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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think you sold him years ago (horse) so no you cant come visit him

1000 replies

BlueEyesWhiteDragon · 21/03/2021 20:42

I bought a(nother) horse last summer from a local dealer as I've lost confidence riding for various reasons and my mare is a bit crazy spirited and I wanted something quiet and ploddy. Hes perfect for this.

About 6 months ago a previous owner of his (from 4 years ago) discovered I had him and keeps getting in touch to ask how he is, can she come visit, do I want to sell him? I've pandered to the first one by replying occasionally and said no to the latter 2 several times but perhaps not bluntly enough.

I've just had a text message tonight saying

Hi Dragon. You haven't replied to my message last night. Hope everythings OK and you are well? How is T doing? Im passing your way on Wednesday and thought Id pop in and visit him with C and give him some carrots but I need the address else i'll just be driving round aimlessly! Speak soon A xxx

As far as I can tell the history of T is
A owned him from 6 months to 9 years. He was then sold to B with the proviso that they would keep in touch. B sold him 2 years later to Dealer 1 who sold him to person C. 12 months later C sold him to a Dealer 2. Dealer 2 sold him to D who had him just under 6 months before falling off him and so returned him in a part ex for something smaller. I then bought him.
When B sold him to the first dealer A posted on a facebook group to try and track him down. C responded to say she had him and they have been facebook friends since and A went to visit T a couple of times. A was offered him back when C sold him but couldn't afford him. When the second dealer sold him they obviously refused to share details on where he went due to GDPR so A has been posting on facebook groups since then trying to track him down. A girl who used to help me with them saw a post and said she thought he was with me and gave my email address. I received a long email saying how they regretted selling him, about how hed been to loads of homes since them and they just wanted to know he was OK. I responded with some photos through whatsapp, said he was fine and that he had a home for life with me.

Since that original email on 7th October I have had 104 messages asking about him! At one point I blocked her because I had enough but she was posting all over facebook asking for info because I had disappeared and sent letters to the horses passport office asking them to forward them onto me which they did so I unblocked her.

I am at the end of my tether. I dont want the hassle of a previous owner keeping in touch with me. I didnt agree to keep in touch and in fact the dealer never mentioned it. She sold him 4 years ago. I appreciate she loves him and regrets selling him, but thats tough shit isnt it? Hes been to loads of people before me. Its unfortunate that they seem to be local enough to visit. Im debating saying ive sold him just so shell leave me alone but then shell be back all over facbook hunting for him.

AIBU to say no hes mine now. Ive let you know hes OK. If anything happens or changes Ill let you know but Id prefer you not to visit?

OP posts:
elessar · 23/03/2021 22:39

I'm not surprised she hasn't replied to you OP. I don't think your message was unfair (given the circumstances) but someone would have to have a rhino thick hide not to be mortified at the suggestion that you might report her for harassment if she doesn't back off.

Anyway I don't blame you for your response. She's unfortunately burnt her bridges by being way OTT, which is a real shame as if she'd behaved normally then you might have been happy to let her visit.

Parkerwhereareyou · 23/03/2021 22:40

Love it 👌

Just what I expected. But it always slightly
shocks me how other posters thinks it's absolutely fine to be rude to someone just giving her actually pretty heartfelt and soft opinion.

Stomp on, ladies ...

Anniegetyourgun · 23/03/2021 22:50

"Something" refers to the attributes you're looking for in a horse, not to the animal itself being a "thing". And horses really don't care that much who's looking after them as long as their needs are met. They can get pretty fond of their owners, of course, as they get pretty fond of some of their friends, but they're also remarkably pragmatic about people/other horses going out of their lives. Probably a survival thing. They feel emotions, sure, but they don't think or agonise about things the way we do.

That about "he needs to be home" and "he's hers" is just so much rubbish. He's not someone's kid, no; he's not a kid at all, he's a horse, not a son. (His real birth mother is/was a horse too, but nobody's talking about sending him back to be with her.) This woman stalking him around the country is not his mum. She sold him fgs. Like a slave rather than like her child, if we're going to get all anthropomorphic about it. So make your mind up: does he deserve a home with someone who sold him for money, or someone who intends to look after him to the end of his days? Hmm

Daytimetellysucks · 23/03/2021 22:57

So ... he's the one, for her. I think he deserves to be the one. I see owning horses or dogs or cats or any other creature to be a kind of privilege, and we need to do right by them.

This boy needs to be home. And you should loan him to her or work out a payment plan or whatever, because TBH not her but the horse deserves this.

I just don’t believe horses have the capacity for this. You’re anthropomorphising OP’s horse. As far as the horse is concerned, home is where his feed bucket is kept

My horses trust me, they may feel a horse’s version of being content around me, but I’m not kidding myself that they come running when they see me because of this amazing bond we have.

They recognise me, they recognise my car and know the sound of my voice. They come running when I call them because they know their routine and know it’s teatime.

Owning a horse is absolutely a great privilege. They are amazing creatures and it’s a great privilege and pleasure to own them which is exactly why they deserve the best, most natural lives they can have and OP’s horse’s first owner has already shown she isn’t able/willing to provide this when she kept him shut in a stable for hours a day because of her own wants/needs/convenience.

TheCraicDealer · 23/03/2021 22:58

Excellent response OP, did yourself proud there.

One thing I would say is that ages ago with another CF thread where an email/text response was required, someone said NEVER use "I'm sorry, but-". You don't need to say sorry, 90% of the time you're responding to a cheeky bastard who didn't think twice about putting you out or making you feel uncomfortable. We put it in almost automatically because we don't want to seem like a bitch or confrontational, but so what if we are? There's nothing wrong with stating your boundaries or standing up for yourself.

Grendalsmum · 23/03/2021 23:01

Do horses actually bond with humans in the same way that humans bond with them? Or are they happy where-ever as long as their needs are met? Just curious ...

maynardgkrebs · 23/03/2021 23:13

Excellent message to crazy horse lady.

If this was a Western, I'd still be waiting with ma trusty double-barrelled shotgun on Wednesday, too see that varmint off my land, in case she shows up.

I really hope the CCTV stays blank with no mad women creeping around holding carrots!

DiseasesOfTheSheep · 23/03/2021 23:35

@Grendalsmum

Do horses actually bond with humans in the same way that humans bond with them? Or are they happy where-ever as long as their needs are met? Just curious ...
They do bond with their humans, especially where the human ensures their needs are met and they're happy when they're around, but it's not the same way humans bond with horses. Mares especially can be very "different" with the one they perceive to be their own human. Some geldings are simply happy with whoever brings the food, others are more fussy.

But in my experience, many of the owners who bleat on about how much they love a horse, call it "the one" / "horse of a lifetime", and how strong their bond is, are not the ones with whom the horse would choose to live.

And for the PP whose heartfelt opinion is that the horse deserves to be with the person who proclaims their undying love for it rather than the one who meets its needs, it's simply my heartfelt opinion that this is just wrong. It's not "soft" to anthropomorphise horses - it's a massive disservice to the horse, and, in this instance, is definitely not in the horse's best interests.

justilou1 · 23/03/2021 23:39

I’ve come to the conclusion that a lot of people anthropomorphise animals to fill holes in their lives (Absolutely guilty myself... was just chatting to my big, stupid dog while folding laundry and complaining about how nobody is capable of checking pockets or turning socks the right way around 🤭). This crazy ex-owner is taking it to the extreme, though. She is romanticizing her relationship with this horse to the point that it is causing her to behave in an obsessive, stalkery manner. I imagine she’d be equally capable of transferring that kind of attention to a person if she aimed her emotional energy in their direction. I think she’s quite unwell, and as I said before, she may back off for a while, but it won’t be the last that @BlueEyesWhiteDragon hears from her - either directly or indirectly.

WisnaeMe · 23/03/2021 23:56

So ... he's the one, for her. I think he deserves to be the one. I see owning horses or dogs or cats or any other creature to be a kind of privilege, and we need to do right by them.

This boy needs to be home. And you should loan him to her or work out a payment plan or whatever, because TBH not her but the horse deserves this.

how very manipulative you sound 🤔

AcrossthePond55 · 24/03/2021 00:29

I've loved reading everyone's horse stories.

My 'teenage years' horse was Lightfoot (one white sock). He used to (intentionally) put one foot between the wires strung on the fence then just stand there, staring at me. When I'd bend over to lift his leg out of the wires he'd either nip my bum or nudge me over. It was a game he never tired of.

As far as names, my DS2 once told me if he ever owned a race horse he'd name it 'Hoof Hearted', just so he could hear the announcer say "And it's Hoof Hearted by a nose".

DazzlingHaze · 24/03/2021 01:03

I think the mention of you potentially reporting her for harassment might have been enough to get her to back off. Well done, OP! I hope this is the end of it for you so you can finally relax and enjoy your horse.

Seafog · 24/03/2021 01:55

Excellent message op, I hope in a good way, you never hear from her again

MathsDebating · 24/03/2021 02:11

This reply has been deleted

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AnotherKrampus · 24/03/2021 02:12

Would agree that was a good message, very firm but very nice. I think the mention of the harassment has hopefully done the trick.

LettuceAveIt · 24/03/2021 02:20

Get where you’re coming from but don’t you think your horse would be comforted to see this person. It’s not just an item of property. Can’t believe the slew of owners, poor horse.

maynardgkrebs · 24/03/2021 02:28

@LettuceAveIt

Get where you’re coming from but don’t you think your horse would be comforted to see this person. It’s not just an item of property. Can’t believe the slew of owners, poor horse.
All the more reason to let the poor horse settle where he is, without someone from his past bobbing in and out, reeking of her own need and ignoring his well-being, like in some bad custody case.
SausageBeanz · 24/03/2021 03:29

@BlueEyesWhiteDragon

Haha the tails (see what I did there) of shitlands do make smile. Do you reckon its ingrained in their DNA?

Cant remember who asked but I sent

^Hi A. I'm sorry but that does not work for me. Being completely honest the number of messages I've had from you is overwhelming and not something I can or am wiling to deal with going forward. I'm happy to have a more "normal" old owner exchange where we message each other a couple of times a year. However if we cannot do that then I would need to block you and/or report you for harassment which I would prefer not to do. I know you miss him and regret selling him and I do appreciate all the photos and stories of him - its been genuinely lovely to learn about his history. However he is not for sale, loan, part loan etc. I also love him greatly and he brings me joy in a way my others don't. I need to focus on building our relationship with each other and our future. With that in mind in person visits are not something I am willing to do. Ill send you some photos of our beach ride (covid permitting) later in the year. Xx^

I felt sticking the bit on the end was a mistake but I felt too awkward finishing it on such a abrupt way otherwise.

Letting A have him has been suggested before and whilst I won't flame you for it I have said I got him for a purpose - which is to get me riding again. If I was able to ride my others firstly I wouldn't have got him and secondly then the money wouldn't be an issue as such as I would still be riding and I would happily loan him out. However giving T to her now (either on a loan or selling at a third of what i paid for him) will leave me unable to afford another and so unable to ride. I'm not willing to do that. Also as an aside he's not treated any worse here because he's not my "one". He's loved. He has time spent with him fussing him, pampering him, just hanging out with him. He knows who I am and comes running over when he sees me probably for the food but whatever so its not like he's languishing for his old owner. This is his home now.

That was me OP. Thank you for obliging!

You did so very well with your message. Honest, firm but with retaining a touch of kindness. Well done, I know it must have been so hard to send it.

You absolutely don't have to justify why you don't want to sell your horse.

I don't currently have a horse (time just doesn't allow.. and whilst I'm a horsey person, I've been out of the game due to ill health for a while, hopefully starting back up riding soon! Coming upon a hack just the other day in the woods made me realise how much I've missed it!) but my opinion from my limited knowledge has always been that I don't like horses stabled up. I do appreciate sometimes it's neccessary in certain circumstances or for certain situations. But sometimes it's also not. And as the automatic 'go to' and 'normal' option, I've never thought it was the best option for the horse, and doesn't allow for natural behaviour other than grazing on a hay net. Some horses are perfectly fine with this, but you see so many with stereotypies as a result of mental stress of this. The answer is always to prevent and block the stereotypical behaviour of course, but never to look at the management and whether things could be done differently.

So I guess what I'm saying is I think you keep your horses in the kindest possible way for HORSES. There will always be humans who cannot recognise the difference between what animals need, and what we think they need based on anthropomorphic beliefs.

I don't think this horse would necessarily have a better life with old owner at all, and I'm gobsmacked at the minority suggested he would, simply because 'he was THE one' to her, with no other knowledge. I'm not necessarily convinced he'd have a worse off life either. But the fact she can't pay the market price for him, would suggest she couldn't afford the care either (unless of course he is just one of the pricier horses).

Regardless, she sold him. If she was forced by circumstance to do this, of course it's very sad. But you don't get to sell anything because circumstances force it, then harass owners years later.

I remember when I was young, at the stables I learnt to ride at. I fell in love with a big old ploddy 16.2 gent of a gelding He was the most placid and gentle horse I've ever met to date. I also volunteered at the stables, and never once did I see the owners there. I suppose I didn't see the point of that one, but it's not my place to judge either. I have an old photo of me and him. I went out the field to see him on my last day there. I gave him a cuddle and some fuss and left. Leaving the field (he well knew it was not time to come in!) he neighed 'after me' at the gate.

There will never, ever be another horse like him. He taught me to ride. I had a minor fear of other horses, the ones who bit (the shitlands), kicked (a couple of the big fookers), barged (the shitlands again). But he taught me the gentle side of horses. I had enquired to buy but the owners did not want to sell. Fair enough. I returned a couple years later (to ride) and he'd gone, been sold. I was gutted, as I felt I would have really appreciated him. But that's not to say no one else would have and loved him just as dearly. I certainly never felt the need to even enquire where he'd gone.

So, people can quite often get what they feel is a 'special bond' with a horse. In my case, I don't necessarily think it was reciporated, just perhaps tolerated, and maybe a bit of fondness because he knew I adored him. The other riders were busy wanting to ride the difficult ponies & horses. :D

I absolutely believe the new owner loved him just as much if not more. He was a difficult guy not to adore. Different circumstances of course, but bearing in mind I spent the best part of every day with this horse for a couple of years. Old owner needs to accept she is not the only one who can love this horse. I hope (and it sounds like he already is) he brings you much joy. Preferably without horse stalker tainting it.

Silvetmoon · 24/03/2021 07:07

To be honest, I’d be surprised if the OP DOESN’T hear anything back. I feel like the crazy horse lady is quietly plotting another way to go about things...

WiseOwlOne · 24/03/2021 07:24

The horse deserves a sane owner!
Agree that anthropomorphising the horse is cringey!

Daytimetellysucks · 24/03/2021 09:11

@Grendalsmum

Do horses actually bond with humans in the same way that humans bond with them? Or are they happy where-ever as long as their needs are met? Just curious ...
I do think they bond with us, but I don’t think it’s quite the same as our bond with them.

I don’t think they have the capacity to feel “love” like we do, but I think there is some kind of connection with their human.

For example, with DD’s pony - she doesn’t take her eyes off DD, she looks for DD if she’s a bit stressed or worried and looks for DD’s reassurance, whereas she doesn’t do that with me. She’ll follow DD everywhere and if DD goes and sits in their field, her pony will come and lay down next to her, or she’ll stand over her as if she’s protecting her. If I go in the field she’ll mug me for treats or tip over my wheelbarrow if I’m poo picking and wander off. With riding she’s brave and honest with DD, but is unsure with me and needs a little more reassurance - she trusts DD and while she trusts me to an extent, I’m not the one who usually rides her.

We could be all romantic about it and anthropomorphise their relationship and claim they have an amazing bond and she’s DD’s “heart horse” and how much the pony loves DD, etc, etc but I don’t think it quite works like that. No doubt DD’s pony loves her in the way she has the capacity to do, but it’s not some 21st century love affair. If DD moved on and we sold her would the pony then go on to form a ‘bond’ with someone else - yes, I think she would

countrygirl99 · 24/03/2021 09:19

@Grendalsmum

Do horses actually bond with humans in the same way that humans bond with them? Or are they happy where-ever as long as their needs are met? Just curious ...
I suspect mine just sees me as the catering staff.
Parkerwhereareyou · 24/03/2021 09:36

@WisnaeMe

So ... he's the one, for her. I think he deserves to be the one. I see owning horses or dogs or cats or any other creature to be a kind of privilege, and we need to do right by them.

This boy needs to be home. And you should loan him to her or work out a payment plan or whatever, because TBH not her but the horse deserves this.

how very manipulative you sound 🤔

? How nasty you sound 🙂

I just love (...) how if anyone dares express a dissenting opinion on here, especially if deemed to be based on sentimentality, then they are immediately manipulative. 😀

I've raised foals, and kittens, and puppies, and other young animals, and plants snd flowers from seed, from a young child. I was taught to cherish all life, by my parents. These animals we keep are in particular extraordinarily vulnerable and totally dependent on the kindness and skill of their human owners.

I feel sorry for the the woman, yes, but I also feel for the horse, as has been to several homes and one can't explain to them what's going on.

Of course he would recognise his old home and owner.

But as I think I've said, animals are bought and sold, some people don't feel the same protectiveness and sense of responsibility towards them as others do, and this is about ownership.

Why I said about swapping him out was because the OP said she liked him fine and he was very useful but he wasn't her favourite. So it sounded like she could have a perfectly nice replacement and it not bother her.

Of course she doesn't have to. But I imagine there are lots of horse owners out there who understand this woman's distress. And one thought might be - work out a deal, let her have him, she's gone. No more hassle. And you might feel like you've done something ridiculously nice and generous and kind, but that's not a bad feeling ....

No of course we are never obliged to do good deeds for others. Never. But I look at people on the street and see some open and happy and warm, and some much less so. I may be completely wrong but I feel the smiling ones have allowed their hearts to be big.

Ok, umbrella up, flack jacket on ....... 😀

ApplesPearsAndCrumble · 24/03/2021 09:44

The previous owner sold him 4 years ago because she could not afford to keep him. It is not cherishing all life to say the horse should go to someone who cannot afford to buy him and presumably keep him properly.

The previous owner sounds very vulnerable and more than a little unhinged. 104 messages, contacting the horse passport people. These are the actions of someone who needs to take care of their own mental health. IMO it would be potentially neglectful for the OP to release her horse into the care of someone like this.

ApplesPearsAndCrumble · 24/03/2021 09:46

... and the other pertinent point- she is under no legal or moral obligation to do so. The horse was sold. The horse has been bought. The OP now owns the horse and cares for the horse clearly very well. To my mind the OP has been exceptionally tolerant.

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