To think that most men do respect women

[katieloves]

I’m concerned about the vilification of men that we’re hearing a lot about. I know there’s some men who disrespect women and this absolutely needs to stop, but equally I’ve witnessed women being equally disrespectful to men. I’ve seen plenty of women feeling up men etc. on a night out and it being laughed off. If this was reversed it would be considered assault. It feels like all men are being accused of treating women badly and I just don’t see it.

@OppsUpsSide

Deleted for acknowledging suicide is a violent act sorry to disappoint anyone naive enough not to realise this. I have never witnessed a suicide that was non violent, to peddle the line that suicide is a non violent act is disgraceful.

Know when to stop FFS.

I'll just say this ONE LAST TIME! The reference to increasing male suicide rates was only to highlight that the healthcare system was letting males down too. Because the statement that the healthcare system is sexist was just taking a step too far in this thread that was about most men being respectful.

It was NOT in any way in response to women suffering violence at the hands of men.

One sure thing, nothing to be proud of when you bully someone just because they don't agree with the 'gang'.

@dontdisturbmenow

I'll just say this ONE LAST TIME! The reference to increasing male suicide rates was only to highlight that the healthcare system was letting males down too. Because the statement that the healthcare system is sexist was just taking a step too far in this thread that was about most men being respectful.

It was NOT in any way in response to women suffering violence at the hands of men.

One sure thing, nothing to be proud of when you bully someone just because they don't agree with the 'gang'.

Quite. Did you see they bullied someone else off and then congratulated themselves on how clever they are? On another thread, they are all deciding to ignore the likes of you and me.

Takes me right back to school.

my 16 year old ds and his friends 100% respect women.

Until you're not there - at DD's school the very polite and well brought up boys who are very respectful to the adult women around them will audibly assume a girl is in a bad mood is on her period, will discuss how "hot" a girl looks etc etc. By the time they are 16 it is already engrained to disrespect the girls. Studies into co-ed classrooms indicate that boys take up far more time in a lesson than girls. There was a very well researched thread on here the other day about how in primary school boys take up most of the playground to play football etc pushing girls to the edges (unless they occasionally "allow" the girls to play football with them). By the time they leave school they might be respectful to adult women but they are already conditioned to treat their female contemporaries as lesser beings whether they are aware that they are doing it or not.

[quote Twintub]@RootyT00t

Please start a thread on something I can get behind like male suicide for example. I genuinely don’t think you presented an alternative POV or debate here that is credible.[/quote]
This. ^ Well said. I am actually embarrassed for RootyT00t ...

But you only give a shit about the female sex if they follow your agenda. You've proved that.

How so? Follow what 'agenda' - that women deserve both equality and fairness without biological men, those with gender ideology, and 'not all men' defenders undermining the rights and safety of women with their conservative and fundamental idealisms of how society should continue to work? That 'agenda'?

Are you littlepattilou? I'm sure il cope.

I think it's far more likely you're just irritated that you're not managing to get your number of posters you have bullied off the thread up to three.

I'm not the one who needs to be utterly ashamed.

@BrumBoo

But you only give a shit about the female sex if they follow your agenda. You've proved that.

How so? Follow what 'agenda' - that women deserve both equality and fairness without biological men, those with gender ideology, and 'not all men' defenders undermining the rights and safety of women with their conservative and fundamental idealisms of how society should continue to work? That 'agenda'?

Well, that someone with different views to yourself deserves no credibility, despite being a woman.

I think a lot of women who wheel out the whatabouttery are extremely naïve. I strongly suspect these women haven't encountered much harassment from men in their lifetime; in the form of stalking, unwanted attention, categorical abuse, rape, sexual assault.

I last my virginity to a rapist. I went on to marry a man who nearly killed me. In the last few years of being single, I've come across an incel, stalker and a love bomber. I have now made a conscious decision to remain single and to figure out the best way to filter these unsavoury types.

Without saying to much, my own DF is a man of integrity, which I think added enormously to my naivety of men in my formative years. And thankfully I have been fortunate to associate with other such men, who are respectful of women and are decent human beings.

However, as in my PP, there seems to be a fast growing movement on the internet toward women hating. This is evident on several platforms, this one included.

lost

@SmileEachDay, thanks.

I was involved in my previous role. Not now. I saw young vulnerable men have it really hard because they were usually not considered as vulnerable as young women and didn't have to as much support.

But it was never and still never is about make vs female. Both can be equally vulnerable and finding life hard.

What are the consequences of misandry'?

It's not 97% of men saying they've experienced sexual harassment
It's not 2 men a week being killed by their female partner
It's not men being paid less for the same work
It's not men taking on the bulk of childcare abs housework

Nobody is denying that there are issues that impact men. Many of them have been mentioned on this thread and they do need to be debated and addressed. The place to discuss these issues is not at the same time we are discussing male violence against women.
It's just like all those people who ask when international men's day on IWD - it detracts from the issue being discussed.

@TheJerkStore

What are the consequences of misandry'?

It's not 97% of men saying they've experienced sexual harassment
It's not 2 men a week being killed by their female partner
It's not men being paid less for the same work
It's not men taking on the bulk of childcare abs housework

Nobody is denying that there are issues that impact men. Many of them have been mentioned on this thread and they do need to be debated and addressed. The place to discuss these issues is not at the same time we are discussing male violence against women.
It's just like all those people who ask when international men's day on IWD - it detracts from the issue being discussed.

I didn't ask what it's not.

Root

If I say “Men’s violence towards women is a huge issue”

Do you think I mean:

A) Men(as a class)’ s violence towards women(as a class) is a huge issue.

Or

B) I’m a misandrist and am saying every single individual man is violent.

I’ve been trying to think of the consequences misandry has on society at large and I can’t think of any. Happy to hear any suggestions anyone might have.

@SmileEachDay

Root

If I say “Men’s violence towards women is a huge issue”

Do you think I mean:

A) Men(as a class)’ s violence towards women(as a class) is a huge issue.

Or

B) I’m a misandrist and am saying every single individual man is violent.

A.

But therefore why am I accused of being a misognystic woman hater by calling our some of the appalling behaviour by women on these threads?

Both can be equally vulnerable and finding life hard

The vulnerability comes from very different places, doesn’t it. One of the reasons for the high rates of male suicide is without doubt the drive for western men to be alpha, to never show “weakness”. This comes out in many, many toxic ways.

Rooty.

Why do you insist that women should not speak up against male violence and misogyny in case it hurts innocent men's feelings?

Why do you consider it to be misandry for women to talk about these things?

Are you saying we should shut up about male violence altogether and the fact that men are more likely to kill each other than to kill women on the street means that we should not ever say that women are subject to harassment or worse because of their sex?

Not one woman on here has said all men hate women but we live in a society where everyday misogyny is acceptable but ill treatment based upon any other protected characteristic is not. Scotland has passed a law on this issue this week.

Women should not be silenced for calling out these things. Men have a responsibility to own the fact that largely speaking they are responsible for violence whoever that is aimed at.

We don't call out these things enough in young boys which encourages the culture of 'well boys will be boys'. Catcalling young girls is not a criminal offence.

I have a young son with mental health issues who I love dearly but I do not accept that young women should have to put up with the misogynistic behaviour of men as a sex class to somehow protect his feelings.

@lifeturnsonadime

Rooty.

Why do you insist that women should not speak up against male violence and misogyny in case it hurts innocent men's feelings?

Why do you consider it to be misandry for women to talk about these things?

Are you saying we should shut up about male violence altogether and the fact that men are more likely to kill each other than to kill women on the street means that we should not ever say that women are subject to harassment or worse because of their sex?

Not one woman on here has said all men hate women but we live in a society where everyday misogyny is acceptable but ill treatment based upon any other protected characteristic is not. Scotland has passed a law on this issue this week.

Women should not be silenced for calling out these things. Men have a responsibility to own the fact that largely speaking they are responsible for violence whoever that is aimed at.

We don't call out these things enough in young boys which encourages the culture of 'well boys will be boys'. Catcalling young girls is not a criminal offence.

I have a young son with mental health issues who I love dearly but I do not accept that young women should have to put up with the misogynistic behaviour of men as a sex class to somehow protect his feelings.

Why do you insist that women should not speak up against male violence and misogyny in case it hurts innocent men's feelings?

Why do you consider it to be misandry for women to talk about these things?

Are you saying we should shut up about male violence altogether and the fact that men are more likely to kill each other than to kill women on the street means that we should not ever say that women are subject to harassment or worse because of their sex?

I have never said anu of these things.

@katieloves

I’m concerned about the vilification of men that we’re hearing a lot about. I know there’s some men who disrespect women and this absolutely needs to stop, but equally I’ve witnessed women being equally disrespectful to men. I’ve seen plenty of women feeling up men etc. on a night out and it being laughed off. If this was reversed it would be considered assault. It feels like all men are being accused of treating women badly and I just don’t see it.

Oh god. I don't know if your just, ummm how to say this, challenged with your thinking or a troll.

I really can't belive any woman can get to adulthood and have this little awareness of the gender power divide. Yuu just can't be that daft. Which makes this op juat redic.

Nice try though.

women hating
I like men and women. I dislike men who think all -or most- women are the source of all their troubles. I also dislike women who believe the world would be better without men.

Thankfully in real life both groups are a minority.

@lifeturnsonadime

Rooty.

Why do you insist that women should not speak up against male violence and misogyny in case it hurts innocent men's feelings?

Why do you consider it to be misandry for women to talk about these things?

Are you saying we should shut up about male violence altogether and the fact that men are more likely to kill each other than to kill women on the street means that we should not ever say that women are subject to harassment or worse because of their sex?

Not one woman on here has said all men hate women but we live in a society where everyday misogyny is acceptable but ill treatment based upon any other protected characteristic is not. Scotland has passed a law on this issue this week.

Women should not be silenced for calling out these things. Men have a responsibility to own the fact that largely speaking they are responsible for violence whoever that is aimed at.

We don't call out these things enough in young boys which encourages the culture of 'well boys will be boys'. Catcalling young girls is not a criminal offence.

I have a young son with mental health issues who I love dearly but I do not accept that young women should have to put up with the misogynistic behaviour of men as a sex class to somehow protect his feelings.

Rooty isn't interested in answering those valid points. Just interested in arguing himself (I don't believe he's a woman) inside out.

@RootyT00t you talk about misandry a lot - what are the consequences of misandry on society as a whole?

@dontdisturbmenow

women hating I like men and women. I dislike men who think all -or most- women are the source of all their troubles. I also dislike women who believe the world would be better without men.

Thankfully in real life both groups are a minority.

👏👏👏👏👏👏

Weirdly enough, I know far less men who are women hating than the absolute vile toxic environment on here.

Well, that someone with different views to yourself deserves no credibility, despite being a woman.

There's 'different' views and there are views that are actively trying to discourage women for calling out the fact that it men/male sex that is categorically and overwhelmingly the issue of abuse, violence and murder in this world. And that we should be more understanding of men because obviously they have their 'mental health issues' or some other excuse as to why we cannot call it out for what it is. The latter is not only unhelpful to the situation, it is actively keeping the situation going as it is, because it implies 'poor men' can't help themselves and we should put up with it and 'be kind'.

You have zero counter arguments as to why men are not the problem, you don't seem to deny that men as a very high percentage are the instigators of abuse against both women and men, yet for some reason you're trying to make it a women’s problem and suggest we are the ones being awful here. How you can you see that men cause the issue but still be here lecturing us about misandry is beyond me.