We did not end freedom of movement. The only people we ended fom for is ourselves and our children.

[Kendodd]

I don't know why we would celebrate this.
The children of our EU friends living here still have their fom, when they leave school they'll be free to live and work in any one of 31 countries (I'm pleased for them) our children won't be. I've heard 'EU passport holder' is starting to appear on CVs now as it makes people a more attractive employee in certain sectors.

Oh and I grew up in one of the most deprived areas in the country on state benefits attending a failing school. I made use of fom in my youth and it gave me opportunities young people in my situation won't have anymore. It's not just for rich people.

@turquoisewaters

And before anyone starts, I quote from the Guardian article:

The requirements for doctors from elsewhere in the world are tougher

You were dismissing the guardian as nonsense and refusing to accept it as a source earlier in the thread though @turquoisewaters so by your own rules your post should be disregarded.

@turquoisewaters
I can’t answer your statement without knowing:
The basis for UK medical law when we were part of the EU

Process for agreement to automatic recognition of medical qualification within the EU
The role of the GMC during this period and whether NHS Trusts checked their employees' qualifications suitably (in your surgeon comment)

Question for leavers: are you unconcerned about the impacts of sovereignty in the other direction?

Eg: the membership of the European Environment Agency obliged the UK to
work towards a certain level of air pollution. The UK has always been allowed to improve on that level, but NOW it has the sovereignty to do whatever it likes.

A nine year old in London died of air pollution.

Or to adopt the dramatic flair so beloved by the brexit press, "do leavers want dirty brexit air to kill our children?"

Love people on this thread saying everyone should be allowed to vote regardless of intelligence while simultaneously saying that British people living abroad shouldn’t be allowed to vote. Cognitive dissonance much?

I have never ever heard anyone say they voted leave because they didn't want any more Muslims to come here. Seriously, who are these people you know who are saying this? I am thinking about my friends and the ones who voted leave and none of them have ever said anything like that. And yet the remainders know loads of people who come out with this rubbish.

@turquoisewaters

Which developed country is 'swimming in sewage' in 2021?

The UK is swimming in sewage - still.

Raw sewage dumped on UK coast nearly 3,000 times in 12 months, report says

news.sky.com/story/raw-sewage-dumped-on-uk-coast-nearly-3-000-times-in-12-months-report-says-12125620

A significant proportion of cases where the ECJ took action against the UK was over breaches of the urban waste water treatment directive.

www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/news/latest/new-analysis-shows-uk-rarely-taken-european-court

Bloody ECJ, wanting Brits to have clean water.

London died of air pollution

So the air became so polluted in just two months that it killed someone?

You were dismissing the guardian as nonsense and refusing to accept it as a source earlier in the thread

I chose it on purpose as most posters on this thread seem to use it as their only source of information, so they would be familiar with it

The sad pollution death happened in 2013 while we were in the EU

www.nbcnews.com/science/science-news/air-pollution-listed-cause-9-year-olds-death-uk-rcna202

@turquoisewaters
UK shellfish producers are unable to sell their wares to the EU now that the UK is a "3rd Country"
because most of the waters are too polluted.

The Brexit vote was in 2016
why did they not take back control
by investing in cleaning tanks
or getting the UK to clean up the inshore waters ?

Now that the UK is free of the EU, is Johnson's government bringing in stricter sewage controls RIGHT AWAY to clean up the UKs beaches?

thought not

@Kendodd

I don't know much about how Russia treats refugees but completely agree about China. Appalling.

From the link given I don’t think Russia makes it at all easy for refugees. But as turquoisewaters pointed out, neither China nor Russia get any stick.

@turquoisewaters

London died of air pollution

So the air became so polluted in just two months that it killed someone?

You're missing my point. Ella died due to air pollution which the us was obliged to work towards a certain standard of. That obligation is removed. The uk was always allowed to be better, but it wasn't allowed to be worse. Now it is allowed to be worse.

Do you not worry that the uk will use its sovereignty to make things worse (albeit more profitable?) working rights, air standards, the cleanliness of beaches, food standards is a huge one. Because sovereignty cuts both ways.

@turquoisewaters I think you’re missing the point a bit.

All that “sovereignty” has achieved wrt air pollution, is the ability to ignore targets, do what “we” want, and effectively go backwards. We could always improve on these if our governments decided to.

See also:
Environmental care
Employment rights
Food standards

Because they’re the next in line

Cross post oops

@justab0utsurviving

I have never ever heard anyone say they voted leave because they didn't want any more Muslims to come here. Seriously, who are these people you know who are saying this?

Go and have a look at Vote Leave in FB. Loads of this sort of stuff.

But there was a competitive disadvantage to improving some of these things if other EU members did not.
Now we have the freedom to make changes and adjustments across many interrelated sectors.

The sad pollution death happened in 2013 while we were in the EU

The EU were taking us to court to try to force us to clean up our air. I think it's about 30,000 people a year our air kills.

We're out now, so they can fuck off with their clean air.

@MiddlesexGirl Which is why there was an advantage to improve the situation to a baseline level at least, while in the EU, as we would do it together. Now out of the EU, what’s to stop us undercutting those base levels? What motivation would there be to do it alone now, if it would put us at a disadvantage, as you say.

But there was a competitive disadvantage to improving some of these things if other EU members did not.
Now we have the freedom to make changes and adjustments across many interrelated sectors.

Otherwise know as a race to the bottom.

Ah yes, post Brexit air quality as per Jacob Rees Mogg
www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-safety-standards-workers-rights-jacob-rees-mogg-a7459336.html

@nellyii

In my local area I don't think anyone utiliised the FOM apart from short holidays. Most people who backpacked , went to South East Asia and the people who emigrated, went to Australia, NZ, Canada and USA.

This. And I know more people who emigrated permanently to EU countries before FOM was introduced than after.

We can increase our commitment in certain areas (and already are doing in the intersection between agriculture and the environment for example) if we can offset the costs in other ways ... to match what our priorities are as opposed to EU priorities.

And I know more people who emigrated permanently to EU countries before FOM was introduced than after.

Really?

You know people that moved to EU countries before 1968?

@MiddlesexGirl I don't understand. Why couldn't we do that before?
And I don't see how we aren't still at a competitive disadvantage now, if anything were even more in competition with our EU neighbours now? (Economics is not my strong point though so happy to learn.)

if we can offset the costs in other ways

That’s the tricky bit though. I don’t think things are looking good for our farmers and fishermen as the amount of red tape is killing their income.