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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think that most men do respect women

999 replies

katieloves · 13/03/2021 08:36

I’m concerned about the vilification of men that we’re hearing a lot about. I know there’s some men who disrespect women and this absolutely needs to stop, but equally I’ve witnessed women being equally disrespectful to men. I’ve seen plenty of women feeling up men etc. on a night out and it being laughed off. If this was reversed it would be considered assault. It feels like all men are being accused of treating women badly and I just don’t see it.

OP posts:
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6
RootyT00t · 13/03/2021 11:18

[quote ineedaholidaynow]@RootyT00t respect needs to be taught to everyone for everyone.

If we are going to expect men to call up other men on sexist banter, then women need to do the same[/quote]
I agree.

Women need to call our other women, instead of insisting that all women are always right and that women never treat men badly and if they do it's OK.

Twintub · 13/03/2021 11:18

@RootyT00t

You need to start your own thread : Are woman equally disrespectful to men

Instead of derailing this one

RootyT00t · 13/03/2021 11:19

[quote Twintub]@RootyT00t

You need to start your own thread : Are woman equally disrespectful to men

Instead of derailing this one[/quote]
I don't know if you're aware of how threads work, but it's not an echo chamber of 32 responses of oh yes we agree.

My point was a rhetorical one and very much relevant.

Twintub · 13/03/2021 11:20

Not that I disagree with you woman can be arseholes too

TheJerkStore · 13/03/2021 11:20

Do women completely 100% respect men?

I respect men who respect women.

Twintub · 13/03/2021 11:20

I think it’s like comparing apples and pears. - sorry

Seatime · 13/03/2021 11:21

I had a group of male friends as a teen, from a boys boarding school. One day a boy who just had his cast off his broken leg said. 'It feels amazing', while stroking his leg, 'like having a wank!'. He then realised there was a girl in the group and was embarrassed and the boys shared a knowing look, like, keep that info in our club. So, it taught me that the boys have a code for in public and another set of behaviours in their boys club. They had a literal name for their boys club, which l wasn't allowed in. And no there's nothing wrong with wanking and l didn't feel violated, l just got a behind the scenes look. Boys are not born bad, the patriarchy fucks them up, to be entitled and grabby. Just look who's at the top of the work pyramid.

littlepattilou · 13/03/2021 11:21

And people can fuck off with the 'misandry' accusations. Are women not allowed to talk about how they - and other women - are/have been treated badly and disrespected by some men, without the shitty and predictable misandry bollocks?! Hmm

Sorry, but you're not going to shut us down. Women have been silenced, and kept down for too long now (and often by men.) You're deluded if you think that 'misandry' accusations are going to shut us down.

It's sickening that there are a few women on here who are accusing the women on here of man-hating PURELY because they are sharing their stories of problems with men, or making points, and offering their views and opinions.

That's if it IS women, and not men coming on here, who are pissed off, because the truth hurts!

@endofthelinefinally

Just stop and think about how women and girls are treated all over the world. In the bible belt in America, in Afghanistan, Iran, India, China, Poland, Russia, Saudi to name but a few and yes, here in the UK.

Consider FGM, selective abortion, infanticide, forced sterilisation, rape as a weapon of war, the recent shooting (in Afghanistan) of female professional women, no access to birth control, baby farms, legalised rape and domestic violence, revenge porn, pathetic sentences for murder, the rough sex defence, forced marriage. The list is endless.

Some men are respectful to a degree. That is the best that can be said. IMO.

100% this. ^ Excellent post!

LexMitior · 13/03/2021 11:21

It’s a generic point, however, it does suggest that before we do anything, even the smallest thing about the societal problem that exists then we must as women deal with this first. Why?

LolaSmiles · 13/03/2021 11:22

@LolaSmiles we need to bring up sons (and it is responsibility of dads too) to not act like that in the home. DS not yet old enough to leave home and live with anyone, but if he was treating his partner like a doormat/servant, I would be down on him like a ton of bricks
I totally agree.
DH grew up with a dad who did his fair share in the house and I'm convinced that played a huge role in DH's attitude.

Genuinely respectful men don't feel vilified by this movement because they know it's not about them. Most of them have also witnessed the treatment of women by their gender, and believe the outrage entirely justified. They are campaigning for women's safety alongside us
This.

Any man who tries to shut women down talking about male pattern violence or divert attention back to "what about the poor men, but men, but sometimes women are mean to men" is not as nice as they claim.

Carolina24 · 13/03/2021 11:22

Do women completely 100% respect men?

Consider the fact that men are overwhelmingly more likely than women to hold positions of power, wealth and influence in almost every sphere of society and ask yourself whether they’re really suffering from lack of respect to the same extent as women.

Chanjer · 13/03/2021 11:23

I think most men respect women enough not to rape and murder them

As far as actual genuine equality and respect goes though I couldn't say.

Coffeeandcocopops · 13/03/2021 11:23

My brother’s girls go to a girls private school. The class dads organised a weekend away. On the trip some of them went to a lap dancing club. My brother called them out on it and came home early. He couldn’t believe the double standards. These were professional dads. What went on the trip stayed on the trip. It’s never discussed. Men do not tell their female friends/wives/mums/ etc the full story if it slates their mates.

TheMoth · 13/03/2021 11:25

I think the trouble is, that if women disrespect men, it doesn't always have that much impact.

Look at the endless lists of what women put up with. There just aren't the same. Yes, there will be some women like this. But they tend to stand out more because most women aren't.

Women tend to complain about men and deride them to their friends because we're ultimately powerless. Again, how many men and boys are wary when out and about in case women shout at them/ stare at them/ appraise them/ touch them/ accidentally squeeze past them?

RandomLondoner · 13/03/2021 11:25

I haven't read the thread, so somone may have commented on this already...

You're rehashing stuff that's being discussed on thread after thread. Yes a few women do it at nightclubs while drunk, and it's equally wrong.

I don't think it is usually equally wrong. If a drunk women won't take no for an answer, I (as a man) know I can stop her if I really want to. (Obviously there may be cases where age, personality, whatever combine to make man afraid of a woman, but that must be relatively rare.)

I've had this once, with a woman in my in my home, if the sexes were reversed 99% here would classify the events as a serious sexual assault. As it happens, the only effect on me is the memory of a slightly embarrassing situation. I don't even think badly of her for it. She's a nice enough person, she was drunk, at the end of the day no harm was done.

babbaloushka · 13/03/2021 11:25

We also had an incident of rating at school, one of dd's friends was on the bottom 5 list as a "munter", but one of the boys had 'joked' about "fucking her with a paper bag over her head". Boy in question was an Oxford applicant, model student, what most people would consider a decent lad.

Twintub · 13/03/2021 11:28

Yup @babbaloushka I think a man who hasn’t heard similar among his friends and colleagues is probably as rare as a unicorn

TheJerkStore · 13/03/2021 11:29

Consider the fact that men are overwhelmingly more likely than women to hold positions of power, wealth and influence in almost every sphere of society and ask yourself whether they’re really suffering from lack of respect to the same extent as women.

Absolutely this.

LolaSmiles · 13/03/2021 11:29

Women tend to complain about men and deride them to their friends because we're ultimately powerless. Again, how many men and boys are wary when out and about in case women shout at them/ stare at them/ appraise them/ touch them/ accidentally squeeze past them?
This.
How many men plan their nights out because they have to factor in trying to avoid being sexually assaulted?
How many men find themselves sidelined at work when they announce they're going to be a dad?

It's worrying that across a number of threads today a substantial minority of posters don't seem to understand the difference between complaining about something someone (male or female) has done in your life and systemic issues that negatively affect women.

RootyT00t · 13/03/2021 11:29

@littlepattilou

And people can fuck off with the 'misandry' accusations. Are women not allowed to talk about how they - and other women - are/have been treated badly and disrespected by some men, without the shitty and predictable misandry bollocks?! Hmm

Sorry, but you're not going to shut us down. Women have been silenced, and kept down for too long now (and often by men.) You're deluded if you think that 'misandry' accusations are going to shut us down.

It's sickening that there are a few women on here who are accusing the women on here of man-hating PURELY because they are sharing their stories of problems with men, or making points, and offering their views and opinions.

That's if it IS women, and not men coming on here, who are pissed off, because the truth hurts!

@endofthelinefinally

Just stop and think about how women and girls are treated all over the world. In the bible belt in America, in Afghanistan, Iran, India, China, Poland, Russia, Saudi to name but a few and yes, here in the UK.

Consider FGM, selective abortion, infanticide, forced sterilisation, rape as a weapon of war, the recent shooting (in Afghanistan) of female professional women, no access to birth control, baby farms, legalised rape and domestic violence, revenge porn, pathetic sentences for murder, the rough sex defence, forced marriage. The list is endless.

Some men are respectful to a degree. That is the best that can be said. IMO.

100% this. ^ Excellent post!

I am a woman, and think misandry is very real and valid. Telling us to fuck off and you will not be silenced doesn't really help.
RootyT00t · 13/03/2021 11:30

@Twintub

Yup *@babbaloushka* I think a man who hasn’t heard similar among his friends and colleagues is probably as rare as a unicorn
I know women who treat males appallingly.

What is the point here?

Chanjer · 13/03/2021 11:32

Women need to call our other women, instead of insisting that all women are always right and that women never treat men badly and if they do it's OK.

I've been on the end of disrespectful approaches and touching from both sexes. When it was a woman I just told her to fuck off. When I was getting carried off to another room by someone much bigger than me it was a fair concern

GalesThisMorning · 13/03/2021 11:33

Extrem violence and aggression are primarily male traits. They just are. Men are the ones who harass and physically hurt or intimidate other people.

If you are lucky enough to be surrounded by wonderful men who love and respect you, as I am, it is normal to want to protect their image of 'nice'. Chances are most of the men each of us love and care about are nice.

It's difficult to square that with the reality that most of us have been harassed, intimidated, distracted and/or hurt and abused by men. Not the same man. Men.

Men have a problem. Its not misandry to say that

Twintub · 13/03/2021 11:33

The point being we are discussing a widespread issue that runs through every aspect of our daily lives from day to day , at work and at home.

Woman do so this and it should be called out and actually I think woman do call it out more.

It really is comparing apples and pears. Are you actually a man ?

I am coming from an all male household and I am definitely not a man hater.

TheJerkStore · 13/03/2021 11:34

I know women who treat males appallingly.

What is the point here?

There's a difference between individual experiences and the way women are treated as a group.

Yes there are women who treat men badly and may even hate men but that is not resulting in huge numbers of men being subject to sexual harassment, violence, rape and murder. It's not causing systemic, deep rooted inequalities across all aspects of their lives.

It's not relevant to this discussion.