Friend has completely changed

[Annapops1]

Good evening all, spent a while deciding on whether or not to post this on here but after several sleepless nights I'd really appreciate some advice.

Been friends with 'sarah' for 30 years, very close almost like sisters. Godmother to each others children and always the first person to call in a crisis or with a funny story etc.

We've been chatting about faith / religion and had decided that once lockdown was over we would quite like to go to a modern church and see what it was all about. We checked it out on zoom and all looked great, rock band on stage and young speakers etc. I'm not particularly religious but after loosing my mum I'd like to think that she is still "with us" in some way.

Anyways...my friend called me to say that she'd got chatting to a school mum who goes to the said church and that they'd arranged a walk. All fine. Following the walk friend calls to tell me how amazing mum friend is and that she'd love me to meet her etc. Friend goes on another walk with mum friend, calls me later to say how this mum friend has told her about when she met God and how Harry Potter is evil and encourages children to practice witchcraft.

Fast forward and friend and mum friend have met several more times...each time I get a phone call tell me things along the lines of she has now given her body to Jesus, how she's prayed for me to be filled with God's blood, that she's taken phones off her children as they encourage unsavoury activities etc etc.

This week being half term we met up with our children for a 3 hour walk...I kid you not I got "God" the whole time. Now going back to above, I'm not the anti-christ as I was happy to explore the new church etc but this is on another level. We got to the the highest point and she raised her hands and shouted how she loves Jesus. I was then told that if I didn't accept Jesus into my heart then I'd loose my place in heaven. I tried to change the subject but to no avail.

I literally couldn't wait to get home. This was now 4 days ago and I just don't know what to think. I've not heard from her since and I feel like I've completely lost my friend. She's unrecognisable...the things she's was coming out with to me makes me think she's been practically brainwashed.

Please tell me if you think I am overreacting? If you got this far, well done

Way before COVID times I saw people get roped in to the evangelical church much like your friend has. If your in a certain place mentally, there's something about it that can be very seductive. Its very much a lifestyle brand, like an MLM. People are encouraged to portray a positive lifestyle as a way to appeal and help with evangelism. Then running parallel with the great life you can have, is all the scary stuff about hell and the relief and gratitude you feel to now be "in the know" and saved.

In my experience theres a honeymoon period and it then most people realise its not for them and either leave or become a lot less nutty about it.

My friend's family all belong to a modern church within the Evangelical faith. His family have similar views and if with them for more than an hour God will inevitably be mentioned because to them he is in everything they do and think and feel. It really upset me to learn that they all believe I will not go to heaven (should it exist) because I have not joined the church and sought forgiveness and that God doesn't care how I behave or how much I try to be a kind caring person etc, it will all come down to whether I believe. It is a modern church to the extent that they meet in community venues not a church building and have their own strand and texts within the Evangelical faith.

When I lived in NZ I was shocked at the number of churches there were of this style, heavily borrowing from the American churches (tithing, church both days of the weekend, bible study and prayer meetings during the week etc.) I got introduced to it through DHs childhood best friend, who had found Jesus on the beach in his late teens when he was having some personal issues. DH is happily atheist so managed to stay friends (helped he lives in a different continent) but when we moved there his friend would try to corner me at parties, bbqs etc. And try to get me along to his church and also berate me for living in sin with then my boyfriend (I’m catholic and to be fair my parish priest didn’t bat an eyelid at us living together when we were sorting the wedding). But it was constant and the attention from his church friends was flattering when I had just arrived in a new place and only knew my boyfriend (now DH). I can see how you could be sucked it. I was nice but evasive and put my DH on high alert so if we saw me getting cornered he would rescue me.

Anyway, he was intense and via (limited contact with him) i noticed that it is a real lifestyle for some people. I agree with the poster who said religious fervour was/is more common at times of crisis. He has mellowed out over the years but I have had to distanced myself as he is increasingly right wing and thought Trump was marvellous and I can’t be doing with that shit.

I think all you can do Op is be there for your friend. I would call her OH and just check in, as I think any big change of personality is a red flag and you are just caring for her. I don’t think this is disrespectful, I think it is being there for her.

I colleague of mine invited me to her church .
On arriving at the church the ‘pastor’ of the church approached me and told me God had told him that I was to remove my makeup and my gold jewellery. I excused myself and immediately left the church.
Now, I am not against people finding God or attending church. I have a deep faith myself. I just find it scary when people attend some of these churches and have a complete personality change in such a short space of time.
The truth is that many of these large charismatic churches are big businesses yet claim to be charities. They are making some pastors very rich.
They attract all kinds of people; the wealthiest, poorest, the most educated , the uneducated. However, all of these individuals will have one thing in common, they are looking for something to fill a void in their lives . This makes them more susceptible to being indoctrinated.
Op’s friend , despite her seemingly great life, was searching for something.

I had a friend who went through a similar experience and I’ve got to admit it was quite alarming. It turned out to be a catalyst for her marriage breakup so I’m glad I didn’t approach her husband to discuss my concerns.
I don’t have any objections to anyone ‘finding’ god or discovering and becoming enthusiastic about any religious or spiritual beliefs, but her almost feverish obsession was disturbing and totally out of character.
I listened to what she said and made remarks like ‘wow, this seems like you’ve come across something that feels right for you just now’ and other unchallenging comments, all of which reinforced that it was right for her and was ‘for now’ and ‘definitely not for me right now’. Her husband and Mother were vigorously challenging her, her church friend was vigorously encouraging her, so I felt she didn’t need any input from me. However, when she tried to get me to join her I kept saying ‘thanks, but I don’t feel ready’ or ‘it’s not right for me just now’. I wouldn’t be drawn into deep conversations but didn’t want to judge her either.
Eventually she did calm down after the initial excitement and almost obsessive focus diminished and managed to continue her discovery and interest without it being all consuming and without feeling it necessary to discuss with everyone close to her.
As her very close friend, OP, I think you could be the one person who doesn’t encourage or dissuade or dismiss but who let’s her be and is there when things calm down, which they will do eventually. That’s what she needs from you, regardless of the eventual outcome.

I know of two people who suddenly found god and it changed them and consumed their lives. One friend left her really good well paid job that was on her career path and took a voluntary/unpaid job with the church. She spent all her time going to church related groups/social activities. She was later diagnosed with bi polar and when she was ‘better’ could see herself how ill she had been. The other friend left his wife because she was his second wife and wanted the marriage annulled because he hadn’t kept his vows to his first wife so had betrayed god. He was also all consumed and tried to get all his friends to find god et. He was eventually diagnosed with schizophrenia.

The other friend left his wife because she was his second wife and wanted the marriage annulled because he hadn’t kept his vows to his first wife so had betrayed god.

^ oh yes. I forgot about this. So my friend's family also believe that in heaven you will be with your first wife or husband because that is the promise you made to God.

@MsMarch - thank you! I assume the poster has never heard of Judaism, perhaps they have never heard of the Christian missionary work in developing countries stamping out local culture and religion, unfortunately it’s a line trotted out by the Christian Right a lot. Any criticism of Christianity = persecution.

It has been interesting to read the perspective of some of the Christians on this thread who talk about the OP’s friend just being excited to share her new found religion. This is beyond excitement, shouting from the top of a hill you love Jesus? Radical Christianity exists and this is how it manifests.

@Flittingaboutagain - oh yes, I am a constant reminder to my step mother than even though she is my Dad’s first wife, he had a life before her. She treats me accordingly. Stately Home anyone?

@Flittingaboutagain

The other friend left his wife because she was his second wife and wanted the marriage annulled because he hadn’t kept his vows to his first wife so had betrayed god.

^ oh yes. I forgot about this. So my friend's family also believe that in heaven you will be with your first wife or husband because that is the promise you made to God.

I'm thinking of finding God (again) and telling this to my in-laws. And a few other long separated couples I know.

I thought the vow was til death do us part, no one said I was keeping DH in the afterlife. I might not have got married so long if I'd realised it was eternal rather than just lifelong!

@Porridgeoat

This is a typical evangelical conversion experience. There’s a lot more to come sadly. Lots of judgment of non believers, indoctrination and wacky practices. Usually the individual is vulnerable for some reason and they are looking for some deeper meaning or strength so advance with a quiet predisposition for radicalisation.

This. Your friend is being recruited by this other woman.

Wow so many replies. Thank you all. I'm at work just now but have read through briefly. My main concern is the drastic change in my friend. I love her dearly and would never stand in her way of any life decisions. However...as I've said...the sudden change of behaviour since meeting this mum and the crazy sounding views that she is coming over with worries me!

I will take a step back but will keep a level of chatty text contact and hopefully pick up the pieces once she comes through this.

I have lost a friend to cult-like religion and it was a confusing and painful experience.

I watched his life gradually spiral out of control while he thought he was dedicated to this greater good. I think you can tell a lot by how far involved she is mentally by how she's reacting to any attempt at a constructive debate over religion. My friend started off by wanting to share his enthusiasm for this newly found thing but gradually started shutting down every time you'd question any of the practices.

• I colleague of mine invited me to her church . On arriving at the church the ‘pastor’ of the church approached me and told me God had told him that I was to remove my makeup and my gold jewellery. I excused myself and immediately left the church.*

I went to my friend's baptism but was feeling a bit unwell. I was told period pains were Jesus trying to get into me and the pain was because I was fighting him. I gave the pastor my patented Look, made my excuses and left.

Have you spoken to her husband? He must be feeling the same way too, unless he too has been recruited by this cult.

@MsMarch

Someone on this thread said that christians are the most persecuted? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Don't laugh, after all Christians have been a minority religion in the West and targeted by witch burnings, crusades, and the Holocaust... wait.....

You shouldn´t. Ask Christians in Irak and other middle East countries, also what happened to Christians in Turkey over the 20th century, as in Greeks and Armenians, from healthy well established to practically wiped out. Ask Christians in Egypt (copts). Ask those bombed in their churches in Indonesia way. There are more Christians than the West you know.

Oops the above was directed @MsMarch.

Its "just" evangelical Christianity.
I was brought up in a church with a very similar ethos. My mum is still a member but it was too much for me. I'm still a semi practising Christian but all the dramatic soundbites are extremely off putting tbh. Id rather quietly practise my faith on my own terms, it used to competitive worship. I agree unless you've been brought up in a religious household it does sound like a mental health issue.

"I believe that everyone has their own right to have their own faith without shoving it on others and also to have an understanding and respect for how others choose to live their lives."

That doesn't fit in with religion. Some that preach it hold back and put a different twist on it to be socially acceptable and get bums on pews, but that's not the reality of any traditional religion.

I also do not think this is mental illness. Religious delusions usually centre around grandiosity or paranoia. This sounds like your friend has found God in an all or nothing manner. May be temporary, may not be. I think you shd support her in whatever way you can that doesn't impact your belief system.

We are living in very strange times & sadly this affects people's mental health & makes them vulnerable in ways we generally just aren't used to.

I can relate to your post a lot & have considered posting something similar myself, though in my case it's a friendship group that have turned to strange ideas over Covid & an unbelievable smugness that those of us not buying into their cult like view & follow the science, are junk food swilling morons. One who I've always seen as a quieter one, now fancies themselves as some sort of guru & it's gobsmacking 😟

It's a fear response to the pandemic, there's lots of psychology written about it relating to previous pandemics, so it's not new. I can't offer advice though, as tackling it head on as I tried will just have you ostracised. Knowing the cause helps though

@SVRT19674 - doesn’t mean they are the most persecuted and certainly Christians are not persecuted in the UK. Some Christians just don’t like when their religion is criticised. Given the large say Christianity still has in the UK through the House of Lords, schools etc, Christianity is open to criticism like any public body.

Such an interesting thread.

I posted upthread about two of my friends experiences with finding god and both then being diagnosed with mental health illnesses.

This thread is really educational and enlightening. I’ve often wondered how people get ‘sucked in’ by certain religious groups and cults and why some people do and not others.

I'd wager that she's been on the wacky baccy tbh😂