To think calling in sick for no sleep is a good enough reason?

[Rachelinaa]

I work in an office that's been open through most of lockdown due to admin we do being essential.
Recently one of my workmates has been calling in sick a lot because he hasn't been sleeping well as he's got a baby at home that won't sleep. I was shocked to hear other people at work saying they thought it was a ridiculous reason not to come to work and we've all had to come to work tired. But I thought they'd be able to see the difference between being tired and not sleeping at all. His baby has colic and the mum also works.
I've called in sick before for being too tired when my baby was a newborn and didn't sleep. I wondered what everyone else's thoughts on this was? I personally don't want someone driving to work if they're too tired to focus and I can't think that the boss would want someone in more likely to make mistakes.

@RedcurrantPuff

Nice honest guy who cares for his child and health.

But not about the organisation who pay his wages it seems

Why do you presume he doesn't care about his employers? It is only the responsible thing to do to stay away when you're not safe to work. Wth with this awful attitude of playing martyr to the employer.

@TheLastLotus

Nobody’s saying he has to keep working - but he should NOT be using sick leave! Talk to manager and work out a flexible schedule etc. But swanning off and expecting colleagues to take up the slack is appalling. If he’s having such issues then nee work arrangements should be formalised and team work rearranged to cover. Not just dumped on other people and pretending that this is normal

That really made me laugh, you sound so absurdly angry about a decent person doing the right thing.

ForwardRanger

"That really made me laugh, you sound so absurdly angry about a decent person doing the right thing"......

Since when was phoning your employer to say that you're sick (when you're clearly not), "doing the right thing"?

Say you're tired and book the time as holiday or unpaid leave but don't lie, it'll come back to bite you on the arse in the end when your employer decides you've been taking to much sick leave and sacks you!

It’s not “playing martyr” to an employer but so many people seem to not understand this radical concept that if you have a job and expect pay you are actually expected to turn up and do it.

Again I am going to point this out we half the story, he's ringing in to say hes not fit for work because of lack of sleep, we do not know if it is being recorded as sick leave or if he's being paid for it so that doesnt even come into it. That is between the manager and the employer. We also dont know the full extent of whats going on at home other than a colicky baby. Might not even be just a colicky baby, doctors thought my son had colic until he was admitted to hospital at a month old due to having dropped from 7lb 5 to 5lb2 and turned out to be severe reflux. My second son took 3 months to diagnose as this time I was co sleeping from day one and was able to at least maintain his weight so he didnt get so sick. We really have no idea the full extent of the issues.

I would also like to point out there is more dangers to working whilst tired than just whilst driving etc. When I had an awful nights sleep working in a factory packing many years ago I went in to work over tired because of a moronic neighbour who kept us up all night partying, I was up at 4am to get the minibus to be at work at 6am. I fell asleep standing up and was lucky not to have bashed my head on the conveyor when I fell forward. I was told by my line manager that if it happens again I should ring in sick and sent home and I should not feel obligated to come in overtired.

@ForwardRanger hope you enjoyed your laugh, I guess it’s because you’ve had such a charmed life that you’ve never had to pick up the slack and have your own life disrupted due to other people’s issues. Lucky for you. Hope it remains that way.

The point of this AIBU - ‘is calling in sick for lack of sleep a good reason?’ Answer - ‘only if it’s a one- off occurrence for genuine problems, not a hangover’.

Nobody’s is saying that he should ‘suck it up and come to work’. We’re saying that the problem should be discussed and worked around. If the team will be down a member then their work etc has to be redirected. Sick leave is temporary so what happens is no management push to make longer term arrangements and team members burnout.

Cavalier managers and colleagues like you are the reason why I’ve been in teams with all the good people leaving within months, myself included. We’re willing to support people with issues - but not at the cost of us working 12 hour days.

@wildchild554 the issue is really about management. ‘Calling in sick’ is something reserved for one-offs. Teammates are willing to go the extra mile to cover because it could happen to everyone.
An employee with known issues (e.g a fluctuating illness) is also fine - as a good manager would have allowed for this to a certain extent.
What is not fine is someone using what’s intended for a one-off on a regular basis. If as OP says colleagues are complaining others are starting to feel the burden and it’s not fair on them.

Despite my rant above the issue really comes down to management. If a manager’s willing to let their report use sick leave but also makes covering arrangements it’s not an issue.
But in my experience most treat sick leave as temp and as an excuse not to relieve colleagues of their burden. If it’s raised to HR as something else needing temp change in work arrangements (such as coming in late) this is easier and there’s also management support for reducing workload as part of company policy.

@TheLastLotus the point is though just because he's calling in sick doesnt mean its being recorded as that either as he's saying its due to lack of sleep. Could for all we know be umpaid leave. Only the employee and the manager will know that. Alot of people saying hes being paid for sick leave when we don't know if thats what its officially gone down as.

I still don’t understand why he doesn’t take parental leave-it’s designed for new parents with young babies who (quelle surprise!) frequently don’t sleep well! He’s in the UK and is entitled to it so why isn’t he taking it?

@wildchild554 haven’t RTFT so that’s a fair point. The way I read it though was whether paid or not he was calling in to say that he couldn’t do his job, unplanned, meaning that someone else was going to have to pick up the slack. Hence the moaning from colleagues.
It may not even be the colleagues fault in this case - if their manager knows it’s an ongoing problems but doesn’t have a plan of handling it rather than shoving the work onto other people.

I guess we’ll never know as this thread has swelled, OP hasn’t returned and all she’s said anyway was ‘concerned about people going to work overtired’ and that was it. As though people had no right to ‘judge’ and ‘moan’ when in fact they do - if they’re the ones covering. I probably seem to have a bone to pick as I’ve been the complaining colleagues and also the one signed off (MH problems)

The issue with SPL is you can't just take odd days, you've got to plan it in and there's a truckload of paperwork which we had to redo every time we changed it. You can't just wake up in the morning and think 'oh I'll take spl today, I'm knackered'.

If I was his manager I'd be kind about giving him a couple of days but then get a better plan in place.
Perhaps his partner also had a very difficult birth or has PND and he's caring for her too? I'd look at the whole picture and the types of support the organisation offers. And it is very much between him and his line manager.

Surely you just sleep in shifts from 7-7 so each parent gets a guaranteed 6 hours. Yes you'll still be tired but you'll manage to get into work.

Sorry I just wanted to clarify I have M.E and am fed up of being to.d I'm "just a bit tired". Unable to work with it and the snips come from close family...

So sorry, WhipperSnapperSteve. You have all my sympathies. My elder daughter developed ME aged 8. She was so ill that doctors were checking she didn't have leukaemia. Yet I had people telling me that if I promised her horse riding lessons, she would soon recover. I'd have given her the world, but nothing helped. She's now an adult and although she still gets tired, she has mainly recovered. She saw a wonderful consultant in Bristol who did a lot of tests and discovered an imbalance between her oxygen and carbon dioxide levels. He helped enormously. I hope you recover soon.

Why are they not on paternity/maternity leave??

If child too old for parental leave then they should be sleeping in shifts. I would understand the odd day taken off as sick (sleep deprivation is a form of torture after all!). However I assume he's allowed the many days off sick since no one has aid he's breached sick leave policy so he's doing nothing wrong in that case.

WhipperSnapperSteve - I understand exactly where you're coming from.
Fatigue as a result of other more debilitating conditions such as ME is horrible to experience and even moreso when people (doctors included) tell you that you're 'just a bit tired'.
I myself have MS and know only too well how debilitating fatigue can be and that it has absolutely nothing to do with being tired but that's how others perceive it.
Your brain tells you that you need to stop whatever you're doing, you feel 'bone tired' (even thought you're not), your arms and legs feel 10 times their normal weight, lethargy kicks in and eventually your brain basically says 'I've had enough now' and forces you into a state of shutdown.
When I'm fatigued and people say that I'm just tired or that they know exactly how I feel because they've had a disturbed night's sleep, I feel like I want to give them a good hard slap! They have NO idea and would need to walk in my shoes for a couple of days to properly experience it, then they'd see just how different fatigue and being tired actually are.

Some very unsympathetic people in this thread, that obviously don't know the health risks, both physical and mental, that can come with a lack of sleep. I've had insomnia to the point of hallucinations - I sure as hell was in no fit state to do anything, let alone go to work. YANBU.

I assume lots of the people on this thread either didn't have a baby with colic or have forgotten how awful it is.
If he's a usual good employee and was reliable before then yanbu