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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Upset about letter from neighbour, and angry at myself for telling DD

372 replies

SheikahSlate · 18/03/2021 12:03

This is my first post, so I hope I am posting in the right place. I guess I'm asking AIBU for being this upset. I'll try to be as succinct as possible. Sorry if it's a bit long.

Quick bit of context. My DD (now 6) and I moved into this semi-detached house in November (rented). The house is 'attached' to another building which has been converted into 6 small apartments (also rentals, but with a different landlord). DD has only recently been back in school (I'm not a key worker - I'm studying for a Masters and start teacher training in September), so we've been in A LOT, homeschooling, following guidelines, etc etc.

Back in November, a few days after we had moved in, my mum came round for a cup of tea (I'm a single parent, and I'm in a bubble with my parents). We were talking in the sitting room. There was a knock on the door and a young woman, probably early twenties, was stood there looking a bit perplexed. She asked, 'do you live here? I thought this was an office'. This slightly perplexed me, because it’s clearly a house, but I was pleased to meet a neighbour so quickly and said that my daughter and I had just moved in, and briefly introduced myself and enquired in turn about her. She's from London, but studying for a medical degree at the University here. She then said she had heard talking, so loud that it 'was like it was just right outside my window'. 'Great', I thought...'thin walls'. However, my mum and I don't talk particularly loudly - and were just chatting in a very normal way. I felt like the young woman was waiting for me to apologise or offer to reduce the noise, but I just felt that I shouldn't. I'm generally a very accommodating person (sometimes too accommodating, I think) but felt that I shouldn't offer not to talk, at a normal level, in my own sitting room. It turns out she lives basically in one room, and works at her computer on the other side of the wall. I did, however, feel sympathy that she could hear noise, and that this was disturbing her. I know that the previous tenant here was a divorced man who wasn't home at a lot - and without children - so she was probably used to blissful silence.

Anyway, I have never seen her since. I've already established a really good relationship with the people in the house next to us (another semi-detached), but see little of the people in the flats to the other side. Yesterday morning, however, as I was leaving the house to take DD to school, I saw a letter had been posted. It was four pages of A4 and I quickly scanned it as I was in a rush, but my heart sank when I realised it was from the young woman, apparently at her wit's end, about the noise coming from our house. The letter included one which she had composed just after Christmas, and one she had written that morning. She said she had resisted sending the one at Christmas at first, but that she's now really struggling.

Apparently she hears lots of shouting and thudding, which stops her going to sleep (she said she goes to bed very early some days - between 6 and 7pm after working at her placement) , and that the noise also impacts on her ability to concentrate on her studies. I have obviously obsessed and obsessed about what she could be referring to. Occasionally, but not that frequently, my DD decides to launch herself from the sofa, or climb to the top of the door frame and drop down, so that could explain the thuds. As far as 'shouting' goes, often I do shout upstairs - 'Are you OK?' - if she's playing in her bedroom. Or I call her from the kitchen, ‘Dinner’s ready!’. Admittedly, I will often have shouted either of these things at around 6-7pm, shortly before DD’s bedtime (but sadly DURING the bed time of the woman next door). I've started to become extremely paranoid about the level of noise we produce, but I just can't really, rationally believe it's anything beyond a normal level for a family of our (small) size.

I DO have sympathy. She's on her own, in a different city, studying for what must be an incredibly difficult degree, and under a huge amount of pressure. None of this is helped by COVID and the accompanying restrictions. I've struggled massively myself and definitely empathise. But I also feel slightly aggrieved that she didn't just come and speak to me sooner (and more directly, unlike that first time when she came round), rather than send me this really rather long essay about how desperate the situation has been for her, and basically lying it all at my door.

I've asked if we can speak face to face (she gave me her number in her letter), and we're going to speak tomorrow. I feel like my approach should be that, 'while I feel sympathy, we are a small family just doing normal things and behaving in a very normal way. I don't know what more I can do?’ Is this reasonable? It's so difficult...

What I'm most upset about, and angry at myself about, is that I STUPIDLY mentioned it my daughter. I am an absolute idiot. In the car I was in a bit of shock after receiving the letter, and feeling awful and weird, and gently told my daughter that we might need to be careful to keep the noise down otherwise we might upset the neighbours. She knew I had a letter in my hand, and put two and two together. Again, STUPIDLY, on my part, she overheard me mentioning it to a close friend near the school gates.

Sorry for all this rambling. But to finish - DD is a sensitive thing, and on our previous street, where we lived since she was born, we were surrounded by a huge array of really lovely neighbours. She's always associated 'neighbours' with friendly, almost family-like people. This has shaken her a bit and she keeps asking about our neighbour, and saying she feels 'bad and sad' about the letter. She even started whispering yesterday evening when we were in the sitting room, fearful that she might be being too noisy. I regret letting her know about this so, so, so much - it was an utterly stupid and irresponsible thing to do. So I guess I also would love any advice on how to repair the damage done here.

Sorry again for the rambling. Well done, and thanks, if you made it to the end.

OP posts:
applestrudels · 18/03/2021 13:49

Maybe she was brought up in a detached house... My ex was, and when we moved into terraced house together he was constantly jumpy and on edge because of the slightest normal noises from next door - the sort that you learn to block out when you’re used to it.

She should either get some earplugs, move, or just get used to it.

Muddledupme · 18/03/2021 13:53

We live in a semi and our neighbours are lovely, but part of life is hearing them do their day to day stuff. We can hear diy, the children and various other noises but we take no notice. Their youngest child has her bed on the other side of the wall with our bed on and occasionally she's hard to settle but that can't be helped so we just ignore it. You can't be expected to creep round your home.

Bilquis · 18/03/2021 13:55

If the noise level you have described is accurate, and not dumbed down to garner sympathy for yourself then your neighbor is being very unreasonable. I work from home Monday to Friday full time, do some work outside the home on a weekend and am also studying on the evening.
I live in an apartment block and have neighbours above, below and to the side of me.
I do not expect them to creep around like little mice, if I'm struggling to concentrate due to general neighbour noise I put on an audio book or some soft music to drown the neighbours out.
I think your neighbour, based on your version of events is being a little precious and should get over herself. The little nitwit cannot bend the world to her will as she chooses to go to bed at 7pm Hmm
Just tell her that you are sorry she goes to bed early but that is her choice. You could understand the complaint if the noise was at 9 to 10pm at night and if she feels that strongly she should raise a noise complaint with the council, who will ask her to either record the noise through the wall or come out with a decibel meter. However if the story is as you've described after this they will tell her to get a grip.

Eyesofdisarray · 18/03/2021 14:01

Neighbour sounds as if she is really anxious. I feel a bit sorry for her. She may have long days, studying, placements etc.
OP you come across as a caring, considerate person.
Normal family noise is to be expected, but the climbing/jumping might be the thing that's really bothering her. I get that some kids are more active than others (my DD loved climbing!!)but maybe toning this down would help.
Oh- can thoroughly recommend climbing walls places- DD loved them, great fun
Good luck 🙂

moanieleminx · 18/03/2021 14:01

I am very Nosy interested... what did she write about for 4 A4 pages?

StrudelSoup · 18/03/2021 14:02

Your neighbour is lucky that she has NO IDEA what it's like to really live underneath or beside a properly noisy neighbour. I've lived in tenements my whole life and had to have the council out for 4am parties on a Tuesday, etc...

She's a medical person so maybe stick a leaflet about Misophonia through her door as sounds like she has that (seriously). It's very much her problem and not yours. She needs to live in a detached house eventually. For now she needs to invest in noise cancelling headphones or ear plugs. You've done absolutely nothing wrong though. Nothing.

willibald · 18/03/2021 14:07

@problembottom

Have to say I don't agree with any suggestions to pander to this woman. She sounds fixated, extreme and very unreasonable - I very much doubt you'll be able to pacify her.

The next time she complains I'd tell her it's best she goes through the council who will decide if your noise is excessive. No more direct contact. Then live your life.

This. We've had neighbours like this. Do not engage with them at all. YY, tell her to go through the council and then walk away.

Have also had a move due to truly anti-social neighbours.

This person needs to get noise cancelling headphones, put on white or move (although you won't get full silence in flats, semis, etc).

MrsHuntGeneNotJeremyObviously · 18/03/2021 14:08

4 sides of paper because your six year old is behaving like any other six year old? She sounds nuts. It's totally unreasonable to expect quiet because she goes to bed at 7pm. I'm not sure I'd meet her - maybe just to tell her to move if she can't cope with normal neighbourly noise.

LookItsMeAgain · 18/03/2021 14:10

I'd take the position that you're not making excessive amounts of noise and while the previous tenant in your property may have been out a lot, we're in lockdown and children must be allowed some leeway in the amount of noise they are making. You'll not be stopping calling your child down from their room for their dinner and if the neighbour thinks the noise is excessive they are welcome to contact their landlord and the council about noise pollution and see how they get on with that but just to reiterate, you're living in your house and you'll not be changing anything about how you do that.
In the meantime, I would have a word with your daughter about climbing door frames and launching either on to or off of furniture around the house. I know that being stuck indoors is no fun and this type of energy would normally be burned up in a playground or at breaktimes in school but we're still in a pandemic and we're not quite back to all of these being options.

Disfordarkchocolate · 18/03/2021 14:11

Apart from the door frame thing you both sound entirely normal and not excessively noise.

Just keep calm and remind her that you are making entirely normal level of noise.

StrudelSoup · 18/03/2021 14:13

.... also she's gone to "the bad place" with this. I have quite an obsessive personality and sounds like she does too. She's grown this problem in her head until there's room for nothing else. Also her problem - not yours.

krustykittens · 18/03/2021 14:18

Sorry if this has already been said but not only does she sound obsessive but she also sounds passive aggressive and I would be nipping that in the bud. "Do you live here? I thought it was an office." What shite! She was being a smart arse and rude to boot. Be firm, OP. You are living your lives and you are not going to stop. She needs to figure out ways to cope with the sound of other people living around her, like everyone else does in an urban environment.

MrsHuntGeneNotJeremyObviously · 18/03/2021 14:20

Make sure you keep the letters. You might need them to demonstrate to either your landlord or hers that she is batshit.

Tinydinosaur · 18/03/2021 14:22

She occasionally shimmies herself up to the top of a door frame - one foot on either side of the frame kind of thing - and leaps off.

Isn't this a thing everybody did as kids and adults I don't think I've ever met a child that doesn't do this.

Anyway, yeah you're making normal family noise, we do the same, next door does the same, plus dogs barking, loud zoom calls, even hear them getting deliveries. It's life, she needs to get used to it or move to somewhere detached.

SheikahSlate · 18/03/2021 14:24

@moanieleminx

I am very Nosy interested... what did she write about for 4 A4 pages?
It was all really frantic, but a lot about the 'thudding', 'shouting' and hearing conversations word for word. She repeated a few times, to her credit, that she knows I live here with a young girl, but that she's got so much studying to do, and 'really looks forward to going to bed between 6-7' on a Friday, and how it takes her ages to 'drop off'. A lot about her placements and the pressure she's under, and that the noise is affecting her 'productivity'. Quite a bit of saying she has been resisting saying anything, but that she 'cannot go on'. That she's a quiet person herself, and that I should feel free at any time to let her know if she herself is causing a disturbance. The four pages consisted of two different letters - each written in a different pen. One was composed, she says, just after Christmas, and the other one last night. It was very overwhelming to read. She's obviously not in a good place at all.
OP posts:
krustykittens · 18/03/2021 14:27

We had a neighbour like this, briefly, hen we rented a flat in a converted house for six months. She screamed abuse at us for talking, banged on the roof if we walked around the kitchen preparing dinner and washing dishes, it was hellish. Always telling us were disturbing her 'work'. She liked to answer the door with a fountain pen in her hand to prove it. She wasn't working at all, she was just a nutter who fixated on us. I am afraid your neighbour sounds the same.

OverTheRubicon · 18/03/2021 14:27

@krustykittens

Sorry if this has already been said but not only does she sound obsessive but she also sounds passive aggressive and I would be nipping that in the bud. "Do you live here? I thought it was an office." What shite! She was being a smart arse and rude to boot. Be firm, OP. You are living your lives and you are not going to stop. She needs to figure out ways to cope with the sound of other people living around her, like everyone else does in an urban environment.
Agree. She's been very rude.

I've had noisy neighbours with kids, I've also lived in a flat with young kids with one very forgiving neighbour, and one absolutely mad neighbour, we did our absolute best but ended up going almost nuts ourselves, until we realised that tiptoeing around our own home and shushing normal toddler noise every 5 minutes was not a normal way to live.

Ultimately you have to check that you've been responsible where possible, by not putting tV sound bars on shared walls and minimising sofa jumping or shouting, but beyond that, living in a flat does involve shared noise.

SheikahSlate · 18/03/2021 14:29

@krustykittens

Sorry if this has already been said but not only does she sound obsessive but she also sounds passive aggressive and I would be nipping that in the bud. "Do you live here? I thought it was an office." What shite! She was being a smart arse and rude to boot. Be firm, OP. You are living your lives and you are not going to stop. She needs to figure out ways to cope with the sound of other people living around her, like everyone else does in an urban environment.
That bit was very, very odd. Our house is a tall, red brick, three floor townhouse type thing.
OP posts:
SilverRoe · 18/03/2021 14:31

I’m quite sensitive to noise, actually as i type this I can hear the weird periodic tapping on walls sound that seems to happen in my house fairly often (still never figured out where it comes from, it’s not DIY sounds!). But I get it’s my sensitivity so if it annoys me too much then noise cancelling headphones.

That’s what you need to suggest to her, music minis headphones to drown out sound is pointless unless she wants it at a cracking volume. She sounds very stressed but she’s being unreasonable. If she wants to go to bed during normal after tea time for families she needs ear plugs and her noise cancelling headphones with white noise or similar for studying.

BrownEyedGirl80 · 18/03/2021 14:31

Yabu to let your dd jump from a doorframe but nothing else

earthyfire · 18/03/2021 14:32

You can't live your life around her studies and her early nights. When I moved into my house my neighbours were used to living next door to an elderly women who lived alone so they were used to silence, they complained they could hear my child playing. My neighbours also went to bed early and said I needed to start putting my child to bed at 6.30 because they liked to be in bed by 7pm. I told them straight I wasn't going to live my life in line with their schedule.

LookItsMeAgain · 18/03/2021 14:33

Having just read your latest update @SheikahSlate, I'd be recommending that she start using earplugs if she struggles to get to sleep while you're just going about your business at what is a normal hour for an adult and child to be up and about.
You are not going to change your bedtime routines based on her bizarre letter and if she really is struggling that much, she should be raising these issues to her landlord and see if they can help with her predicament - if the landlord owns more than one flat in the unit, can they swap around with someone who may not be as impacted by the noise perhaps? It's not your place to try and fix it for her, she would need to do that herself but at least there may be options out there for her.

seepingweeping · 18/03/2021 14:35

You're not doing anything wrong. It's not like dd is throwing herself at the wall. She's a kid doing kid things at a reasonable time.

Post earplugs through her door.

FluWorldOrder · 18/03/2021 14:35

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Youarenothere · 18/03/2021 14:36

I think everyone is loosing it a bit in lockdown at the moment. Our usually very nice and friendly neighbours have been making complaints about the noise our normal family life creates. It started with specific toys my child was playing with then escalated to footsteps during their ‘chill out time’ (ie 6-7pm). I was accommodating at first, removed the offending toys, put extra rugs down, insisted on slippers in the evening, as they’re usually nice people. But to be honest they just kept pushing and demanding so I eventually sent DH down to tell them to fuck off with their unreasonable complaints. Haven’t heard anything since. Stand your ground OP, if you pander it’ll just be more demands next week.