My new neighbour is a convicted murderer

[murdernextdoor]

Have recently found out from another neighbour further up the street that my new next door neighbour has spent 4 years in prison for man slaughter of another man. I was sceptical so I googled his name. I saw all the newspaper articles about him. He had a fight and killed another man.
Don't know the reasons for the fight but I can't help but wonder if it was one of those cases of a one punch kill. Or maybe he stamped his head?

I am horrified that this man lives next to me. I now don't want my children to mix with his children anymore. I know some will say he's done his time, but imagine if it was your son he killed? It makes me sick to my stomach.

Should someone have notified us in some way about him moving there? Or maybe not as he's done his time and isn't a sex offender.

AIBU or would you be horrified as well? AIBU to tell my children to stay away from the house altogether. (I know it's covid now but I'm thinking in the future)

YABU.
He has done his time. People who spend time in prison need somewhere to live when they are released. What do you think would happen by letting your kids play with his?

Manslaughter is not murder.

But I would share your concern, anyone who can commit that sort of violent crime I would not want around my children.

If housing ex offenders was as simple as believing someone has done there time and has been rehabilitated and there are no concerns then housing ex offenders wouldn’t be an issue as everyone would welcoming to them

But rehabilitation is not that simple or straight forward abs neither is someone has down their time they feel remorseful and all is ok now

As I said before it natural to want to protect your family we may believe they have the right to live life as a free person but vast majority it would be just not around our families

[quote Bleughbleughbleugh12]@murdernextdoor disagree with that, one punch in the wrong place and it could well be game over unfortunately 😕 I’d be wary but not too worried as a PP said at least it wasn’t a woman and a premeditated attack[/quote]
Yes some people have abnormally thin skulls. No way of knowing by looking at them.

There are some eminently sensible and realistic people on this thread. There are also some people, who if they truly considered the risk we all encounter every day, would never leave the house.

@RoseRedRoseBlue

There are some eminently sensible and realistic people on this thread. There are also some people, who if they truly considered the risk we all encounter every day, would never leave the house.

Even if that were not an entirely groundless belief with no evidence, so what? People are allowed to decide for themselves what risks they are prepared to take. We make risk/benefit analyses every day. For many people, being trustful of a man with a manslaughter conviction doesn't have a potential benefit that is worth the risk.

It’s not entirely groundless at all.

@RoseRedRoseBlue

It’s not entirely groundless at all.

Well that settles it.

Well, you seem to think that your statements are equally conclusive. I am sharing my opinion, what’s the issue?

@RoseRedRoseBlue

Well, you seem to think that your statements are equally conclusive. I am sharing my opinion, what’s the issue?

You are presenting your opinion as statement of fact, and when challenged on this, you've literally got nothing but "it's not groundless". No substantiation.

I'm offering actual thought processes, such as risk/benefit analysis of allowing your kids intended with a convicted killer in order to get....whatever benefit that's supposed to be. Or pointing out the flaw in basing your argument on the utterly unfounded statement that we can all kill people if we are angry, even though the huge majority of us never do.

@DrSbaitso, interpret my posts however you wish, they hold no more or less weight than anybody else’s. I do believe that everyone has the ability, in the right circumstances, to commit serious offences or even kill. Decades of civil wars, genocides and recent global history give testament to this.

How many on here have come face to face with someone they know has committed such a serious crime but has no idea how they are as a person and felt completely fine just because they are served their time in prison. We are not that trusting by nature (for often good reason)

Few have

You are always more aware when you are, you are on hour guard more. Thankfully most of us are blissfully unaware when we do come into contact with someone who has been in prison for such a crime

But it’s just nonsense to believe you would be absolutely fine just becuase you get felt such a person had served their time and has been rehabilitated

That is a very interesting point

As I said before it natural to want to protect your family we may believe they have the right to live life as a free person but vast majority it would be just not around our families

1. Many of these criminals are parents of children themselves, where should they live so their children can attend the same schools as your children?

1. Criminals released from prison - where should the live? In some uninhabited island?

[quote RoseRedRoseBlue]@DrSbaitso, interpret my posts however you wish, they hold no more or less weight than anybody else’s. I do believe that everyone has the ability, in the right circumstances, to commit serious offences or even kill. Decades of civil wars, genocides and recent global history give testament to this.[/quote]
It's not about "interpreting" them, it's about what you are actually doing, which is presenting unsubstantiated opinions as fact.

Soldiers on the front line are not comparable to killing a man in anger in a pub fight. They're arguably not even comparable to the relatively few people who are actually responsible for starting wars off and making the decisions - and anyway, there have always been conscientious objectors and others who refused to do it, even if it meant getting shot.

You may believe all people are capable of killing in anger, even though very very few ever do, but it's a belief without much to back it up and you are presenting it as fact. Same goes for your assertion that everyone who wouldn't want to associate with a convicted killer is unable to make a decent risk/benefit analysis.

The jury looked at the evidence in this case and decided that whatever defence he had didn't fly. They were convinced beyond reasonable doubt that this killing was not lawful. They may have been wrong, but I wouldn't bet my kids' safety on it.

But even if your opinions were established fact, they wouldn't make a difference. People can choose for themselves what risks they wish to take, and in most cases that's going to include limiting association with a convicted killer. I don't believe that the majority of people on here wouldn't feel uneasy about it. I simply don't. We're not saying he hasn't now got his right to freedom etc, we're saying that we wouldn't want to live next door to him either if we could avoid it, and we're sure as hell not leaving our kids with him.

I'm honestly surprised that so many people insist they'd be fine with it. The place goes into moralistic meltdown over cake smashes, Christmas Eve boxes and answering the door.

If I knew someone, they seemed nice and I discovered they had a manslaughter conviction, I'd feel the same way. Don't killers often seem like nice people? If I didn't know, of course I wouldn't react, but just because I'm unaware of the risk doesn't mean it isn't there.

It’s possible that he deeply regrets his actions and it was a one off, however, the likelihood is this guys a violent thug. I would not be happy if he moved next door to me and I would not want my kids going in his house without me present.

I'd not be comfortable.
Minor kids' squabbles would have me a quivering wreck incase the Dad next door got angry.
Maybe completely ott irrational thinking and absurd but that's how I'd feel OP.

@DrSbaitso this is a discussion forum, not a PhD referencing exercise. I have already made it perfectly clear that my opinion is no more or less valid than anyone else’s. I also see you have completely twisted my words in your third paragraph to bulk out your....wait for it....OPINION! Anyway, I am not going to get into any further dialogue with you because it’s futile. Have a great night.

@murdernextdoor

Listen I don't want to give out specifics as it will out the area I live in. Stop saying he was protecting a kid or a woman or what not. It was two men fighting outside a pub. He's not a nice man. This is what led to to the conversation with my other neighbour. She told me about him as she knows the mother of his kids very well. He has a temper is what she told me and then said about him just getting out of prison a few months ago. He moved in next door 6 weeks ago.

Kids can play outside with other kids. I stated in my OP that I was thinking to the future as the neighbourhood children have always played together prior to covid restrictions. In and out of houses and gardens etc.

I don't believe that any of you would be happy about this. Imagine if it was your son he killed. The kids are in their mothers care. It is her house. He lives there as well but the house is in her name. I know this as other neighbour has known his partner for years before she even moved to our street.
Perhaps other neighbour shouldn't have told me all of this, but it came from me asking her about him as I felt he was weird or something. Gave me a weird feeling. Turns out I was right. Something was off about him. He killed someone and that is a fact.

So you and the neighbour have been gossiping. You still don't know the ins and outs just the narrative from your neighbour who possibly got it from the postman who had been chatting to the old man and who lives down the street... Your choice to not have your children play together but if the only reason is you've heard some gossip, well I have no words. Sadly, men intoxicated fight on occasion. It does not mean that errors made in their youth should ruin their future. He may be a violent prat, he may not but unnecessary gossip is just that, unnecessary and unkind.

I'm back, I have read all the posts and I will admit I was wrong to say my children shouldn't mix. It was a knee jerk thought. I just meant if (in future) when kids playing and into each other gardens etc, that would mean my dc were or May end up in his company. That is not something I'm going to allow. I don't know if he may get angry over something or scare my kids etc. I don't care to find out.

It isn't gossip btw to the poster who claimed it. As I previously stated my other neighbour further up the street, has actually known his partner for years and years. So she told me his name and about the conviction.

Also, she told me he does have a history of a temper with his partner. This was disclosed to her by his partner. Yes, other neighbour should not ha r passed this info on to me, but she has and I now know this info. He's got a temper and he ultimately killed a man outside a pub.

I also said I had further info which I saw on the newspaper articles which confirmed he didn't do this based on self defence or to heroically save a woman etc. If I tell you all the exact details you will google it and know where I live.
I will tell you it had something to do with sectarianism here in Scotland.
Facts I don't know are how he died, did the neighbour take it too far, or did he knock him out and he just died from the punch. This I don't know.

I frankly don't give a shit how this man feels and I do feel real fear having a man living next door to my family who is capable of taking someone's life.
I have never been in a physical fight with anyone, so it is hard for me to understand how someone could become so violent to a complete stranger.

Sorry I called it murder. I feel it probably was, the man is still just as dead over something that could have easily been walked away from.
Anyways thanks for the input. I still think most of you are talking utter shite to say you would be happy with this.

He's obviously got no regard for human life that's for sure. You don't just die from a fight unless one persons takes it too far.

Stop talking shite and go and blow in a brown paper bag.

Bloke probably got knocked over and hit his head. It happens more than you think,

StoneofDestiny

I am not suggesting that they are sent away to some remote island. The point I was making is the op’s response is perfectly natural and I don’t believe that those claiming it wouldn’t bother them as the man has served his sentence (oh and apparently rehabilitated not sure why that assumption has been made) would actually feel this way

It’s not in our nature to be so trusting of someone we know has committed such and we don’t know them we don’t know their character

We would prefer who we perceive as violent people to be away from our families

Sorry I called it murder. I feel it probably was

But it wasn't. It was manslaughter.

this is a discussion forum, not a PhD referencing exercise. I have already made it perfectly clear that my opinion is no more or less valid than anyone else’s.

"Well I've got the right to say it" is the last resort of someone who cannot defend their point and therefore has to switch to arguing about whether they can say it anyway.

Back to you, OP. The more you say, the more sure I feel in what I've been saying in response. You're not at all unreasonable to be wary of this man and to feel unsafe around him. If it wasn't self defence, then I guess that means he didn't fear for his safety and did intend to harm his victim. He just didn't intend to go quite as far as killing him. (It is actually quite hard to kill a person, especially a fit and able grown man.) This is a pretty low bench mark for human decency and trustworthiness and I wouldn't be happy either. And he's an angry man in general? Yeah, I don't like those either.

Short of moving house, there isn't really anything you can do. He's a free man, as per the law. Is he reformed? Who knows. You certainly aren't obliged to risk your family's safety on it to prove anything about yourself. I'd steer clear and I certainly would not allow my kids to be with him.

If he really is reformed and remorseful of what happened, he'll understand why people don't trust him and he'll accept that as a fair consequence of what he did. He's presumably grateful that he wasn't imprisoned for life.

With the odd exception, I call complete bullshit on posters who claim they wouldn't feel at all uneasy living next door to this guy. On Mumsnet, of all places. The site where people don't answer the door and think Christmas Eve boxes are a sign of moral collapse. Yeah, right. 99% of us would feel exactly the same as you do, with good reason.