AIBU to think women should not be banned from Social media for asking the question - Thread 2

[Thewithesarehere]

Many women have been suspended from sm for asking the question:
“Do you believe that male sexed people should be allowed access to changing rooms and showers for female sexed people and teenagers?”
Seems like a perfectly reasonable question which we should be allowed to ask.

Let’s vote with our AIBU.

What are the facts, according to you @RootyT00t?
What is a woman?
Why is there a hugely disproportionate number of young autistic girls identifying as trans?
How much does someone have to do for you to recognise them as a member of the opposite sex? GRC? Surgery? Just because they say so?
Can we identify in other ways? As a different race or age? If not, why not?
Should male bodied people be in women's prisons? Refuges? Changing rooms? Rugby teams?

[quote RootyT00t]@Winesalot

Ahh very clever i see what you did there

I can see how my use of the word 'Nope' and refusal to engage with your many random statements means I have answered yes to yet another question that I didn't actually answer.

I did compare your and other posters stances to racism and homophobia though yes. I don't think that was hidden.[/quote]
I am genuinely confused Rooty. You said you'd answered the question.

Yes, based on these threads, many of these posters should not allowed to discuss these issues on social media.

then

I, unlike this thread, don't believe I am entitled enough to stop people doing anything.

I was asked the question and I've answered it.

So, the 'yes' did not answer the main question I asked? If that is the case, I apologise.

Can you answer this question now:

"do you think that an adult male with a penis should have the right to undress beside a teenage girl, or any woman, in a women's communal changing room?'

It is after all the subject of the thread.

Excellent. And we will keep thinking you are transphobic. And the world will continue.

Who is 'we'? What group are you representing?

If you define 'transphobia' as anything that refutes the claim 'transwomen are women' then of course you will see transphobia - you're setting people up to be classed as transphobic for disagreeing with a claim that's never been proved - that cannot be proved - and then trying to punish them for their disagreement. That's really dishonest and wrong.

You tell me that I have to believe in something I think, and the evidence shows, is fundamentally untrue, otherwise I am a bigot, and my opinions automatically don't matter. I object to that in the strongest terms. I feel bullied. And disregarded. And disempowered. And the people wanting access to my space don't give a shit, because their feelings matter more apparently. This is no way to build trust and win allies.

This. It is often all about power. And demonstrating that women and girls don't have any.

@Ereshkigalangcleg

His own feelings rather than Barbara from Kent telling him how he should feel? Imagine.

And you think you sound progressive I love the smell of misogyny in the morning. I think Barbara from Kent or anywhere else, as a woman with first hand experience, is perfectly entitled to a different view on what a woman is from a male with second hand experience.

But it strikes me by your repeated use of male pronouns that you don't actually buy into this ideology much yourself. I'm not sure why you imagine we should.

I don't think I'm progressive .

Ah. There we go again with the putting us into a box . You got me, used male pronouns so im a fraudster.

I don't think you should do anything.

But it does, you weed referring to me when you talk about the other posters on this thread who won't let this drop

I don't think you should do anything.

That's good then, not that I care in any way what you think.

@Impatiens

Excellent. And we will keep thinking you are transphobic. And the world will continue.

Who is 'we'? What group are you representing?

If you define 'transphobia' as anything that refutes the claim 'transwomen are women' then of course you will see transphobia - you're setting people up to be classed as transphobic for disagreeing with a claim that's never been proved - that cannot be proved - and then trying to punish them for their disagreement. That's really dishonest and wrong.

I'm not representing any group. I'm not that arrogant.

But I'm also sure even if you are not entitled enough to think I'm the only person in the world who thinks some of these posts are transphobic.

Righto on the dishonest and wrong bit.

@Ereshkigalangcleg

I don't think you should do anything.

That's good then, not that I care in any way what you think.

Back atcha

What is the point of this merail, exactly?

-@Winesalot

No it isn't. The clues in the title, that's the question I have answered.

The other question is irrelevant to whether I think people should be able to discuss this topic in the manner they do, which is why I haven't answered it.

Oh btw please report all transphobic posts

And perhaps educate us as to what is transphobic
Is it saying sex matters?
Is it saying sex is not changeable?
???

But I'm also sure even if you are not entitled enough to think I'm the only person in the world who thinks some of these posts are transphobic.

That's a bit of a straw person. We are all fully aware that standing up for women's sex based rights, and considering the feelings and concerns of women and girls is considered "anti trans".

@Ereshkigalangcleg

What is the point of this merail, exactly?

What's yours?

To all congratulate each other on how right you all are!

@Ereshkigalangcleg

But I'm also sure even if you are not entitled enough to think I'm the only person in the world who thinks some of these posts are transphobic.

That's a bit of a straw person. We are all fully aware that standing up for women's sex based rights, and considering the feelings and concerns of women and girls is considered "anti trans".

Transphobic.

His own feelings rather than Barbara from Kent telling him how he should feel? Imagine.

Are you really trying to pretend that transgender doesn't exist? What an utterly bizarre post.

But how can you know what it feels like to be a woman when you aren't a woman? You can only base it on what you perceive women to be from the outside? How does one 'live as a woman' that isn't just stereotypes about women?

Of course gender dysphoria exists. There are men who feel more comfortable presenting according to the stereotypes associated with women. And that is fine. But that doesn't actually make them women. They are two entirely different things.

Why does a man's feelings trump a woman's anyway? So if a man walks into a changing room and 'identifies as a man', women are allowed to feel anxious and uncomfortable and are allowed to ask him to leave. But if a man walked into a female changing room and 'identifies as a woman' then the women aren't allowed to feel anxiety or discomfort and in fact they are bigoted if they do. So the feelings that women are allowed and not allowed to feel are entirely dictated by how the male in their presence feels.

And you don't think there is any problem with that?

What's 'Barbara from Kent' got to do with anything anyway? Your misogynistic stereotyping is showing....

You haven't actually advanced any argument as to why we are wrong?

@midgedude

But it does, you weed referring to me when you talk about the other posters on this thread who won't let this drop

I meant they , not you. I apologise

@Ereshkigalangcleg

You haven't actually advanced any argument as to why we are wrong?

No. I explained why I wasn't going to do that earlier.

Transphobic

Go on, tell me how. How will I ever learn otherwise?

Considering the feelings of women and girls is transphobic?!

Well, at least you are not trying to hide the misogyny I guess 🤷‍♀️

@Jetatyeovilaerodrome

His own feelings rather than Barbara from Kent telling him how he should feel? Imagine.

Are you really trying to pretend that transgender doesn't exist? What an utterly bizarre post.

But how can you know what it feels like to be a woman when you aren't a woman? You can only base it on what you perceive women to be from the outside? How does one 'live as a woman' that isn't just stereotypes about women?

Of course gender dysphoria exists. There are men who feel more comfortable presenting according to the stereotypes associated with women. And that is fine. But that doesn't actually make them women. They are two entirely different things.

Why does a man's feelings trump a woman's anyway? So if a man walks into a changing room and 'identifies as a man', women are allowed to feel anxious and uncomfortable and are allowed to ask him to leave. But if a man walked into a female changing room and 'identifies as a woman' then the women aren't allowed to feel anxiety or discomfort and in fact they are bigoted if they do. So the feelings that women are allowed and not allowed to feel are entirely dictated by how the male in their presence feels.

And you don't think there is any problem with that?

What's 'Barbara from Kent' got to do with anything anyway? Your misogynistic stereotyping is showing....

Why are you all obsessed with changing rooms? The people who have implied that people change sex to go and be predators in changing rooms are deluded. And there is a world of difference between stating you are uncomfortable about trans women being in changing rooms and denying that the whole thing exists altogether!

@Jetatyeovilaerodrome

Considering the feelings of women and girls is transphobic?!

Well, at least you are not trying to hide the misogyny I guess 🤷‍♀️

No.

Denying that trans exists is transphobic.

No. I explained why I wasn't going to do that earlier.

Always the same - there's not point, it's a waste of time engaging blah blah blah. So what I'm going to do instead is keep calling you transphobic and faux wide eyed in the hope that your lady doubt kicks in to compensate for the fact that I don't have a coherent argument on this.

Seen it all before hun... Next!

@Ereshkigalangcleg

Transphobic

Go on, tell me how. How will I ever learn otherwise?

Oh sorry I was just correcting your term.

Anti trans isn't really a thing you see. That implies being against trans.

Denying it all together is transphobic.