friend got job she knew I wanted

[fcekinghell]

It may be my own stupid fault, lesson learned but anyway.

I have an industry mentor. Mentors were being offered to people in my field about 2 years ago and I put myself forward as a means to widen my network, find out about new opportunities etc, especially as I wasn't happy where I was at the time.

I got assigned to a woman I will call Debbie. We had a few Zoom calls, emails etc where she gave me some tips and advice on how to move into employers like her own.

For the record, I am more qualified and experienced than Debbie but wanted a mentor to help me into that kind of employer. Debbie told me to keep her posted on my job hunting. Offered to help with my CV and interview skills if I needed it.

Well I got made redundant in Covid. Debbie still working where she is. Then my dream job came up. I excitedly told Debbie, telling her its my dream job. I did the application and asked Debbie what she thought, was there anything missing. She told me it was 'perfect' and 'good luck'.

Well, I didn't get the job. They said they might recruit later in the year and they'll let me know. I've now heard that Debbie got the job.

It feels like a real kick in the stomach. She was my mentor. She knew this was my dream job and jobs like this don't come up often. In fact, really rarely. She knew I was unemployed whilst she was still working. Plus this job is asking for a particular skill which I do not believe she has.

DH and my DM are telling me I am a fucking idiot for speaking to her. I am aren't I? I probably gave her all the answers too!

I'm so upset

And Debbie wasn’t your mentor.the relationship you describe is not that

I agree by the time of the interview it's down to how you present yourself, your answers/questions and how they see you fitting in to a team overall.

Maybe she comes across exceptionally well at interview.

I get that you are upset and need a good vent - but I wouldn't take it further than here, things can get twisted easily and might turn against you.

She should have said there was a conflict of interest

What was the COI?

OP it sucks and it's understandable you are annoyed, but she likely would have seen the job anyway if it is such a good opportunity. Was it more closely aligned to her field (the reason you sought her as a mentor)? The only way I would see it as unfair is if she purposefully encouraged you to make your application worse, but you'd surely notice if that had happened.

She probably feels awkward about it, but honestly sometimes you do have to think of yourself, and if she really wanted it too, I don't think it's unreasonable that she applied. It doesn't sound like you are best mates or anything, she doesn't owe you anything.

There was no COI. None .Nadda. Only misplaced entitlement

YABU. It's disappointing, but you aren't owed a job just because you want it. It makes no difference that you're unemployed and she isn't. Anyone can apply for any job they wish. It may be her dream job too, you don't have a monopoly on wanting a good job!

You are acting like she has taken something from you. You are blaming her for you not getting it. If she hadn't got the job, that doesn't necessarily mean that you would have. You may have been 3rd, 4th or 5th choice and there may have been another candidate(s) standing between you and your dream job.

Sorry to sound harsh, but ultimately, you may not have interviewed well on the day and she had no control over that, only you did.

She wished you luck in your job hunt. I don't think that makes her a bitch. Unless she gave you poor advice on your application or told you the wrong answers to interview questions, I don't think she has behaved anything other than professionally.

it was an actual friend not a mentor.

Merry if a friend went for the same job, knowingly, I'd absolutely understand anyone being upset.

It's fine to go for a job - myself & a good friend were in that situation last year; we both charred about it & were clear we were applying. We both wished each other well. I provided her with information on an aspect of the job she'd be less familiar with. She got it, deservedly & I am happy for her. Funnily enough, my feedback showed I didn't do that well on the area I'd helped my friend with.

But if a friend didn't tell me, I'd be upset - from a friendship point of view.

That's not what happened here tho.

I went for a job,competed against a friend, I told her I was going for job
I got it, it didn’t cause any ill feelings

I think you’ve had a really hard time on here OP. Debbie was way out of line to review your application without saying she was interested in the job. Massively sucks. I don’t know what field you’re in but is developing a fast moving robot cat that you can send out to pee on things a possibility? She does deserve it.

Employers are much worse than they think they are at picking the best person for the job (e.g. look up what happened when blind auditions were introduced for orchestras). So the sneaky Debbie might well not be the best person for the job, it’s hard for them to know. A lot of it is luck/whim.
You really do never know if something is for the best until it’s long over though. Hopefully it will be even if it doesn’t look like it now.

Utter rot

YABU about Debbie getting the job.

But I don't know how anyone can think Debbie behaved ethically in continuing to mentor the OP around a situation in which she had a personal conflict of interest.

Astonishing that so many people think this is acceptable, it really isn't.

I was always under the impression that employers prefer giving the post to employed applicants .

That does sound gutting, OP. There's been a couple of times I've been wary of a similar situation panning out that way for me, at which point I made the decision never to discuss opportunities with anyone. Ever. Apart from dh, who takes the same approach in his career. However, I think your mentor did a shitty thing morally, by looking over your application. She could have said she was too busy even, if she didn't want to say she had gone for it. Have you heard from them since?

Also, just to say, I am a mentor for someone who almost has the same level of qualification but who has about 15 years + more experience than me. Luckily our paths are sufficiently divergent so we won't ever go for the same role, although we are broadly in a similar sector. So it is possible to have a mentor who is not necessarily more senior, for the pps who have assumed so.

The discussions they had about this job would have helped Debbie

@SixesAndEights ot necessarily. If she 'is' OP's mentor she presumably knows a bit about relevant stuff (although of course OP is far superior.)

It's entirely possible this role was advertised other places OP doesn't know about. Its possible Debbie was approached by an agency on the company's behalf because they found her cv online/linkedin/she is known in the industry/ word of mouth

Good points.

@fcekinghell You could ask her, but I wouldn't trust her again. As you excel above her in every way, you don't need her as a mentor anymore.

I tried to be professional in my reply but I think she's being even more of a bitch. AIBU?

YABU. I think she was just being polite. But I wouldn't bother with her anymore. You thought she was a friend (so you said at first) but she isn't particularly. She anwered you very formally.

But I don't know how anyone can think Debbie behaved ethically in continuing to mentor the OP around a situation in which she had a personal conflict of interest.

She didn't mentor OP. OP is using that term v v loosely, and it doesn't fit any recognised definition of mentoring.

She looked at her CV and wished her well. There was no continuation - she wasn't mentoring her at all to start with.

@Wearywithteens

On a positive note - Debbie’s old job will be up for grabs?

Could this maybe an opportunity op?

This situation must feel awful.

Good luck

@Mrsmadevans

I was always under the impression that employers prefer giving the post to employed applicants .

That's daft.

OP had been employed till recently. Any decent employer will give the job to the candidate that performs best on the day.

@WineIsMyMainVice

OP has said that Debbie's job is filled but in any case, is nowhere near where OP lives.

@blitzen

That does sound gutting, OP. There's been a couple of times I've been wary of a similar situation panning out that way for me, at which point I made the decision never to discuss opportunities with anyone. Ever. Apart from dh, who takes the same approach in his career. However, I think your mentor did a shitty thing morally, by looking over your application. She could have said she was too busy even, if she didn't want to say she had gone for it. Have you heard from them since?

Also, just to say, I am a mentor for someone who almost has the same level of qualification but who has about 15 years + more experience than me. Luckily our paths are sufficiently divergent so we won't ever go for the same role, although we are broadly in a similar sector. So it is possible to have a mentor who is not necessarily more senior, for the pps who have assumed so.

yes this is kind of what our mentoring relationship is like.

we work in the same industry with similar qualifications but with different customers.

I have 20 years experience with this customer group. She has none. She was advising me on her customer group really as it was one of the options for future career paths for me.

The job we both went for was asking for qualifications, industry body membership and experience with this client group. I have all of this, she does not. She has the minimum qualification,I have the highest.

The job was home based. She does not have any children or health conditions. I have both children and health conditions.

So there are lots of reasons why I am so pissed off really.

Yet she still got the job

Maybe they just liked her more OP. Can’t be helped unfortunately and you sound bitter. I say everything happens for a reason and so just wasn’t meant to be.

OP my sympathy is really waning now.

I simply do not believe she was hired with none of the relevant qualifications or experience. It's not plausible.

And now talking about how you've a greater entitlement due to your health conditions & having children. C'mon! That's not relevant at all.

For sure, you might have liked the job, it would have been helpful.

But you are sounding like a nightmare employee. I've come across applicants & employees like this, unbelievably entitled, with no idea of how they come across.

When recruiting for a small team I have, and have known others to, choose to give the job to an applicant who was second best technically but who we felt would get on better with the team.

So there's one of the many reasons they could have chosen her instead of you.

@EarringsandLipstick

But I don't know how anyone can think Debbie behaved ethically in continuing to mentor the OP around a situation in which she had a personal conflict of interest.

She didn't mentor OP. OP is using that term v v loosely, and it doesn't fit any recognised definition of mentoring.

She looked at her CV and wished her well. There was no continuation - she wasn't mentoring her at all to start with.

Looking at her CV and wishing her well without disclosing that she is also going for the job, is also not ethical.

Having a technical reason why you haven't done anything wrong, isn't the same as having an ethical approach to relationships and professional behaviour.

She was advising me on her customer group really as it was one of the options for future career paths for me

And again, if this is what she was doing, she was not a mentor.

Not in any way, shape or form.

If you had such superior experience & qualifications to her, surely you would have been the preferred candidate.

You reek of entitlement op.If you’re that much a shoe in,you’d have got the job.
You didn’t. The other candidate clearly has what the employer wants
Stop all the griping,crack on and stop being a sore loser

Don’t be jollied along by the mn fan girls. It’s platitudes and misplaced ire

You need to move on now