Do you think the English, if given a vote, would vote for independence from the rest of the UK?

[Kendodd]

Yabu - No they wouldn't
Yanbu - Yes they would

The break up of the UK seems high chance to me, maybe 60/40 to be voted for within the next ten years. They don't ever seem to ask the English what would you personally vote?

They were able to convince people that Brexit would save money and make life simpler, by being out of the EU.

Al I am hearing now is that it doesn't matter how much it cost, nor what damage it does, it was "worth it. Or will be in 10 years time" (D. Raab). And that is what people voted for.

Yes, that's what they're saying now. Back then there were buses promising £350 million a week, the end of Brussels bureaucracy, no more red tape etc etc. That's what people thought they were voting for.

One Scottish Tory said:

"I'm lonely...."

No I wouldn't vote to leave the UK.

I'm a leave voter re brexit.

Although I think if Scotland, Wales or Northern Ireland seriously vote to leave the UK, they should be allowed to do so.

Brexit isn't that relevant but of course the leavers won.

The SNP campaign for independence has failed. I appreciate that they are having a crack again but what does it say about them that their fellow countrymen and women said no, and also, that they couldn't convince them otherwise? Either they weren't good enough or there was another problem.

Great Britain does include the smaller islands like the Isle of Wight. It just doesn’t include Ireland. Ireland and Great Britain together make up the British Isles.

It is unclear whether it was called Great Britain to distinguish it from Ireland or Brittany.

I would hope that most people who voted for or against Brexit did so thinking of long term consequences.

It is unclear whether it was called Great Britain to distinguish it from Ireland or Brittany.

Brittany was known as "Less(er) Britain" during the dark ages.

@XingMing

Given current oil prices, and the glut, plus the growth of renewables, North Sea Oil isn't financially viable. The Barnett Formula pays £1,800 pa per capita more towards Scottish taxpayers than English. The nuclear bases would likely move to the SW (where the Navy wanted them in the 1960s), and there are a lot of questions to be answered about a future Scottish currency. It's by no means certain that Westminster would wish to share sterling. And the really large elephant in the room: does the EU want another non-contributory member?

North Sea oil is only a drain when it suits WM, and Scotland has huge fields off the Clyde coast which cannot be exploited because the rigs would interfere with Trident movements. There's nowhere else in the UK these contraptions can be stored and serviced, so independence means scrapping the UK's "nuclear deterrence" and associated "prestige". Renewables are big, and Scotland already generates more electricity than we consume through wind and wave power. An independent Scotland would have her own currency, meaning the £ would no longer be a petrocurrency and with rUK soley responsible for the trillions in National Debt* the new Scottish currency would start with a clean slate.

An independent Scotland would be a net contributor to the EU, and no, we don't have to join the euro.

*Accepted by the UK Treasury, btw.

The one immutable law of politics is that the Treasury may change its mind. Like any other department of government. Or indeed a politician.

If I was a Scottish voter I would be looking at the bottom line for independence. What do I get now? What might be gained, and what likely can't be got.

Its a country, not a fairy story. You can legitimately criticise Brexiteers for all the stories they told people on the way.

so independence means scrapping the UK's "nuclear deterrence" and associated "prestige"

And the downsides ?

I would, purely because I am sick of the 'English Yoke' stuff and fed up of being associated with crimes I did not commit and Scotland (well the SNP) holding an IndyRef like some sword of damacles. I am a true product of the Union too, with more devolved blood than English, but I am just so sick of the carping from all sides.

@LexMitior

Brexit isn't that relevant but of course the leavers won.

The SNP campaign for independence has failed. I appreciate that they are having a crack again but what does it say about them that their fellow countrymen and women said no, and also, that they couldn't convince them otherwise? Either they weren't good enough or there was another problem.

Statistics suggest that the number of "no" voters roughly co-relates to the number of EU and English-born residents. We were all told the only way to guarantee staying in the EU was to vote No, it really was the most sucessful lie told during the campaign, so I can understand why EU citizens might vote No. And I can also understand English-born residents being concerned about border issues, being "foreigners", etc, so I can't blame them for that either.

But it is a problem for indy. I understand the Welsh have a similar issue, with English-born citizens having voted Leave where Welsh were keener to Remain, hence their decision. English colonialism means more than just WM rule.

@DGRossetti

so independence means scrapping the UK's "nuclear deterrence" and associated "prestige"

And the downsides ?

I think really all you are saying is so long as the English are the dominant population then you can't get a majority even in Wales or Scotland? I can understand that if you are a nationalist.

This neatly sidesteps the annual fiscal deficit of 8-11% (depending how it's calculated) and rests on the fantasy assumption that Scotland is liable for none of the UK's national debt, oh, and it can magic up a stable currency from scratch.

If it was that simple the nationalists would have one the once in a generation referendum.

@Nezza121

This neatly sidesteps the annual fiscal deficit of 8-11% (depending how it's calculated) and rests on the fantasy assumption that Scotland is liable for none of the UK's national debt, oh, and it can magic up a stable currency from scratch.

If it was that simple the nationalists would have one the once in a generation referendum.

Worth remembering that money is madey uppey ....

Yeah Brexit has been such fun, a great use of time, effort and money. Well up for round 2.

...And that GERS says nothing about the finances of an indy Scotland.

@araiwa - what an attitude

This popped up in my feed ... made me think of this thread.

@zafferana - I'm Welsh living in England. That would be terrible.

No idea, but I'd vote against it.

What would be terrible @luckylavender - Wales and England staying in union while the others didn't? I just feel like Wales is very small to be going it alone - but obviously that would be for the Welsh to decide if it comes to a referendum. But NI has Ireland to (re)join and Scotland is arguably big enough on its own.

there was another problem

Yeah. This one.

People didn't vote independence based on the political climate at the time, which was in part based on the argument that it would be the only way we would stay within the EU.

The political climate has changed significantly since then. So with the new knowledge and changing situation its fair to assume that some people might vote differently.

But I'm sure you'll disagree...