To think that the sex of cats is not on a spectrum?

[FindTheTruth]

Just saw this comment in the comments section of Times Article today talking about Play for Women taking taking the ONS to court for redefining sex in the census

Comment:
I thought that it was an exaggeration that there were extremists who denied sex. Then I went to a local meeting about the toilets in our town. Person after person stood up to say that segregating them by sex was wrong because “sex is reductive and must be replaced by gender identity”. My father - a retired vet - got chatting to one of them afterwards and asked if he knew humans are mammals.
“Ye-es,” he said.
“And if you were to get into breeding other mammals as pets - you would know which cat was of the sex class that could get pregnant by observing their sex organs. So you see, sex is not reductive but instead an absolute basic fundamental in the classification of mammalian life.”
His stupefying reply: “sex is a spectrum, so there would be no guarantees. In that scenario I’d buy a group of cats, leave them alone and they’d figure it out. By the way, you sound like a transphobe.”

AIBU To think that the sex of cats is not on a spectrum?

@AlfonsoTheTerrible

My male cat identifies as an attack helicopter.

My neighbour's tom identifies as a sewage farm.

peak2021

I find people all too reluctant to extend empathy to other women when ‘be kind’ is the key to their arguments.

Sex is in no way a spectrum. Perpetuating this theory shows just how willing people are to utilize people’s medical conditions to destabilize society by destabilizing proven biology. And it has been proven for millennia.

What IS on a spectrum is the range of bodies that are in each sex class! And this has not been in dispute.

If you push the concept that sex is on a spectrum, would you mind sharing who gets to arbitrate which people are more female than others? And what axis is used to judge that?

Or is it that sex is binary where bodies are either arranged with the potential to produce one type of gamete or the other regardless of whether the gametes are produced or not?

I’m finding people’s view on my comments really interesting here, I don’t feel like I’m on a ‘side’ of history I see it from both sides. I totally think that women should be protected from sexual predators, but that’s what they are sexual predators, equality the trans community should be able to live their lives free from prejudice. I don’t think there should be gender stereotypes but there are and they impact on our lives, however people will probably pick holes in something I’ve said there that can be interpreted slightly differently or I will be told ‘this is what you meant’.

@Originalusername2021

I’m finding people’s view on my comments really interesting here, I don’t feel like I’m on a ‘side’ of history I see it from both sides. I totally think that women should be protected from sexual predators, but that’s what they are sexual predators, equality the trans community should be able to live their lives free from prejudice. I don’t think there should be gender stereotypes but there are and they impact on our lives, however people will probably pick holes in something I’ve said there that can be interpreted slightly differently or I will be told ‘this is what you meant’.

That's all pretty reasonable. The problem with sexual predators is they don't come with a label on their forehead. All we do know is that the overwhelming majority of sexual predation is done by males.

@Originalusername2021 but do you believe that the trans community should be able to live as they want at the expense of women being able to live as they want and at the expense of women’s opportunities? As that is what is happening here.

So trans women wining women’s scholarships, places on equality boards, seats at tables that could be filled with women’s voices - those who have lived as women from birth not those who decided half way through to be a woman.

And men entering and winning women’s races just because they can as happened at my uni - at the expense of a woman who trained hard and should have won. Women’s voices being removed from public forums. Women’s health being affected as we can’t get the correct information?

My 11 yrs old DD believes you can choose to be a boy or a girl. She is taught this in school.

I totally think that women should be protected from sexual predators, but that’s what they are sexual predators, equality the trans community should be able to live their lives free from prejudice. I don’t think there should be gender stereotypes but there are and they impact on our lives

No one would deny anyone, including trans people shouldn't face prejudice. Just like those with religious beliefs shouldn't face prejudice for living their life based on personal beliefs. Beliefs have no right to impose on society when it undermines fairness and reality.

As a side question, @Originalusername2021 can you describe what gender is, without resorting to stereotypes?

@Originalusername2021

I’m finding people’s view on my comments really interesting here, I don’t feel like I’m on a ‘side’ of history I see it from both sides. I totally think that women should be protected from sexual predators, but that’s what they are sexual predators, equality the trans community should be able to live their lives free from prejudice. I don’t think there should be gender stereotypes but there are and they impact on our lives, however people will probably pick holes in something I’ve said there that can be interpreted slightly differently or I will be told ‘this is what you meant’.

It's not prejudice to say that males cannot become pregnant. It is a scientific fact.

As we know a very very high proportion in prison for sex offences are males. How do we spot the non offending males? Check out the proportion of transwomen in prisons for sex offences? There are sites aggregating these by hand to sort through the mess of ‘gender’ reporting.

Why should current provisions for safeguarding women and children be removed to allow access to women’s single sex spaces for that particular group based on those statistics?

And then why should women who are being abused for stating this should be happening be the ones that need to help find a different solution?

98% of sexual crimes are committed by men no matter how they identify. This is why women need female only spaces.

[quote Anyoneelsewilldo]**@Originalusername2021* but do you believe that the trans community should be able to live as they want at the expense* of women being able to live as they want and at the expense of women’s opportunities? As that is what is happening here.

So trans women wining women’s scholarships, places on equality boards, seats at tables that could be filled with women’s voices - those who have lived as women from birth not those who decided half way through to be a woman.

And men entering and winning women’s races just because they can as happened at my uni - at the expense of a woman who trained hard and should have won. Women’s voices being removed from public forums. Women’s health being affected as we can’t get the correct information?[/quote]
It’s so multifaceted isn’t it, but I’m confident that intellectual debate and fairness will win overall and it will not happen in social media forums where people are just trying to trip people up for expressing how they feel.

My 11 yrs old DD believes you can choose to be a boy or a girl. She is taught this in school

fuck me

see, this utter, utter nonsense involves lying to children. How does anyone still think it's just a matter of respect?

It’s so multifaceted isn’t it...

Not really. It is binary. You either believe in Gender or you don't.

@ludothedog

My 11 yrs old DD believes you can choose to be a boy or a girl. She is taught this in school.

That's really worrying Ludo it must be so confusing for them especially when puberty hits.

I feel angry that they've been sold this lie. They are their sex, how they wish to express that is up to them and they shouldn't be discriminated against because of that but humans cannot change sex.

[quote Anyoneelsewilldo]**@Originalusername2021* but do you believe that the trans community should be able to live as they want at the expense* of women being able to live as they want and at the expense of women’s opportunities? As that is what is happening here.

So trans women wining women’s scholarships, places on equality boards, seats at tables that could be filled with women’s voices - those who have lived as women from birth not those who decided half way through to be a woman.

And men entering and winning women’s races just because they can as happened at my uni - at the expense of a woman who trained hard and should have won. Women’s voices being removed from public forums. Women’s health being affected as we can’t get the correct information?[/quote]
I do think originalusername2021 has explained themselves here, bit of a jump to imply they support trans people at the expense of women but ok. Pretty normal behaviour for Mumsnet

That story about uni didn’t happen though, did it. A bit like the original post, it’s a nice bit of fiction to get trans debate juices flowing

@Originalusername2021 It’s so multifaceted isn’t it, but I’m confident that intellectual debate and fairness will win overall and it will not happen in social media forums where people are just trying to trip people up for expressing how they feel

What does that even mean? Do you agree women’s rights should be superseded for trans rights or not? It’s quite simple. Are women entitled to single sex safe spaces or not?

Yes or no?

people are just trying to trip people up for expressing how they feel

people aren't trying to trip you up

they are trying to explain to you what happens when we pretend that sex isn't real

• men destroying fairness in women's sport
• women prisoners locked up with men
• women psychiatric patients locked up with men
• men taking women's places in schemes designed to offset the disadvantages women face by virtue of being female
• men using resources like toilets and changing rooms set aside women, thereby preventing women from using them

all these things are happening now. It is disingenuous to say 'debate and fairness will win overall' and not engage with the facts.

@Shannon9873 the uni story didn’t happen - really?

gript.ie/male-trinity-student-comes-2nd-in-womens-race/

It’s so multifaceted isn’t it, but I’m confident that intellectual debate and fairness will win overall and it will not happen in social media forums where people are just trying to trip people up for expressing how they feel.

And where do you think people are going to hold these 'intellectual debates', @Originalusername2021 when people like yourself won't even reply to the simplest questions or acknowledge the real situations facing women regarding safe spaces, sports, education opportunities etc.

I was instantly permabanned the other day on a FB group for replying to one of their 'poor trans people' news articles talking about how transwomen are being banned from female sports in Missisippi, and how this will just 'incite more violence against trans people'. I used no 'prejudice' against trans people - to paraphrase my exact words 'living by gender shouldn't cause any disrespect, but sports needs to be segregated based on sex for the fairness of girls and women'. Banned within 7 minutes. The world isn't open to debate about gender.

[quote Anyoneelsewilldo]**@Originalusername2021* It’s so multifaceted isn’t it, but I’m confident that intellectual debate and fairness will win overall and it will not happen in social media forums where people are just trying to trip people up for expressing how they feel*

What does that even mean? Do you agree women’s rights should be superseded for trans rights or not? It’s quite simple. Are women entitled to single sex safe spaces or not?

Yes or no?[/quote]
You do know that a person doesn’t have to explain themselves to you, right? They don’t owe you anything and they can hold different opinions.

Nothing gets people as rabid on MN as a trans debate, does it. Anyoneswilldo wouldn’t dare speak to people like this in the real world but Mumsnet does get a little bit hunger games, especially with this topic.

Calm down, love

The world isn't open to debate about gender

god isn't it scary? gender is a tool to oppress women, and you get silenced for pointing it out

and there are women on here lapping up this nonsense

That story about uni didn’t happen though, did it. A bit like the original post, it’s a nice bit of fiction to get trans debate juices flowing

The denial is amazing here! People like @Shannon9873 just refusing to believe reality right in front of them.

gript.ie/male-trinity-student-comes-2nd-in-womens-race/

• You do know that a person doesn’t have to explain themselves to you, right? They don’t owe you anything and they can hold different opinions.

Everyone can hold their own opinions. Some turn out to be based on evidence, some don't. Males winning women's sports prizes is happening, for instance, and not just the odd bloke doing it to expose the problem.

@BrumBoo

It’s so multifaceted isn’t it, but I’m confident that intellectual debate and fairness will win overall and it will not happen in social media forums where people are just trying to trip people up for expressing how they feel.

And where do you think people are going to hold these 'intellectual debates', @Originalusername2021 when people like yourself won't even reply to the simplest questions or acknowledge the real situations facing women regarding safe spaces, sports, education opportunities etc.

I was instantly permabanned the other day on a FB group for replying to one of their 'poor trans people' news articles talking about how transwomen are being banned from female sports in Missisippi, and how this will just 'incite more violence against trans people'. I used no 'prejudice' against trans people - to paraphrase my exact words 'living by gender shouldn't cause any disrespect, but sports needs to be segregated based on sex for the fairness of girls and women'. Banned within 7 minutes. The world isn't open to debate about gender.

Please see my previous post to anyoneelsewilldo

Why on earth does originalusername2021 have to explain themselves to you????

There can be no debate because people
Like you DEMAND agreement or it starts to get nasty.

You get a ‘calm down, love’ too

@Shannon9873 I have just spoken the truth on this thread Shannon. I’ve provided you with actual photos to back up what I am saying and now that you can’t wave that away as being untrue you attack my character.

Interesting! Women attacking other women for telling the truth.

Nothing gets people as rabid on MN as a trans debate, does it. Anyoneswilldo wouldn’t dare speak to people like this in the real world but Mumsnet does get a little bit hunger games, especially with this topic.