MIL constantly mentioning her daughter

[Fizzwizzfozz]

My dh fell out with his sister years ago basically she is greedy, selfish, a liar and has taken lots of hand outs from her parents who have always favoured her over DH.

Now DH and sil have hardly spoken in at least 17 years and MIL constantly and unnecessarily mentions her every 30 seconds. DH has tried many ways to ask her to stop, some politely others not so politely. She stops for maybe a week or two then slowly starts doing it again and until we are back to the every 30 seconds again. She tries to make it look like an accident or to quickly slip it in in fact there are many creative ways in which she mentions the name and it's contributed to us now going NC.

I will give an example. We had Broccoli at dinner and so MIL says "Mary likes Broccoli"

I bought a grey hat "Mary has a grey hat."

DH mentions a place in Italy "I'll have to ask Mary if she's been"

We had new floor put down "Oh Mary would love this"
My six year old dd even told her to stop when I was giving birth to dd2 and said "Nanny this is about a new baby not Mary."
Mil then went on to repeat this story three times when she first saw the baby but I think this is just so she can say Mary.
This has also extended to SIL's dd. When DH showed MIL the arrangements for our daughters birthday party, the first thing she said was "oh Mary's DD will love it!" And if my dd do something she says "Yes Mary's DD did this too"

Many of the mentions are not even in context. I commented on a film I didn't like and she then said " well, it's like Mary, she doesn't like." Then mentioned a different film.

Also MIL will appear to zone out and day dream then when she does say something the first thing she says is "Mary ...."

We don't want to hear about Mary because she has caused so much upset and treated us so badly and told lies about us, all of this is not acknowledged when we have brought it up so we'd rather not hear about her.

Has anybody else had this or AIBU to be annoyed by it?

From your update it almost sounds like your MIL is trapped in an abusive relationship with Mary. Mary made MIL childmind while her husband was dying?! That's horrendous.

Has your MIL always been like this or has it been a gradual erosion of her personality?

The 'parents pushing the golden twat onto the rest of the family' as suggested by a previous poster rings very true. I've seen the same in my family and it's left the parents of the Golden Twat very isolated in their old age. It's sad but they take a hard line to any criticism of their beloved son. The worst his behaviour, the more entrenched their support for him.

Fucking hell.

@Quincie

It sounds compulsive, and riddled with guilt and perhaps even disguising something underneath that which is intolerable for her - hence these compulsive episodes of "pressure release".

I immediately thought of sexual abuse of Mary when I read this.
Could there be some awful family secret?

The thing about these golden children is why do the parents treat one child so differently - I think it must stem from the DP's own childhood - so the golden child reminds them of them ( possibly some unhappy event in their childhood they obsessively compensate the DD for) . And this mentioning SIL seems obsessive - did DM want to have her adopted or something as a baby and now has this guilt?

There's a confession-like quality to it, for sure - whatever it is that is being confessed.

I agree the only way is an ultimatum. Which sounds as if it might help in some way with MIL breaking free?

If you don't want the sit-down ultimatum though, you could try a softer 'realise the consequences' approach.

So... next time MIL asks to come over : 'Oh. Could we maybe leave it a week or two? We're all a bit tired this week and we really can't take an afternoon of hearing about Mary, sorry MIL. I'll give you a call when we all feel a bit more up to it!'

Go on a trip out. Don't mention to MIL, but let her find out. 'Sorry by the way, we would have loved for you to come but it would just turn in to a Mary comparison and DD hates it so much as do we, it would have really affected the day.'

Gentle, and reinforcing that you would like to see her - but that it's no longer worth it for the upset over this issue. Let her see that your favoured option is now dropping MIL rather than putting up with it.

The relationship does seem to have OCD and abusive hallmarks.
I think the only thing to do would be to leave / make her leave after her name is mentioned following a final warning?

Sorry if I've missed it, but why haven't you gone NC with MIL?

It sounds like none of you get any pleasure from her company, including your children. In fact she has a positively detrimental effect on all of you .

We have gone NC with her now but we are really sad about it because on the one hand she clings on really strongly to the status quo and defends SIL to the hilt and despite everything we have tried to change the situation she won't budge, bit like that horse in the mud on neverending story.

But on the other hand her behaviour makes for a very sad story for her. She's in her 70s and she's having to take responsibility for her daughter who is in her 40s and has a PHD! We want mil to relax and enjoy her later years, to see all of her children and GC but whilst she's caught or choosing to be in this dynamic with SIL her life is sad and far from peaceful. I think she classes herself as an observer or somebody not involved, but she's probably the only one who could make a difference where SIL's behaviour is concerned.

She doesn't see her son or her GC. We stopped answering the phone and changed our numbers, she knows where we live she hasn't knocked and the only thing she did do after a long time was post a Christmas card that had to son and Dil on
it and added our dd's names on. No card money or gift for them. She also forwarded on some junk mail that came to her house for DH and put a scrap of paper saying "Hope you're all ok" DH was really understandably upset by both of these things.
Mil must be in pain about not seeing DH and GC she knows it's because of issues with SIL yet despite that she still holds on tight to the pretending it's like a big secret she keeps from everyone. She won't discuss it with even her closest friends and nobody in the family has a clue. (It's not a big family) It's just very very sad

the only thing she did do after a long time was post a Christmas card that had to son and Dil on it and added our dd's names on. No card money or gift for them. She also forwarded on some junk mail that came to her house for DH and put a scrap of paper saying "Hope you're all ok" DH was really understandably upset by both of these things.
I don't understand why he would be upset that she reached out?

@stayathomer

the only thing she did do after a long time was post a Christmas card that had to son and Dil on it and added our dd's names on. No card money or gift for them. She also forwarded on some junk mail that came to her house for DH and put a scrap of paper saying "Hope you're all ok" DH was really understandably upset by both of these things. I don't understand why he would be upset that she reached out?

Maybe he’s upset that the relationship has come to this?

Yes, but they changed their numbers and stopped talking didn't they? So is he upset at all of them including himself, or at his mother? (I just didn't understand)

He's upset because after being told over and over what the issues are and how distressed she has witnessed him being over it she writes "Hope everything is ok" she knows it's not ok he's told her many times it's not ok. So why write that it's dismissing him.

Also mil has 3 GC two from me and one from SIL. She usually comes over with cards etc at Christmas. Ok understandably she knew not to because we have not been in contact but she didn't put a GC card for our dd's just stuck it all on one card for me and DH.
It upset him because he wondered how she could have purchased one GC for SIL DD and nothing for ours. I know it's difficult because we are NC now and she must wonder what to do for the best. But it feels like she has accepted the situation if NC as a kind of "it is what it is"

You don't go NC to punish or inflict hurt, but my DH has said he feels like he has s grieving his mother despite her being alive and living 10 minutes away. It's been very painful for him and I dread my dd's coming to the realisation that they won't see their nan anymore because they will be heart broken.

She just seems ok with it and has done nothing to try to change the situation. The only solution for her would be for us all to go back to pretending SIL is wonderful and that we are not emotionally hurt by any if it.

@CokeDrinker @TurquoiseLemur

I don’t tell my parents for the opposite of what Lemur said, they’d be devastated. He’s the golden child but every now and again they get very upset by his behaviour and lack of regard for his family and come to me in tears. I have a lot of built up resentment to him from the comparison, not just from parents but teachers too, the first time I met my college teacher I was told “I hope you’re as much a pleasure to teach as your brother”.
We don’t talk about issues in our family. But from when they do get upset with my brother I get the hint that I am appreciated, but I’ll never match up on other things.
My children for example played tennis a few years ago, 12 months later Neils children started tennis, mine stopped briefly and I was told by a Grandparent that tennis isn’t for people like us, more for people like Neil. There’s a belief he’s of a higher class.

Maybe she was just testing the water though? After all of that I think I'd be worried getting back in touch too. I dont know, it all sounds hard for all of you, and sad too. Take care op, hope it all works out

To me, barring abuse or some dark secret, there is always something off about people who are no contact with their only sibling and now their mother.

Also mil has 3 GC two from me and one from SIL. She usually comes over with cards etc at Christmas. Ok understandably she knew not to because we have not been in contact but she didn't put a GC card for our dd's just stuck it all on one card for me and DH.
It upset him because he wondered how she could have purchased one GC for SIL DD and nothing for ours. I know it's difficult because we are NC now and she must wonder what to do for the best. But it feels like she has accepted the situation if NC as a kind of "it is what it is"

I feel for you and your DH OP, but tbh he has effectively ended the relationship with his mother by going NC - of course she isn't going to buy gifts and cards anymore?

This is a sad situation all round - is it not possible that you could be in contact with MIL but just less contact than you used to have? So it isn't so bad if she mentions SIL when you do see her.

Honestly I do sympathise as my MIL is CONSTANTLY bringing up DP's ex, we can't get through one visit without a mention of her, but equally it's sad for your DH to lose his mother and for your children to lose their grandmother over this.

MIL is being inappropriate by constantly making everything about SIL - I agree - but equally I do think that your DH has done what he needs to by cutting out SIL. I think it's a little harsh to also cut out MIL because she won't back him up, she is obviously torn between her two children and seems to have a very close relationship with SIL if she lives with her.

I just think he could still maintain contact - since it's clearly upsetting him not to have contact with his mum - but to a lesser extent to it's not so upsetting for you as a family.

PS. Meant to add, I know you said going NC was not to 'punish' MIL but it seems like for your DH it is to try and force her into seeing his side or understanding that he'll be NC.

Which is fine if it makes him feel better mentally and emotionally to be NC, but it doesn't seem like it does? It reads like he's cutting off his nose to spite his face tbh.

@Yoshinori

To me, barring abuse or some dark secret, there is always something off about people who are no contact with their only sibling and now their mother.

Abuse is far more common that people are willing to acknowledge. Plenty of apparently okay families have abuse going on behind closed doors. Not always sexual (though it can be, obvs), not always physical (though it can be, obvs). Emotional and psychological abuse in families is rampant.

There is this myth about "family." That we should always stick with our family however they behave. I belong to a forum of people who are NC or Low Contact with family members (sometimes it's a parent, sometimes it is both parents, sometimes it's a sibling) and most of us are agreed that we made an effort with these toxic and damaging family members for far too long. We stayed hoping against hope that the situation could change for the better.

Attitudes like yours here don't help. I did grow up in an abusive environment but I don't see why I should have to justify having made the decisions I have made because of it. certainly not to virtual strangers who consider people like me "off."

I have 5 siblings and I’m NC with one of them and our mother.

They are both violent alcoholics. I was physically and mentally abused and neglected by our Mother. DSis is just like her.

My other siblings have done what I did, gone NC and moved as far away as possible.

Surprisingly it’s not something I like to discuss.

I think DH is upset at how easily she has accepted the NC and hasn't made any attempt to do anything about it when he is really hurting and we tried so hard for such a long time to sort things out and avoid a whole break down of the relationship like this.

He hasn't done this to get a reaction from her, everything else he tried was to get a response. Before he decided enough was enough he said "I've spent all this time trying to change what she is doing, the answer is to change what I am doing and walk away"

We both feel if it were our children walking away we would do something. Maybe we would eventually have to accept it as hard as that would be but to do nothing, say nothing? Write cards and slips of paper as though it's all normal? Can't get my head round the behaviour It's just sad

@Fizzwizzfozz

I think DH is upset at how easily she has accepted the NC and hasn't made any attempt to do anything about it when he is really hurting and we tried so hard for such a long time to sort things out and avoid a whole break down of the relationship like this.

He hasn't done this to get a reaction from her, everything else he tried was to get a response. Before he decided enough was enough he said "I've spent all this time trying to change what she is doing, the answer is to change what I am doing and walk away"

We both feel if it were our children walking away we would do something. Maybe we would eventually have to accept it as hard as that would be but to do nothing, say nothing? Write cards and slips of paper as though it's all normal? Can't get my head round the behaviour It's just sad

It is sad, but again, all he can do is either keep trying to work through it with his mother OR go NC and accept it for what it is.

He can't really go NC and then end up even more upset because she hasn't come after him, that defeats the purpose of going NC surely?

It it's distressing him more to be NC than it was to be in contact, then makes sense to get back in touch.

‘She spent the whole wake in a different room to the guests looking out of the window for SIL‘

This shows it’s less about you I think and more that MIL is obsessed with Mary

Why and how this happened I do not know but it is something I recognise is a feature of my fathers relationship with my brother.

In fact my father will raise the emotion on this for everyone who is there his only interactions With me and my kids will be along the lines of Uncle x will be here soon, oooh 18 mins till uncle x gets here (he’s always late though too!) then five minutes to due let’s call uncle x he’s nearly here to oh uncle x didn’t answer he’s probably driving (no shit!) too oh uncle x has an amazing job he’s often needed at work he’s earns .... he may be called away etc

Many things about my fathers behaviour in relationships seem inexplicable in fact.

We are now no contact with the lot of them
As the relationship after many other bizarre things was sooo toxic.

Do you find mil telling cafe or shop staff or neighbours all about Mary’s (perfectly normal) achievements for example too?

I think you may have to be outrageously rude to get her stop, or just NC.

Mary.
Who?
Mary?
Who? I don’t know anyone called Mary, who are you talking about?

Seriously OP, I know it's hard to recognise it when you're up close with the behaviour and it's gone on so long, but your MIL is clearly mentally ill. Her behaviour when others are around makes it clear that this is nothing personal. There is something badly wrong here.

Does she have any friends? Have you ever spoken to them about her? I appreciate that protecting yourself against her behaviour is just as valid whatever is behind it, but she really does need help. And if it's not something you feel able to address, that's fine. But I would be wanting to know how other people see this, and wondering if maybe any of them can talk to her about it.

@Yoshinori

To me, barring abuse or some dark secret, there is always something off about people who are no contact with their only sibling and now their mother.

Oh bugger off with your judgemental comments. Most people who go no contact with family members have to do so to protect themselves and their mental health. It is never a decision that is taken lightly, it's not as if you suddenly wake up one morning and decide not to speak to someone. It comes about after years and years of hurt, and low or no contact is absolutely taken as a last resort.

It is a last resort we tried so much so even though it's the only thing we can do, it's still very upsetting.
DH still loves his mother and has to come to terms that he will never see her again and at her age she could pass away and he won't be there. Our Children won't see their nan again in their lives but she's only ten minutes away as we speak.
It's desperately sad nobody just decides to take this course of action because there's something "off" about them.