AIBU to think women should not be banned from Social media for asking the question - Thread 2

[Thewithesarehere]

Many women have been suspended from sm for asking the question:
“Do you believe that male sexed people should be allowed access to changing rooms and showers for female sexed people and teenagers?”
Seems like a perfectly reasonable question which we should be allowed to ask.

Let’s vote with our AIBU.

@lifeturnsonadime

So winesalot presumably if women can't be defined then nor can men. So how do they know they don't feel like a man if that doesn't have a biological definition?

How does that marry with the fact that many transwomen (biological males) chose to take no action to physically change. I saw that Alex person on the other thread before the picture was taken off.

Don't try logic! It's a mind fuck and leads no-where.

Life, there is a book called “irreversible damage” which is written by a journalist who was looking into why sudden so many girls, especially girls on the spectrum, suddenly I deny as transgender. It is actually very good I think.

Despite attempts to "cancel" it and its author, Wall Street Journal writer Abigail Shrier, by social media companies reacting to pressure from TRAs it is available to buy now on Amazon and other online bookshops.

By the time she did her last year in the local primary it was clear that her interests were different from her peers.

I have a child that had completely different interests to their peers. Coming from another country, they were actually very typical of their peers there. But not here which in their school seemed to be hyper stereotyped.

Goodness knows what she is if the biology of being a girl isn't the determining factor. Thank god she's not aware of any of this.

I became aware of this movement before my child did and had done lots of reading because I watched a friend work with her gender dysphoric child and I recognised a lot of that dysphoria in my own teenaged years. My child is now 14 and is now surrounded by it.

At least my child understands that you cannot change sex, only presentation and that is ok as long as the person doesn't demand rights that might dilute others. They also understand how women in the family lacked opportunities because of sexism, and that equal opportunity for women has not been reached. And it won't while males are free to call themselves women for all purposes . Males who do not have the biological needs of women but assume the protections fought for by women for themselves.

Don't try logic! It's a mind fuck and leads no-where.

I'm definitely at that stage at the moment.

I've heard of Irreversible Damage, I'll try to get hold of it. I think I saw on twitter yesterday that the author was subjected to the most horrific threat on her personal email. Too awful to repeat.

Datun that article is really interesting about the different types of gender dysphoria. The gender dysphoria type of some the transwomen who want to enter our safe spaces is autogynephilia , which appears to be based on a 'male sexual arousal of fantasy of being a woman'. These are largely heterosexual males. I can't get my head round how that isn't a risk to women or girls or that a sexual fantasy need goes above the need of women to safe spaces. Mumsnet I hope this doesn't breach guidelines I'm really not trying to offend just trying to understand.

God what a world that we must be womanly and adhere to a set of undefined traits of being a woman.

How is this a good thing? How is this more enlightened than biological reality?

Sorry life but talk of a certain phenomenon existing is likely to breach guidelines so we are unable to mention it here.

Twitter is definitely not the place to read about it either...

I think I am now starting to understand why some people object to gendered toys (pink and blue) .

Yes, life. Please be careful how you phrase things on MN. You have to adopt a convoluted way of describing things and stating things so that you do not get deleted and accrue strikes and eventually be banned.

It is easier to read the links which can speak plainly.

yes, that threat that Abigail Shrier posted was horrendous.

Ok sorry, I won't mention it again. Ridiculous though, more censorship of women being able to discuss things that directly affect them openly.

@lifeturnsonadime

I think I am now starting to understand why some people object to gendered toys (pink and blue) .

I thought 'gendered toys' were a ridiculous change driven by marketing (and I am a marketer). And the lack of colour range and assortment in clothes. I was aghast when I had my child that there was so little choice. I almost cried in the aisles at what had happened to my beloved lego. Seriously. Lego was unisex when I was a kid, passed down from sister to brother to sister to next generation.

Re. lego my daughter likes the architecture and space sets, along with Harry potter.

The friends set is so twee.

My dd loves lego too.

She has ninjago , city, nasa, all sorts.

And boys should be able to pick the friends if they want.

Not sure what people think will happen if they buy the "wrong" one.

No, OP, you are not being unreasonable. Women are being silencecforcasking questions and having opinions someone else disagrees with. I am not on Twitter, I don't know if this thread has been linked yet, couldn't see it, but this makes me thankful I am not. The fact so many think these things are acceptable to publish make me feel more ill than the content itself.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3955276-resource-thread-of-tra-screenshots

And they wonder why there are reservations about opening up single sex spaces.

And god only knows who I will vote for next election, the green party and labour have shown how little they give a fig about women.

It answer to the question why do men want to be women anyway. There are usually a couple of reasons given including disphoria. It is notable though in discussion with activists there seem to be a large number who also argue for mainstream acceptance of kink. It is also suggested that the prevalence of online porn has played a large part in this increasing trend.

I think it is high time that MN reviewed and revised the guidelines on these topics, in order to allow topics to be discussed properly, without having to twisting our words about . It is now clear that most readers are mystified by the rules and regs. Why is it presumed offensive somehow to talk about GDs many manifestations? For new readers the trans widows thread on the feminism board is also revelatory ( though it is primarily a support thread for women affected)

@lifeturnsonadime

Don't try logic! It's a mind fuck and leads no-where.

I'm definitely at that stage at the moment.

I've heard of Irreversible Damage, I'll try to get hold of it. I think I saw on twitter yesterday that the author was subjected to the most horrific threat on her personal email. Too awful to repeat.

Datun that article is really interesting about the different types of gender dysphoria. The gender dysphoria type of some the transwomen who want to enter our safe spaces is autogynephilia , which appears to be based on a 'male sexual arousal of fantasy of being a woman'. These are largely heterosexual males. I can't get my head round how that isn't a risk to women or girls or that a sexual fantasy need goes above the need of women to safe spaces. Mumsnet I hope this doesn't breach guidelines I'm really not trying to offend just trying to understand.

You've got it.

This link will clarify too. It details the experience of women married to men who identify as women.

www.transwidowsvoices.org/

However, I have not yet gone down the rabbit hole to discover what Sissy and other specific porn actually is (hypno??? ). I have come across some porn posted by transwomen when looking at the posts by them that weren't porn related. Only to discover their feed was self-hosted porn and not behind a warning that twitter says should be for adult content. (That was when I discovered that twitter was a legal porn channel) This has happened more than a couple of times.

Each to their own. I have chosen to not increase my depth of knowledge.

MNHQ***. I am not inferring at all that all transwomen are into porn at all. Of course not. I am commenting that I found it by accident on twitter. The only thing these people were doing 'wrong' was not following the twitter guidelines in having a warning up on each tweet that was porn content.

@Quaagars

Then you get told to go die in a greasefire, or choke on their girldicks

By who?
On here?
Never, ever seen that on here.
Must mean you've gone over to Twitter and seen extremists commenting or whatever?
Via links?
Then come to the conclusion that's what they all do, the trans want us to choke or die
They're just people.

When I first became interested in this subject I posted something about supporting a third space on twitter.

I had to close my account eventually because of the number of abusive replies and DMs. Including comments such as i deserve to watch my child be raped with their girl dick, the usual rape threats against me etc. All reported to Twitter and the one regarding my daughter to the police. Nothing was done. In fact, the police officer i spoke to suggested just not giving opinions on twitter. Yes genuinely the response was keep quiet woman and dont bother us manly men with your silly womanly complaints.

So no, not just random screenshots, but actual experience.

Lego was unisex

Lego is still unisex.

I think flat earthers are getting some unfair representation here. It is perfectly possible to believe the world is flat without forcing anyone else to agree with you, or even listen to you or change their lives in any way shape or form.

The trans population, is, we are led to believe, a tiny percentage of the population as a whole. I fail to understand why women's rights are placed secondary in this scenario. Why is the risk to women (because transwomen offend violently and sexually at the same rate as men) deemed negligible? Why do women not matter? Why do women's feelings not matter?

@Whatsnewpussyhat

Lego was unisex

Lego is still unisex.

There has been more lego diversity come to market since I started looking. I do agree it is much more unisex than it was when I started purchasing it. And I agree Lego Friends is dreadful.

Remove their specific biology from the word woman, and anyone can be one.

Sexism disappears, misogyny doesn't exist. Neither does sex specific crime.

Yes Datun, if the definition of 'woman' is changed to include some men, then the legal protections of women become worthless. We are protected in law against discrimination on the basis of our sex. That's it. That's the only protection we have.

Well the word that mustn't be named explains the rapey threats by some transwomen on twitter. I didn't understand the logic behind those at all before reading that article.

Astonishing.

We. Need. To. Talk. About. This.