To think it's normal to discuss an unborn baby's skin colour?

[JustWonderingIfYou]

In the exact same way you discuss their hair colour, facial features, height in relation to their parent's features.

I am "BAME", as is my partner- both mixed. So my baby is a super mix of at least 5 ethnicities- yes he is gorgeous . Whilst pregnant everyone spoke about what colour he would be, I thought this was normal.

It went from people joking about whether he'd need factor 50 like one grandparent to hoping he'd be dark enough to dance in carnival. Even jokes hoping he'd escape the "asian glow".

It stopped once he was born as it was, i hope, just curiosity as to how he would look. Although one particular family member celebrated every time she saw him that he was darker each time.

Is this not the case in other families? Wondering especially about other mixed BAME families.

-This is not directly related to MM but all the chatter has brought up whether I should have tried to stop these conversations or been offended by them.

Yanbu but MM used the word concern which suggests it wasn't an innocent "I wonder what skin tone Archie will have "

I think as it didn’t make you feel uncomfortable and you are all mixed then that’s ok. And the tone- it was said it excitement and the outcome wouldn’t alter how baby was treated.

A white familiarly raising ‘concerns’ over the darkness of skin is totally different.

I am mixed and wondered how that would affect my kids. My sibling with a child also wondered the same.

My siblings and I have compared who looks more "foreign" and my kids have also discussed which features might have been from my mum who isn't White British

Yes it's normal to have the conversations however it isn't normal to have 'concerns' about it.

Yes, we discussed it off hand when I had mine (I’m mixed race, kids dad is white).

I thought the way Meghan used her words led you to thinking it was a racist conversation. Whereas I can easily imagine having a conversation hoping the baby would have darker skin than Harry so baby doesn’t burn in the sun compared to a redhead. Had this kind of conversation about my own kids.

I think it's a normal topic of conversation as long as it's just normal curiosity/well intended.
I think it's quite cool that all my 4 kids have got a different skin tone. My son is fully white (and blond hair) like me. And my 3 daughters go from 'tanned white' to 'probably Indian heritage' to 'definitely Indian' (DH is Indian).
One of DH's cousin has 2 kids with his wife who is white, one is white like mum and one dark like dad. I find it quite interesting but yes similar to eye colour, hair etc

It seems reasonable to me, but i am white (Irish) and so is my dh so i am not really qualified to say. However, my dh is very pale and freckley while i have a more sallow/olive skintone and when i was pregnant i talked to my family about hoping the baby would have my colouring. I know it's not the same, but it seems a reasonable thing to talk about when discussing the baby.

I think it’s one think for a BAME family to have a well-intended conversation about which features a baby might be born with - the way anyone might speculate about their expected child’s hair or eye colour - and another thing for an entirely white family with historical and recent racist behaviour to express concern about the skin colour of the only mixed race child in the family.

I don't know. If I were biracial and my husband had some dubious issues in his past, doubtless the result if his learned experience, if his granny had been pictured learning how to do a Nazi salute, if my in-laws were a family who wore racist brooches, asked Aboriginal businessmen if they still chucked spears at each other, or made references to 'slitty' eyes, I think I might have some concerns if they commented on my unborn/future children's skin tone, too.

My daughter is very pale English and her partner Mediterranean colouring. We were curious all through the pregnancy whether her twins would take after her or him or be a mix.
It’s totally natural.

I'm white and my partner is mixed and we have people commenting on what our potential children would look like a lot. Some of the comments do make me a bit feel uncomfortable. To be honest the worst ones come from older members of his side of the family and imply that you wouldn't want your kids to be "too dark" (even though they themselves are dark skinned). I guess it's an internalised racism which is sad.

@CreosoteQueen

I think it’s one think for a BAME family to have a well-intended conversation about which features a baby might be born with - the way anyone might speculate about their expected child’s hair or eye colour - and another thing for an entirely white family with historical and recent racist behaviour to express concern about the skin colour of the only mixed race child in the family.

Maybe. But then you are excluding entirely the white side of a mixed race family. By it's very nature, the child being mixed race, are you saying only the BAME side of the family can comment on looks?

I am not mixed race, but do have a mixed Southern European/Northern European heritage. I have a sallow skinned, dark haired/dark eyed child, and a very pale skinned, blonde haired/blue eyed child.

My brother is married to a woman of a different race. All three of their DC has an extremely different skin tone. If they had another I’m sure we’d discuss it.

I really wonder if it would have been ok for Meghan’s mum to wonder what their child might look like?

@RedGoldAndGreene

Yanbu but MM used the word concern which suggests it wasn't an innocent "I wonder what skin tone Archie will have "

But Harry didn't report it like this, and he's the one who had the conversation!

People talk about what the child will look like, if it’s going to be a boy or a girl no matter what ethnic background. I wanted my kids to have husbands green eyes (didn’t happen)There’s more options with a mixed heritage so probably more chat. It depends on context.. do you think baby will have your beautiful skin colouring, vs I hope the baby isn’t too dark. One is lovely one is awful .

I was more surprised that it wasn’t Phillip.

I said the same thing the other day, when my good friend was pregnant it was a matter of speculation, not because any of us had prejudice but because it's a variable just like eye colour. It's no different to wondering if they will be a red head! Race can be mentioned without it being a negative, something that seems to have been lost. I'm not denying that people are still experiencing racism , just not everything has a race angle

We are mixed. Indian Jamaican and white English. This conversation has been had about all of my sisters babies.

Speculation from my white dh's family about any children we might have is usually along the lines of what a beautiful colour they will be rather than their pasty translucent (their words, before anyone starts).

Yes it is normal to discuss skin color. Im also an ethnic minority.

I was also hoping for our daughter to be fair skinned brown, nothing wrong with that imo.

Im sure people will disagree. But we all have preferences for our kids. E.g. some parents want kids to be tall, athletic, slim, etc... I dont see why skin tone is any different.

I am pale skinned, blue eyes and red hair. Husband is Spanish. Quite dark.
We absolutely discussed what colour skin/eyes/hair our babies would have. I also discussed it with my mum. None of us cared either way, but the speculation was fun.

Ive definitely had relatives discussing with "concern" the future colouring of my child. So I don't see them anymore. Everyone was having a chat. Some positive, some poking fun, nicely, and one definitely being a cunt. Context is everything.

Based on my personal experience of members of my extended family having vastly different skin tones, I’d say it was a very normal conversation to have. We definitely discussed it. It was the parents themselves who brought up the subject though, so we knew it was something they were wanting to discuss.

I think for anyone to set rumours going about a racist ‘concern’ and then not be more specific is deeply irresponsible. It leads to speculation and distrust. Especially when it’s reported second hand, by someone who wasn’t involved in the conversation. What was she thinking?!

No, I don’t think it’s “normal” as such, or at least if might come up in mixed heritage families, but it’s different if it’s a comment made from someone outside of your own community.

If a white Royal has said it about a mixed race woman’s future babies, there are only a limited number of contexts or versions of that conversation that could ever, possibly make it acceptable and far more versions of that conversation that are just completely inappropriate. So it’s not looking great is it?

The only possibly convincing “good” scenario I’ve been able to dream up personally, is one of Harry’s close family members saying to him “Slow down, don’t rush this relationship, it’s a lot for her to get into. She will inevitably face racism and so will your children. You can’t assume they will be fair skinned and therefore escape it. You know as well as I do the hate mail and scary post we get and the security that is necessary.,,,” That’s the only thing I can actually picture that wouldn’t be a complete disaster for the RF.

Every other possible version I can dream up would be wildly inappropriate conversations.

I do think this boil needs lancing, whatever the details turn out to be.

Would that member of the RF have really said I'm "concerned" about what the colour of Archie's skin will be, though? Maybe it was just a misunderstanding as in I wonder how dark he be just out of curiosity but it's been taken by M&H as that said person were showing "concerns?"