AIBU to wonder why men are so angry

[Moanranger]

Having read a Marina Hyde column in the Guardian about being followed & harassed by an angry man, plus my own recent experience with anger from a male stranger, I am asking this.
Where does this male anger come from? Drugs/meth? Steroid use? Just what?
My own recent experience was a road rage incident. I honked my horn at some boy racer (car with spoilers, low slung) speeding on my narrow, windy, busy lane. He screeches to a halt, jumps out of his car, then turns car around & follows me back to my drive, jumps out again & shouts “I know where you live, c**t”
Such anger over nothing, but v similar to Marina’s incident. This is a key issue, huge problem with male rage & toxic masculinity.

Having worked with a number of male violent offenders in the past, I can confirm that what @sunflowersandbuttercups and @MrsTerryPratchett have said is closer than a lot of people realise to the truth of where anger in men comes from.

@MysweetAudrina

Testosterone plays a role probably

This.

How can you not know this!?

Testosterone.
Its why in wildlife docs you mainly see male animals fighting each other more than female animals.
Think Stag, or Lions.
Chimps.
Most men rise above these animal instincts.
But the thickos find it difficult.
I see Angry Men (road rage typeswho hollet at female drivers is a good ecample) as being of lower intelligence.

Today, that miner’s grandson probably works in a warehouse or a crappy dead-end service job earning minimum wage and lacking status & self-respect. The potential for frustration, anger and aggression is obvious.

While I don't disagree that work stress/frustration/feeling underemployed and undervalued are potent and potentially dangerous feelings, I'm not sure I buy this. Many men work in service jobs/warehouses and are not aggressive. Moreover, many women work in similar jobs and are also not aggressive.

Toxic masculinity and the fact that there aren't any consequences. If he followed a man like that he may be in for a bloody nose, but a woman isn't going to try to take him on. He can laugh and snigger at her attempts to get him to leave her alone.

I often face toxic male behaviour when I most present a challenge to their entitlement. If I don't act in a stereotypically feminine way and am often called a 'Butch Dyke' - don't mind being thought of as gay but I do find dyke offensive or a bitch which is why I hate that word more so than any others.

For some men, you are challenging them by being in 'their' space which to many is outside. Add in, mental health problems, homelessness, drug/alcohol dependency - it's a poisonous cocktail. They also do it in groups, where they can back each other up because they're cowards.

Power and control. Anger can be a tool to exert fear, fear gives power which gives control.

Today, that miner’s grandson probably works in a warehouse or a crappy dead-end service job earning minimum wage and lacking status & self-respect. The potential for frustration, anger and aggression is obvious

But not the desire to go out and rape a woman - although I can see how they'd translate that to domestic violence.

It's societal too - since the Old Testament was written (and before, as it reflected the values of the time it was written) men have been topdog and women have been there to bear children and be there to serve men. So now some can't accept that things have changed - for millennia women have borne children and effectively been in the kitchen and bedroom.

@SylHellais

Some men are cowardly and they go after people where they think the interaction will be one where they guarantee to dominate. So they shout at someone who is potentially physically unlikely to batter them in the street in response.

This, in spades. They know that if they square up to another man or abuse him, they’re likely to get a smack in the mouth, but if they do it to a woman, she will almost always back down.

Totally agree.

I once had an incident at a motorway service station. My dh was driving and kids were relatively small. One was desperate for the loo so we pulled up quickly and being honest, dh pretty much abandoned the car and it was parked slightly over the line. I did comment but we were rushing so I jumped out to get the kids to the loo. Dh followed us in, then gave us the keys so I could load up the kids while he popped to the shop for snacks.

I went outside, car still crappily parked, loaded dd in, was walking round the other side to load in ds and a man literally squeezed his car in the space dh had left next to me so I couldn’t get ds in the car. There were plenty of other spaces and it was so close he couldn’t actually exit his car. I did consider asking him politely if he would let me in but saw the look on his face and thought better of it. I turned back to put ds in via the other door and he wound down his window and started shouting at me in front of dc telling me that I had no business driving such a big car if I couldn’t park and that I was a fucking selfish bitch who didn’t own the road. I was really shocked and afraid. I ignored him and put ds in the car as quickly as possible then jumped in the driver’s seat and locked the doors. I wanted to make a quick getaway so fastened ds in leaning over from the front. He continued to scream from the driver’s seat and stare at us in this really awful intimidating way. I was comforting the kids telling them to ignore the silly man, how funny he was shouting for nothing like that etc and just willing dh to hurry up. It was relatively quiet but there were a few people around and no one intervened. Maybe they also thought my driving warranted the abuse.

Funnily enough when dh did get back to the car and it became clear that he was the bad driver and that he might have something to say about the situation, angry man, who’s aggression previously knew no bounds, stopped shouting and drove off. Awful human being.

@HepzibahGreen My thoughts entirely. It is like a flick of a switch.

But the thickos find it difficult

It's a complete fallacy that intelligent men aren't violent or otherwise abusive towards women or others.

It is entitlement.

Men treat women the way customers treat people in services jobs.

They think they can speak to you however they like and respond with utter rage if you don’t completely capitulate to them.

(Not all men. Not all customers)

It’s such an interesting question, and it’s one I think about a lot.

I don’t agree it’s testosterone, women also have testosterone, albeit much less and there have been studies showing little effect on raised testosterone on temper.

I think it’s much more likely to be societal. Toxic masculinity, combined with misogyny and the benefits a male-led society brings to other men. I don’t mean that’s a conscious thought process, although no doubt it will be for some. But more the constant upper-hand men have generally, like not being affected by the gender pay gap or sexualisation from a very young age or being at the mercy of menstruation and hormone fluctuations for most of adult life.

Unpopular but truthful response;

Because men are hardwired to be more aggressive than women. Years of primal programming cannot be replaced by the thin veneer of civilisation that has only been in place for a sliver of evolutionary time.

Men and women are fundamentally different in terms of their biology. Men are more attracted to physical danger. They are more likely to confront situations in a physical way (than women.)

It’s the way nature has made them

The potential for frustration, anger and aggression is obvious

But not the desire to go out and rape a woman

Rape is much more about frustration, anger and aggression than about sex.

Unpopular but truthful response

I think you mean stereotyped, ill-informed and reductive.

Men and women are fundamentally different in terms of their biology. Men are more attracted to physical danger. They are more likely to confront situations in a physical way (than women.)

Then why are they taking out their aggression on women who present little if any threat, since they love danger so much?

Lack of consequences I am sure is a factor. I think also a lack of good male role models for many boys as they grow up. I wonder if in ethnicities and cultures in the Uk where divorce and/or single parents are less common (those of Indian heritage seem an example) are less aggressive towards women (or indeed other men).

OP
My ex used to get road rage but his vile vernal abuse nearly always aimed at older women, age 40 and over.
Get off a the way you sully old cow kind of talk.
However if a younget woman accidentally cut him up at the lights he would predictably let it slide.
Pathetic.
He was as thick as shit. That type usually is. and I'm well rid.
.

don’t agree it’s testosterone

Me either really, I mean it's a part of it in sure but it feels like a cop out. It certainly doesn't work like that for me

And why do men who beat their partners often appear to be such nice, calm, non confrontational people at work and in friendship groups? Why can they control their aggression so well outside of the home?

@Firstbellini

And why do men who beat their partners often appear to be such nice, calm, non confrontational people at work and in friendship groups? Why can they control their aggression so well outside of the home?

Exactly, if it was testosterone they’d be unable to control it against their 7ft tall, bodybuilding, cage fighting colleague. And yet they, miraculously, can.

I think that's why A Handmaid's Tale is so chilling. I don't think it would take much for men to go into full steam suppression of women if backed into a corner.

So many men seem unprepared for modern life. Online dating and availability of Internet porn have made it worse. They will read about the experience of some random man on the internet and believe it applies to them.

And men used to have it easy - the pick of the jobs, women with few earning options keeping them happy at home. Now, life is more competitive for men but a lot of them don't quite get it so bland women fir their lack of success.

I'm now automatically really suspicious of any single man older than about 32, as I assume they lead a life of Internet dating and casual sex encounters. I would never risk dating a man if I dudnt know him through friends and family or a hobby first.

Why do so many of them have no bloody clue? They think the average woman will actually be pleased to be approached on the street or on social media and be invited to have sex with a total stranger?

Last time I was out pre covid with a friend having a catch up in a bar, we were approached by 2 older men who would not ieace us alone when we made it clear we weren't interested. Her one was particularly persistent and his line was that he would take her out for dinner and she wouldn't have to pay. She's a lawyer. Do these men really think women can't afford to pay for their own diner and the choice is between sitting listening to a man old enough to be their father droning on or spaghetti hoops out of a tin?

No doubt that man isnow angrily dating a woman nearer his own age while attempting to send messages to younger wonrn online and will end up dumped and complaining about women.

@IntermittentParps

It’s not ill-informed though is it? Tons of research has been done on the primal (biological) programming of the two sexes. They are fundamentally different, due to the different roles nature requires them to fill.

And let’s not forget, modern expectations of what constitutes “civilised” behaviour is just that.......a modern expectation.