously that has played a part in increasing their seat count

[NailsNeedDoing]

I was hoping I’d be able to vote Labour in future, but Kier Starmer put an end to that when he snubbed the Iftar event he was supposed to attend.

Apparently it’s more important for him to support Israeli manufacturers who grow produce on stolen, illegally acquired land than it is to show support for the Muslim community in the UK.

I’m not Muslim, but I was so disappointed with that, it shows that he doesn’t have the morals or integrity I’d hoped for.

[PriestessofPing]

A Labour Government has just been re-elected in Wales but you’d probably not know that from many media outlets or from Labour in England. Actually made gains too. It’s not just about England and Scotland. Why has Wales stayed Labour? That would be something for Keir Starmer etc to think about perhaps.

[Zampa]

The Tories have united the right. Those who used to vote Brexit, BNP etc. no longer feel political homeless.

Until the left also unites (Labour/Lib Dem tbf) and (as a PP states) form an electoral pact not to stand against each other, I can't see a left leaning government forming for over 20 years, let alone 11.

Plurality in politics is a good thing so hope this pact does come to fruition and then the new government gets PR in place instead of FPTP.

[NinaMimi]

The problem with the left and not just in the UK is that it tends to be more divisive so you get lefties voting labour, Lib Dem and smaller parties or regional parties. Though I guess I’m adding to that as I’ve decided enough is enough. The UK is unworkable. I’m joining the SNP. It’s not just about Boris or Cameron it’s about a long running pattern that goes back before I was born.

[the80sweregreat]

@PatsArrow

I urge anyone to read Depised (Why the modern left loathes the working class) by Paul Embery (fire fighter and ex union leader)

I'm reading this now!
It's so true.

[Overthebow]

I’m not tied to one party, I vote for whichever I think has the best policies and the strength to lead the country. I would not and have not voted for labour, they’re a mess and I really can’t think of anything good they’ve done in the last 10 years or so. I have to vote conservative because there is no good opposition and they’re the only ones with half decent policies.

[YouJustDoYou]

I could never vote conservative but many of my friends and family do and read the daily Mail and sometimes quote it...
these people were traditionally Labour voters.
Where I live in the south East people don't consider themselves' working class ' anymore even though they are!
Lots of money from property floating around too. Made people selfish and ' I'm alright Jack ' attitude. Moan about cuts to vital services but also make excuses for it

😂😂😂

[averylongtimeago]

Labour have forgotten who their core voters actually are, the Party seems to have its head so far up it's own bum it can't see anything.

Has any of the Labour elite actually done any real work? Have they any understanding of how most people live? Do they know any builders, scaffolders, nurses, labourers, factory workers, shop workers in any capacity other than "employee"?
None of the blokes (DH is in the building trade) I know give a stuff about pronouns or any of the "woke" agenda which seems so important to the Labour Party at the moment.

What is Labour's policy on housing, the NHS, schools, employment? Have they actually got any policies?

[grannycake]

Again both Wales and Scotland have forms of proportional representation and the above has never happened

[MaxNormal]

People celebrating that Labour are stuffed - be careful what you wish for. A de facto one-party state is not a healthy democracy.
Labour urgently need to make themselves electable again for the good of the whole country, and I don't mean I think they necessarily need to win for the good of the country, I just mean we need a functioning viable opposition.

[MaxNormal]

Labour should get a loud abrasive leader who talks without thinking through what he says (“he tells it like it is”), but is seen by many as charismatic and charming. That’d be my advice.

I'm not convinced that Labour would be allowed that leeway. Would be described as "blunders" and he'd be deemed unelectable.

[supermoonrising]

The UK is a completely dysfunctional state. 50% anti-Union in Scotland. About 40% in Wales. Similar in N.Ireland. And those numbers are only going to rise. When Scotland goes, the rest will collapse in a matter of years, Against this backdrop, who gets to lead the UK is like squabbling for Captaincy of the Titanic.

[Overthebow]

What is Labour's policy on housing, the NHS, schools, employment? Have they actually got any policies?

These are the important things for me, I really have no idea what Labours policies on these are if they even have them. Conservative policies may not always be the best but at least they do focus on these key issues.

[btwwhichonespink]

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow

Liberal coalition is the only answer.

I think that would be a misuse of the word 'Liberal'

Left wing coalition would be more apt.

[grannycake]

UKIP were represented in the Senedd - through the regional list. I'm not a fan but it is fair that the people who are have some representation, A first past the post system threatens democracy as it always means that a large proportion of the population feel unrepresented