To keep helping or walk away?

[Garlia]

My MIL is a lovely kind person, never had an issue in over 15 years knowing her.

She is a bit vulnerable however; struggles to read and write, struggles understanding information and is one-way with conversation/talks at long length without realising; she doesn't take incoming information in unless she really concentrates, but even then she can get things mixed up.

She's quite traditional in that payments/bills were made via cheque or cash, in person. She cannot use a computer. During lockdown she asked me to help so I set up direct debits for all her bills, prescription deliveries and organised a weekly food shop etc. We set up a joint account so I can pay for anything she needs. I keep a paper trail to prove everything is above board.

My DH is unable to help her at all (apart from moral support) so the 'doing' falls to me.

She has had issues with neighbours, property, her car, I've always stepped in to help at her request. From completing her census for her to getting a BT engineer when she had issues to speaking with solicitors on her behalf, she's increasingly relying on me. I feel honoured she trusts me and I care about her so much.

Basically, she's needing more and more support. She has now inherited a big sum of money and a property from a family member (not expected) and now is responsible for the bills which she can't afford on her pension. The situation is overwhelming for her and she doesn't know what to do, and I'm mindful not to tell her what do to, but only to support her.

She has another child, DHs younger sister. She is not close to MIL at all and is very very cold with me and DH, there's no contact really. SIL is not interested with MIL is struggling, and will tell her what to do (not always practical ideas) rather than help. I think she genuinely doesn't understand MILs limits.

DH contacted his sister, feeling it was the right thing to do, to tell her how much MIL is struggling and relying on me to do things for her and could we all meet as a family to chat about how to best support MIL and guide her through.

She responded by insisting I step back 100% as it's not my place to help and I'm interfering, I said of course I don't want to interfere I'm genuinely just supporting MIL.

I've gently explained to MIL I need to step back now and she's incredibly upset, and pleading with me to still help her, I feel so torn I really don't know what the right thing to do is?

Do I step back as SIL wants or continue to help but cause more family tension?

Will do as you say @callingtonb and ignore.

The thing that is stinging me, is she knows from the last time we spoke (this week when we had LPA chat) that I said I really need to do some job applications this weekend. She knows I'm behind on a few other things too because of supporting her, but is happy to call/ask additional favours.

I always told myself she just lacks ability to understand but as @billy1966 pointed out, she fully understood the consequences of me stepping back from LPA/supporting her, she understood that immediately.

Her theory of mind definitely never extends to me, @HareIsland

I'm questioning everything now.

:(

@HelpfulBelle I wonder if there's a way I can call-forward her automatically to DH!

I don't want to totally remove myself as I do care about her, and I feel sympathy for her living alone. Deciding what I'm happy to do and what I'm not is definitely needed.

I don't want to be POA and I don't want to have the Joint Account anymore, or to be called for everything she needs/wants help with. And I'm definitely not doing the hours of calls a week, I lose my evenings. DH can take those and problem solve for her. And if DH can't help then he has the list of numbers I've given him.

He has been better with phone calls for himself lately. Maybe it'll help his confidence to do more, and leaning on me so much might be holding him back.

Apparently (assuming you have an iPhone) you can do the following:

Settings>Phone>Call Forwarding

And then enter DH’s number. Easy!

Hi @garlia I've read the whole thread this morning. Having been in similar situations myself, I just wanted to say you're doing all the right things, but I know it's hard when the realisation hits and you question everything around you.
The first stage is when you realise you're being taken advantage of - and you're dealing with that.
The second (and arguably worse) stage is the realisation that people who are supposed to love and care for you have LET this happen, looked the other way, even pretended they thought you wanted to do all this extra stuff.
A previous excellent post about predicting the behaviour to drag you back in has already been spot on - eBay purchases to sell....come on. This is disrespectful to you at best.

How your husband behaves in the next few days will be telling. I really hope the scales have fallen from his eyes too and he sees that he and his family have treated you badly. Or he will resent the extra intrusion and work for him.

I agree with previous posters.

Get PoA ASAP
Ignore SIL
The property sounds like a millstone - financially, it's better to sell the house and invest.
MIL sounds like a hoarder - good luck with that.

Unfortunately your MIL does not have the luxury of sentimentality when she can do nothing for herself.

This, with knobs on.

@chipsndippy - nor the luxury of running an e-bay business when she can't work a computer!

Have you been doing this ebay business of selling clothes before?

Is this the level of intrusion you have been putting up with?

She knew well you were busy this weekend but still contacted you.

Moving this on, she really isn't the really nice person you think she is.

She's an extremely selfish, calculating user.

She doesn't care what you want, she really doesn't, she wants you to be at her beck and call and will not accept No.

Infact she will be furious at No.

There are some great poster's who could explain that type of character that will not accept No and will push and in fact bully until you agree.
Blocking them or muting your phone works.
Forwarding all your calls to your husband would be a perfect solution.

Lets see how long he tolerates her bullshit.

The utter selfishness and disrespect of calling you at this hour.

She lives 2 hours away.
My God you have been truly used.

My hope for you as you continue to pull back and get some real perspective on this is that you find your anger at what has occurred.

Shielding someone from stress as you have done is counterproductive especially when it comes to an adult like your husband.
He is not a child.
Now that you have pased his mother back to him, let him feel the stress.
Do NOT be sucked back in, in 'rescuer mode'.
He needs to see clearly what a PITA and a drain his mother has been.
I believe he knows bloody well though and has indeed just looked the other way.
Let his phone call constantly and see how he feels with the constant weight of her expectations and jobs.

She sounds like an extraordinary selfish women.

This first taste this morning is perfect.

OP, I think you should really emphasise how mentally worn out you are feeling and really take things very easy for the next week.

Do not accept any contact.
You need a complete holiday from her for this transition to go through.

If your husband tells you he can't cope, tell him to contact his sister and arrange assisted living.

You cannot find a job with the weight of this womens selfish expectations weighing you down.

Your mind needs peace.

Pp's have not spoken kindly of SIL, and from what we have read, she sounds rather dismissive; but as the context widens out, I begin to sense a huge back story unfolding........now that you are pulling back, I wonder if you will be seen as another unsympathetic, unhelpful person.

- She left a long voicemail, she's been shopping in charity shops and says she bought bargains and could I put them on the Internet to sell at a profit for her, this must have been why she called yesterday. -

Ha ha no
If she doesn't do computer she can get up at 5 am and do a boot sale with your dh
Stay out of it.

Regarding the SIL, there is a huge difference to not wishing to be at this woman's beck and call constantly and not doing a single thing for her and refusing to be anyway involved.

The OP has been doing it all whilst both her MIL's children have stood back, completely uninvolved for years.

Through surgery/IVF/job loss, she has ended up halting her life to play PA for a hugely selfish demanding woman.

Selling clothes on ebay tells you EXACTLY the type of entitlement her MIL feels to her time.

Her MIL is a classic CF.

Good luck op x

I think the SIL is irrelevant (except insofar as she's been unpleasant to the OP, if she has?) in the OP's decision about whether to step back completely from her MIL.

It shouldn't be a matter of 'I'll step back because some other woman should feel obligated to step into my shoes'. The OP can, and should, simply own the decision to prioritise her own (far from straightforward) life and no longer do large amounts of unpaid, unappreciated work for a woman who treats her as a free PA, chauffeur, financial manager, proxy manager of an Ebay selling business etc etc. regardless of whether her SIL chooses to involve herself in her mother's life or not.

The OP says she cares a lot for her MIL, is honoured to be trusted by her, but I expect people to care for me and trust me without me needing to 'buy' that trust and affection by essentialy being their unpaid carer.

And yes, I do find myself wondering what the 'cold' SIL's take on this all is. It seems to me perfectly possible that she's impatient with her extremely selfish and difficult-sounding mother, her brother who is entirely unable to help, and with the OP for running herself ragged for dancing attendance on two people who are making no efforts to manage their own lives with what sounds very much like learned helplessness.

(I don't mean to attack you in the least, OP you have been nothing but reasonable on this thread, and I think it's great you're trying to unpick longstanding habits of 'service' but I can see how the whole situation might make someone impatient and unwilling to get involved.)

I would think your SIL is concerned about your potential influence over your MIL, gaining power of attorney in the future etc, rather than any real concern for her mother. If you are able to keep helping, and that is what your MIL wants, then absolutely keep helping

I think many, many people have had similar experiences, I definitely have. The details are different but basically you do something nice for someone who you believe is in need. They gradually and subtly demand more and more of you and eventually you discover yourself in the position of an unpaid carer or pa to someone. You didn’t see it coming because you have been carefully manipulated (groomed) into this situation.
While I think it’s great that you are directing your mil to your dh, he shouldn’t step straight into your shoes. I’d suggest he helps her where, and only where, she genuinely needs help. Eg. he should not put anything on eBay for her. If she buys the stuff, she can take responsibility for selling it. He needs to establish boundaries too. But also remember you are not responsible for him setting boundaries, it might be easy to slip into the situation where you are helping him help his mum without realising it.

On the positive side, you can have a ‘boundary setting’ convo together and decide what supplier is reasonable for him to provide for his DJ. And, in general who takes responsibility for what tasks in your household. Eg. Work out what’s fair and reasonable and then you can each take responsibility for tasks that fit your abilities but also make sure you spread the workload evenly between you.

My history is that my dh was an even worse mug than me for being taken advantage of. Over the years he had roped me into help a long series of CF before I finally had a revelation and we put a stop to it. Life is so much better now.

Bloody autocorrect! I mean ‘decide what support is reasonable for him to provide his dm’.

Because my mum was similar to the MIL, I was very much a free caseworker for manipulators who wanted someone else to run their lives. I was sucked in by someone who would have had me spoon feeding her given the chance. She was perfectly capable with no disabilities but liked the attention.

It's very easy to get sucked in if there's something in your background that makes you an easy target. I would have given the same response to the OP if my mother was getting her to run around after her: Step back and don't do it. Because my mum is perfectly capable of doing things herself but plays the victim and is manipulative.

Agree. Usually there is a reason that we learned to put our own needs aside for others in childhood so it comes naturally to do so in adulthood. You can just be a sitting target for someone who knows how to pull your strings.

@callingtonb

Agree. Usually there is a reason that we learned to put our own needs aside for others in childhood so it comes naturally to do so in adulthood. You can just be a sitting target for someone who knows how to pull your strings.

That's really interesting, I was brought up in a toxic environment, my DM has BPD so I learned to avoid conflict by anticipating needs and people pleasing.

I have great boundaries with DM now and a positive relationship, but in my childhood I suffered violence and abuse.

Perhaps this is why I think MIL is a lovely person, she never gets angry, swears, her moods are stable/predictable and I don't have to second guess if 'yes you can put that mug there' means just that, or if it's a 'test' and then I'll have the mug of hot tea thrown at me.

I am careful of new people and very shy but admittedly I've never been on 'alert' around MIL for manipulation but now my eyes are open, my stomach is dropping because I'm thinking about what she can do when she wants to/has to.

I think there's been an element of needing validation; I help because I think that's what a good person should do. I take stress from DH because I should want to, to be a good partner.

Oh jeeze I need to unravel it all.

Not at all harsh @HareIsland I'm starting to feel sympathy for SIL despite her coldness; I can see her point of view and perhaps she is simply enforcing her own (needed) boundaries with MIL.

I'm reading all the posts and advice. I've suggested to DH when he speaks to MIL he can suggest she sells her charity shop bargains at a car boot.

If DH can suggest alternatives that don't involve me then maybe she will stop asking so much in the first place?

I've been looking at services local to her and there are so many, I'm kicking myself for just taking on more and more.

I have stressed today to DH that if he is worried about her, he can encourage her to see her GP and she can explain what her issues are and he can signpost her to suitable resources, as well as the list of numbers I've already complied.

This way I'm not 'abandoning' caring about her, but I absolutely will be letting go of being responsible for her. For my own life. And sanity.

This way I'm not 'abandoning' caring about her, but I absolutely will be letting go of being responsible for her. For my own life. And sanity.

Absolutely, @Garlia. Caring about someone is absolutely not the same as being their unpaid service provider, or taking responsibility for their inability to manage their own life.

That's really interesting, I was brought up in a toxic environment, my DM has BPD so I learned to avoid conflict by anticipating needs and people pleasing.

My mum was similar OP and I therefore used to end up in situations like yours and my God! some people have no compunction about bleeding you dry.

I'm starting to feel sympathy for SIL despite her coldness; I can see her point of view and perhaps she is simply enforcing her own (needed) boundaries with MIL.

You'd have thought exactly the same about me, that I was cold and unfeeling. What you wouldn't have seen is decades of being caught up in her manipulative tactics and toxicity.

She left a long voicemail, she's been shopping in charity shops and says she bought bargains and could I put them on the Internet to sell at a profit for her, this must have been why she called yesterday

Totally and utterly selfish. Not an accident. Deliberate. The hour could even have been a punishment for your stepping back. She didn't know your phone was on silent.

wouldn’t even get dh to call her back about it, just ignore. If she brings it up with your dh later, he can say you hadn’t checked your voicemails.

You need to start actually ignoring the voicemails. Unless your DH is away from home for a week and there could be a genuine emergency. If he's around and she gets no answer from you, she'll call him. I'd block her number though.

Re SIL I'm wondering if she's been put upon from a young age and has gone NC because of this. It might also be the reason she's LC with you and your DH. So she can't be sucked back into the skivvy role. Your DH has shown he's happy to put on his sister with the most recent phone call to her. I'm not surprised she's walked away TBH and as for being uncaring, is she just fed up with the family dynamics perhaps? I've found life is much less hassle by operating a policy of if you have difficult friends/family I don't want you as a friend however nice you are. It means I don't get second hand drama, don't end up supporting friends with situations they've got themselves into and refuse to get out of.

Don't make that mistake with DH either. Don't swap supporting MIL for supporting DH with his stress over MIL.

If he's stressed he can find ways to tackle that which doesn't involve leaning on you. If he's going to refuse to deal with stress by any method other than leaning on you, you need to know before you have children and find yourself in a position of not being able to support him. Marriages do break down sometimes because a needy man has children and suddenly finds he can't get his needs met by his wife any more.

You say you have no answer to the question of where do you and he separately get support from if you have a child. That's something you need to figure out before you're pregnant. Because searching for solutions when you're in the depths of not-coping-ness will be so much harder. Children don't patch up a shaky marriage, they rip it apart.

He has been better with phone calls for himself lately. Maybe it'll help his confidence to do more, and leaning on me so much might be holding him back

There's a whole world of difference between having an inability to do something and having insufficient confidence to do something. It might not be a need to lean on you constantly for support, but a preference. It's what he's been taught growing up, after all.