To think bad dog owners don't realise that they are bad dog owners?

[WayTooSoon]

Kind of a thread about lots of threads...

Every so often, threads appear on here saying someone's dog ran up to them/their child/their dog and how the owners respond with "it's ok, he's friendly" or similar. What usually follows is a load of posters saying "bad owners give us good owners a bad name". So is mumsnet entirely populated by "good owners" or are people oblivious to their own shortcomings as pet owners? Aibu to think that if someone is a bad owner, it seems likely that they have no idea that other people see them as a bad owner?

Are you now or have you ever been a "bad owner"?

@o8O8O8o Or a sandwich board!

I'm not so sure that all bad dog owners do not realise they are. I'm sure some enjoy their dog upsetting other dogs or other people.

@peak2021

I'm not so sure that all bad dog owners do not realise they are. I'm sure some enjoy their dog upsetting other dogs or other people.

People with large intimidating dogs often appear to enjoy their power to intimidate

I thought I'd be hearing about 'Growler' - the bad dog from Mr Creep the Crook's family. He didn't even reform at the end of the book :)

Bad owners - there are so many different kinds! There are probably a few who delight in their dog's behaviour. I don' t know any of these though. Most are probably kind and well-meaning; some don't realise that their dog's behaviour is unacceptable to others, and some don't see it as something they can change.

It is like bad parents though - we don't all agree on what makes them 'bad'.

I don't know any dog owner who hasn't gone through a period of making mistakes in order to get to the point of being responsible. If you grow up with dogs, you probably make those mistakes as a kid (or are prevented from making them by a supervising adult) or a young adult. My dogs now are better trained and managed than those I had 10+ years ago, certainly.

I suspect some people responding to dog threads on here are blind to their own failings, but many of them are those who are aware of the issues - dog threads do tend to select for people who are invested in their dogs (and those at the other end of the spectrum). People who own dogs but aren't very invested in them, like those who don't own dogs and aren't interested in them, are more likely not to engage with dog threads on here.

I think dogs can act in an unacceptable way but still have good owners if the owner realises it’s unacceptable, apologises and tries to stop it. Like with kids, sometimes you’re just seeing a “snapshot” and the bad behaviour isn’t a common occurrence.

When my dog was still a puppy, she once suddenly dashed away from me at full pelt and disappeared into the forest. I was horrified and quickly gave chase, trying to recall her. I burst onto a path and watched as she ran straight into the back of a little boy who was walking along a path with his family. He went flying!

Thankfully he was fine, loved that Stella was jumping all over him and his family found it hilarious. I was completely mortified and nearly in tears. I grabbed her and put her back on lead and spent the next couple of weeks refocusing on recall and being very cautious about letting her off lead. After another slightly less traumatic but similar incident, I paid for a course of 121 training with a dog trainer (she’d already completed puppy training).

Do those isolated incidents means I’m a bad dog owner? I don’t think so, I realised the behaviour was unacceptable, apologised and have done my best to prevent it from happening again.

I used to be scared of dogs and now have a dog so I understand both perspectives. I was once bitten by a dog off lead when he came running up to me and started jumping up at me. I was really scared and instead of the ditsy owners stopping him, they kept saying, ‘he’s fine, just a bit excited’. Even after the dog drew blood from me, the dog was still hanging around me as the owners fussed and apologised and I was absolutely terrified and remember thinking ‘I don’t care, please just grab him so he doesn’t do it again.

I’m really careful when out with my dog off lead, especially to try and read people to see if they might need me to keep my dog away (even though she poses no harm) because I know how it feels to have that fear.

However, I get a bit fed up with parents who let their child come straight up to my dog and allow them to continue trying to touch her. This happened this morning and despite me trying to say to the girl and her dad,‘she’s a bit scared, she needs space’, the little girl didn’t stop and my dog growled and barked at her and the girl goes off running to her dad, half crying.

I'm training a pup now and sometimes he lets me down and runs to another dog. I apologise and it's usually ok but some may see me as a bad owner

No history of biting so doesn't need a muzzle thank you.
I am also vocal and say don't stroke , she doesn't like kids .
No one listens
And yes it would end up being my fault for some one else's stupidity if she did bite .
She is a well adjusted dog considering her back ground.

@sunflowersandbuttercups
@JamesMiddletonsMarshmallows

Not aimed at you, but unfortunately you can't educate stupid until they get hurt . Seem to be saying that a lot recently.

I think the problem begins because people who love their dogs and all they do are completely unable to grasp that others do not feel the same - hence their surprise when you are not thrilled at being jumped at or licked. The owner sees this as part of their dog's charm (he is so friendly) and cannot get a grip on the fact that to others this might be the last thing they want and they find it offensive and unacceptable.

As far as the owner is concerned they are a "good" owner and have done nothing wrong.....just shared the delights of their dog.

A good owner will acknowledge that it is fine for others to feel differently about their dog and it is not a sign of a mental aberration. Such owners are few and far between.

I am not a dog lover at all, and have risk factors for getting knocked over, so need to be very wary. But although I do not like dogs, I sometimes query the "dog lover" label when I see poor dogs with laboured breathing struggling to get breath through their in-bred flat faces/noses and unable to get rid of flies because of their docked tails. Two such I saw in the wood last week - I am not sure a true dog lover would find this acceptable, but still it continues.

@Confusedcabbage

How do you teach stubborn dogs recall?

sausage

hard to train a dog that doesnt like food

People who love their dogs
Love is blind .....people who love their dogs are blind to the downsides of the dog

@drinkingwineoutofamug

No history of biting so doesn't need a muzzle thank you. I am also vocal and say don't stroke , she doesn't like kids . No one listens And yes it would end up being my fault for some one else's stupidity if she did bite . She is a well adjusted dog considering her back ground.

@sunflowersandbuttercups
@JamesMiddletonsMarshmallows

Not aimed at you, but unfortunately you can't educate stupid until they get hurt . Seem to be saying that a lot recently.

Sorry, but if you think she's going to bite, she needs to be muzzled, otherwise you're choosing to put her at risk by not keeping her safe.

I agree with you that a warning should be enough, but ultimately if your dog bites a child, you're going to lose her.

I think you're being incredibly reckless with your dogs' life by choosing not to muzzle her.

I grew up with big dogs, so I'm generally comfortable with dogs.

I accept dog owners can be caught out and if they are clearly responsive/ appologetic, I'm pretty forgiving. I was running in a quiet field a couple of weeks ago and there were some big dogs, burning off energy off-lead. One did chase after me and get bouncy. I slowed to a walk. The owner was trying to get attention. The dog came back when I tried running again. This time the owner was more successful and got the dog in the opposite direction with the ball. It was a sensible quiet place for the dog to be off lead, and the dog was in a energetic state. I'd be less forgiving in the local woods where there is a regular flow of people.

I was also forgiving when a dog bowled over DS2 whennhe was 3. The dog was playing with its own young family member. The owner came straight over and was very appologetic unfortunately that and so many other incidents of bouncy "friendly" dogs including 1yo DS1 having food wrestled out of his hand while sitting in the pram (not even a low buggy) and both DCs now have a well-ingrained fear.

It's astonishing how many dog owners will ignore obvious fear in another human and blithely shout "it's OK, he's friendly!". I now answer back with "my child isn't". At 7 and 10, they should be able to walk away from me in a public place without being put into fear because of feckless dog owners. So many phases of progress at standing still or even gaining confidence to ask if they can stroke a dog have been put back by the next bouncy, "friendly" nuisence.

It is worth noting that the law includes others' distress innthe definition of control.

I never want to be jumped up at by a random dog. I accept mud below my knees when walking, but not on my coats. There are several local dogs that I dread seeing because of their behaviour and their indulging owner. When I challenged one owner and told her to put it on a lead because it had now jumped up 3 times within a couple of hundred metres, she complained at me for scaring the dog... I was walking solo, pokemoning and had just firmly told the dog to get down with teacher voice

These types of owners ruin public spaces for everyone else, including other owners.

I think it is a growing problem. Partly anthropmorphisation and mis-guided indulgent love. Partly that there are more difficult rescue dogs being rehomed after poor experiences, plus the idiots that get dogs, ruin them and then pass them into the rescue system when they don't cope.

I think it is a growing problem. Partly anthropmorphisation and mis-guided indulgent love. Partly that there are more difficult rescue dogs being rehomed after poor experiences, plus the idiots that get dogs, ruin them and then pass them into the rescue system when they don't cope
I think this summarises the problem very well ✔️

@sunflowersandbuttercups
Hence I walk in a different direction. She's never bitten. Growled yes. I watch her body language.
Don't let her off lead near children as that's asking for problems.
We go into fields where she plays with her dog friends and us owners have our travel mugs of tea whilst we watch them play in mud 🙄

But I do understand your concern. And it's a concern to myself as well.

MN has a seriously weird obsession with hating dogs
From your dog-loving POV. As a dog-hater, I seem to only see MN’s weirdly rabid pro-dog obsession. I wonder if the truth is actually somewhere in the middle, that it’s mostly normal about dogs with a few outlying viewpoints, but everyone only sees the other side, as that’s the bit that makes them irate?

All I know is that on plenty of dog-poo threads, owners here have admitted to leaving bags of poo dangling from trees and fences/flicking it into undergrowth instead of picking it up/not wanting to have poo in their pocket/leaving smears. But they won’t admit these are terrible things to do, and clearly see themselves as good dog owners. So, yeah, plenty of bad dog owners but they love their mutts so see themselves as good; and an assumption that everyone who dislikes their dog is afraid – I’m not afraid of dogs, I don’t like dogs.

It's not a decent dog walk if you haven't got a few bags of poo in your pocket.
I bought a cheap waterproof bag, has sections in it so keep used poo bags till I get home or find a bin.
There was the one time I could smell poo in the house, checked carpets , shoes etc
It was my partners coat that had a used poo bag in the pocket 🤢

Maybe people could stop their children running up to my dog

This.
I have literally told children no and they still try and touch my dog. Where are the parents? Not even watching or giving a shit.

I see much more bad parenting than bad dog owners on my walks!

‘MN has a seriously weird obsession with hating dogs’
‘From your dog-loving POV. As a dog-hater, I seem to only see MN’s weirdly rabid pro-dog obsession. I wonder if the truth is actually somewhere in the middle, that it’s mostly normal about dogs with a few outlying viewpoints, but everyone only sees the other side, as that’s the bit that makes them irate?’

I’m not a dog owner ( I’m a cat lover), but I have no problem with dogs, only with dog owners who don’t clear up their dog shit. I’m always nonplussed by how polarised these threads become. Dog owners should accept that not everyone likes dogs (I accept that there are people who don’t like cats) and dog haters should come to terms that they will come into contact with dogs when out and about.

Ultimately there are some entitled, inconsiderate people about and some of them own dogs.

I love dogs and love them coming up to me to say hello. But it gets my back up when a dog owner can't empathise with people who don't feel that way.
Anyone who walks regularly will be used to overhearing the standard line "don't worry he's friendly!" - while it might be intended to reassure, it doesn't excuse it. It's rude! Just apologise first and foremost, and in turn I think most reasonable people will be understanding.

Dog owners should accept that not everyone likes dogs (I accept that there are people who don’t like cats) and dog haters should come to terms that they will come into contact with dogs when out and about.

Completely agree. We all share this world (animals included). We could all do with being abit more tolerant of each other.

Yeah I was a bad dog owner, well my whole family were, when I was growing up. Our dog used to jump up over guests all the time. I didn’t realise until I was adult and had moved away from home how bad it was. I’m quite embarrassed really.

My son is scared of dogs because he was knocked over on a beach by 3 big dogs as a toddler - the owners carried on on their walk and oblivious chat without a care in the world and certainly didn’t apologise .

If someone tells me their dog is friendly I tell them my kids scared ... in most cases it works but not all. There’s something wrong when people can see a small child obviously terrified and not care

I'll freely admit I'm still using a trainer with my youngest who is 3. He is fine in the house, fine to walk outside, as soon as he see's another dog he turns into a total twat and whines and pulls to get to the dog. Trouble is he is also very selective which dogs he likes so I am trying to train him to ignore other dogs, but neither food nor favourite toys work. Might have to go down the whistle route.

Don't get me wrong I'm doing all I can but it's got worse since lockdown last year.