Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Where would the money come from to give all NHS staff a 12.5% pay rise?

267 replies

katieloves · 05/03/2021 19:57

I cannot begin to think where cuts would be made to fund this when the economy already is in the state it’s in. How would you fund it?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
6
rwalker · 09/03/2021 05:27

@TitsOot4Xmas
THE INCREMENTS NO LONGER GIVE A PAYRISE EVERY YEAR. SOME ARE EVERY 2 YEARS AND OTHERS UP TO 5 YEARS BEFORE YOU SEE A PAYRISE.

We have an increment system at work and it depends on your yearly appraisal / changing targets it's the same in many bussiness . We have people never moved off there starting pay.

Sapho47 · 09/03/2021 05:56

@tiredteacher100

Maybe from rich people who avoid paying their tax?
Doesn't the top 10% pay over 50% of all incom tax?

Bottom 50% pays less than 10%

Sapho47 · 09/03/2021 05:58

"This chart from the Institute for Fiscal Studies shows that about 90% of income tax is paid by the 50% of taxpayers with the highest incomes, while more than a quarter is paid by the richest 1%."

Where would the money come from to give all NHS staff a 12.5% pay rise?
RandomLondoner · 09/03/2021 12:17

@RandomLondoner -companies are already generally taxed in the uk if they carry on substantial activities here. There’s a whole slew of tax law too to prevent profit shifting to lower tax jurisdictions and there has been for years. It’s easy to say “tax Amazon” because you have come to some sort of misconception that Amazon is not taxed for some strange reason, but of course it is.

First, I am on the opposite side of the argument than you think I am. I was writing because I too am irritated by the people who say "tax Amazon", as they seem clueless to me. (In my ideal tax system Corporations wouldn't be taxed at all, we'd only tax income when it lands in the hands of individuals. But that's a whole other thread.)

Second, I recognise the truth of what you say about how tax works, but your overall knowledge appears to be less than mine, because although what you said is true as far as it goes, you don't seem to be aware of the additional information I was providing. Profit-shifting is still happening despite all the counter-measures, and reform to international agreements on how companies are taxed is being progressed to address this at a fundamental level.

(The trigger for this reform was Europe threatening a transaction tax on the turnover of internet companies. This would have been a bad approach, but the threat of it appears to have been enough to bring other countries to table to discuss reforms that do make sense.)

I'm not sure about Amazon's history of tax avoidance, but I know that at one stage Apple accumulated vast amounts of cash in Caribbean tax havens. Think some of that may have now been repatriated to the USA under a deal with the US government. Not an issue I've followed closely.

My point to you is, you are wrong if you don't think there's a problem that needs solving. My point to everyone else is that solving it will make far less difference than they think.

RandomLondoner · 09/03/2021 12:19

I get my information from reading The Economist, so you might want to check the last couple of years issues in case I've remembered any facts wrongly.

anniegun · 09/03/2021 12:28

The government can print the money it needs (it has created a huge amount in the last year to cover covid costs including £37b for a failed test and trace scheme. However it wants to build a narrative that low paid workers should not be greedy so it can ensure the benefits of the recovery actually flow to the better off who vote conservative. Older house owners will benefit form pumping up house prices, shareholders benefit from the asset bubbles. It helps if they can also find something to blame for peoples living standards declining. That will be Covid/ EU / Immigrants etc

user1497207191 · 09/03/2021 12:39

@anniegun

The government can print the money it needs (it has created a huge amount in the last year to cover covid costs including £37b for a failed test and trace scheme. However it wants to build a narrative that low paid workers should not be greedy so it can ensure the benefits of the recovery actually flow to the better off who vote conservative. Older house owners will benefit form pumping up house prices, shareholders benefit from the asset bubbles. It helps if they can also find something to blame for peoples living standards declining. That will be Covid/ EU / Immigrants etc
Indeed it can "print" money, but actions have consequences. Printing money affects the country's credit rating, so we may find ourselves having to pay higher interest on our deficit or we may find it harder to borrow. It may affect foreign exchange rates making imports more expensive, so causing inflation, or alternative make our exports more expensive causing a drop in productivity/GDP and job losses etc. You have to look at the bigger picture and the knock on consequences. Printing more money doesn't make us richer, it actually reduces the value of our currency and that has consequences.
KevinBaconsMoustache · 09/03/2021 18:47

From the politicians above inflation pay rises.
Job done.

rwalker · 11/03/2021 06:20

@KevinBaconsMoustache
FROM THE POLITICIANS ABOVE INFLATION PAY RISES.
JOB DONE.

I agree it's an outrage about there pay rise but there are only 30,000 politicians and the NHS employs over 1.3 million staff it wouldn't even make a dint in it.

ivykaty44 · 11/03/2021 06:25

Same place as the money came for the track and trace

crazybunchofdolls · 11/03/2021 06:29

@MissyB1

The real question you should be asking is “can we afford to be insulting NHS staff? And can we afford to risk losing any more of them?” Because they are on their fucking knees and it’s not a great idea to slap them in the face right now.
👏
ivykaty44 · 11/03/2021 06:31

If you earn £30k a year you pay £2500 National insurance

If you earn £80k you pay £5000 National insurance

If you earn £120000 you pay £6200 National insurance

Id raise the amount of National insurance contributions to be proportional on what you earn to pay for the NHS staff pay rises

Penners99 · 11/03/2021 06:43

Overseas aid, UC uplift, Public funded IVF.

All ways to screw others.

rwalker · 11/03/2021 07:27

@IVYKATY44
SAME PLACE AS THE MONEY CAME FOR THE TRACK AND TRACE

We borrowed it with no idea of how WE are going to pay it back.

JustAnotherPoster00 · 11/03/2021 08:16

Doesn't the top 10% pay over 50% of all income tax?
Bottom 50% pays less than 10%

And what is the percentage of the wealth and capital held by those top 10%?

user1497207191 · 11/03/2021 13:34

@ivykaty44

If you earn £30k a year you pay £2500 National insurance

If you earn £80k you pay £5000 National insurance

If you earn £120000 you pay £6200 National insurance

Id raise the amount of National insurance contributions to be proportional on what you earn to pay for the NHS staff pay rises

You can't just pick one type of tax and ignore the others.

Income tax is 40% on earnings over £50k.

So whilst one "tax" has a lower rate, another "tax" doubled.

Over £50k your child benefits tapers away too.

Over £100k your personal allowance tapers away.

ivykaty44 · 11/03/2021 14:06

I picked national insurance as it was “originally” set up to cover healthcare

Proportionally though someone earning a £30k is paying just under half whilst earning 75% less

New posts on this thread. Refresh page