To think teachers should be moved up vaccination list..

[Ltdannygreen]

I’m not a teacher just to clarify, but I can’t be the only one who think teachers should be a priority on the vaccination list, not just so kids can get back to school but many are currently working to teach the children of key workers who are on the frontline everyday who still pose a risk. I’m aware that elderly are important, but so are our teachers.

Moved up to what point?

In the current 'do by mid Feb' group?

Or next after that, displacing all the 65+ and Cv?

The current list aims to prevent at least 80% of deaths by vaccinating phase 1 vulnerable/old first - what lower figure do you want to see instead?

After the vulnerable list, but before they might otherwise receive it. I’ll get it from the oldies list but would like my younger colleagues who are also in school to get it ASAP.

I'm going to guess that people have "run the numbeds" on who getting the vaccine at what time will male the most difference.

Atm were phase 1 which is people who are going to die and those who work with them.

Yes teachers may help spread it but largely in a group that won't die.

@OverTheRainbowLiesOz

But if the teacher gets covid they can't teach. The class loses their teacher.

I teach and I don't think that should be a priority over someone actually losing their granny.

But I do think people need to look at more than just death.

There is also little evidence of the elderly or vulnerable being more likely to die

So what was said in the press conference and other briefings today was all a lie then?

@OverTheRainbowLiesOz

But if the teacher gets covid they can't teach. The class loses their teacher.

Again... We don't yet know if the vaccine stops transmission. So a vaccinated teacher can still get Covid and potentially pass it on. Absolutely no different to now so what is the point of your argument? A vaccinated teacher with Covid may very well still need to isolate as we don't know if this means they can't still pass it on.

The only difference is they are less likely to be badly effected by the symptoms.

@CookEatRepeat

After the vulnerable list, but before they might otherwise receive it. I’ll get it from the oldies list but would like my younger colleagues who are also in school to get it ASAP.

So exactly when they're scheduled to get it then....

@RancidOldHag

Moved up to what point?

In the current 'do by mid Feb' group?

Or next after that, displacing all the 65+ and Cv?

The current list aims to prevent at least 80% of deaths by vaccinating phase 1 vulnerable/old first - what lower figure do you want to see instead?

I'd displace the 65 plus, if otherwise healthy .

But we are all viewing this through our own lens.

@wheresmykimchi it's making a decision based on evidence. Not only are elderly people more likely to die of covid - they're more likely to go to hospital, the doctors and need operations even for routine old age.

If they haven't got covid and they can be treated in hospital for other ill health it's a bit like two birds with one stone instead of what we have now - struggling with covid nevermind what other health problems are going on because appointments are cancelled.

If teachers are vaccinated it wont make a huge difference to the NHS - it wont mean that cancer appointments can be scheduled again, so no - I don't think that's priority.

I know it sounds flippant, but if you're a teacher in your 20s in good health the chance of dying of covid are very small. Not all teachers are in that demographic but many are.

Vaccinating teachers doesn't do anything to get kids back to school. It's the unvaccinated kids mixing that will mainly spread the virus in schools, the teachers being vaccinated doesn't change that.

If we move Teachers up the priority list that means moving other people down. At the moment the only people on the priority list are those who are more likely to die of covid (e.g. those with underlying health conditions) or who work with those more likely to die (e.g. HCPs). So moving teachers up the priority list means leaving vulnerable people exposed for longer resulting in more deaths.

Even once we've got through the people more likely to die, if we start to prioritise by at risk professions, research suggests there are a bunch of professions that are more at risk than teachers.

The number of posts on here advocating for vaccinating teachers but not, say, bus drivers who seem to be significantly more at risk and are just as essential to people working, is pretty eye opening.

@RancidOldHag

There is also little evidence of the elderly or vulnerable being more likely to die

So what was said in the press conference and other briefings today was all a lie then?

Behave.

It's not always about truth or lies.

Covid deaths are a death within 28 days of contracting covid. In the same way that the majority of elderly deaths are pneumonia
Theree have been people actively campaigning that granny didn't die of covid she died of cancer - please don't make her a statistic.

Yes definitely, hopefully by the time they are forced back, the weather will be on their side re windows open and eating outdoors
It's barbaric expecting anyone to have to cram into closed rooms with 30 people and no masks and only fresh air between them and viral load of covid.

So I'd appreciate withdrawal of the fucked up

No. I won't agree that it's not fucked up to suggest we shouldn't first be vaccinating people more likely to die from this.

I've no idea where you've got it from that there is not much evidence that the elderly and vulnerable are more likely to die considering the science says that is definitely the case. The top 4 categories as they are account for 88% of the current deaths!!

@BoomBoomsCousin

Vaccinating teachers doesn't do anything to get kids back to school. It's the unvaccinated kids mixing that will mainly spread the virus in schools, the teachers being vaccinated doesn't change that.

If we move Teachers up the priority list that means moving other people down. At the moment the only people on the priority list are those who are more likely to die of covid (e.g. those with underlying health conditions) or who work with those more likely to die (e.g. HCPs). So moving teachers up the priority list means leaving vulnerable people exposed for longer resulting in more deaths.

Even once we've got through the people more likely to die, if we start to prioritise by at risk professions, research suggests there are a bunch of professions that are more at risk than teachers.

The number of posts on here advocating for vaccinating teachers but not, say, bus drivers who seem to be significantly more at risk and are just as essential to people working, is pretty eye opening.

As a teacher , I agree and I suspect it's far more to do with people wanting their kids back - look at the posts about oh but a whole class goes back.

I think supermarket / retail staff are the real victims in this. Completely forgotten.

Definitely after those groups Rancid. At risk groups first, but then workers regularly in contact with large groups, especially those without PPE.

They are currently plotting to have a priority keyworker list and teachers will be part of that list.

How and when they are going to slot that in place I don't think they have decided yet.

It may be after this current priority list or it could overlap as a people to call if spare doses. So they don't go to waste. Or something else completely different. We will have to wait and see.

I reckon the end of February we will find out. Probably going to depend on the J&J vaccine finished data and approval. That is a single dose vaccine. So are vaccinationrate would be even faster

YANBU, they are frontline workers with high exposure to the virus due to their working environment - but how high up the list do you think they should go?

Teachers over 50 will probably get vaccinated in the spring anyway, based on age alone. I can see a case for all other teachers receiving the vaccine as a priority, as and when their age group is being vaccinated - so, for example, a 45 year old teacher being given priority over a 45 year old person working from home. I'm just not sure that a 45 yr old teacher should have priority over a 65 yr old though, due to the higher mortality rates for 65 yr olds.

@JogOnTony

So I'd appreciate withdrawal of the fucked up

No. I won't agree that it's not fucked up to suggest we shouldn't first be vaccinating people more likely to die from this.

I've no idea where you've got it from that there is not much evidence that the elderly and vulnerable are more likely to die considering the science says that is definitely the case. The top 4 categories as they are account for 88% of the current deaths!!

Didnt say that.

I refer you to my earlier post regarding stats but if you're going to call me fucked up I'm not really interested.

Teachers being higher in tbe list wont change things.
We need the most vulnerable vaccinated first. Once the over 65s are done there will be a change.

Adding teachers to the priority list would greatly slow this down.

Not another thread where people don’t understand the reason why the grannie who is 80yo in a care home has got priority over my sons teacher who is 25yo with no health problems

80yo woman if she caught COVID she’d need a bed most likely in the hospital. She might even need a ventilator. And maybe die? Or maybe not ... but she’d need 2-3 weeks of hospitalisation. In the mean time you have a car accident and they can’t give you a bed because the 80yo woman is using it. With a vaccine if she caught the virus most likely she’d stay at home with a minor flu style.

My sons teacher. Without the vaccine she’d have the virus quite likely quite mild. With it ... same. No need of bed most likely.

So whilst i agree those that are older or have got health conditions should have it soon I don’t agree they should jump the queue over those who might need a bed in hospital that could be used for cancer / heart attacks / accidents etc

Older teachers and teachers with underlying health issues will be vaccinated sooner as per the plan anyway. I think it's fine as it is.

@EasterIssland

Not another thread where people don’t understand the reason why the grannie who is 80yo in a care home has got priority over my sons teacher who is 25yo with no health problems

80yo woman if she caught COVID she’d need a bed most likely in the hospital. She might even need a ventilator. And maybe die? Or maybe not ... but she’d need 2-3 weeks of hospitalisation. In the mean time you have a car accident and they can’t give you a bed because the 80yo woman is using it. With a vaccine if she caught the virus most likely she’d stay at home with a minor flu style.

My sons teacher. Without the vaccine she’d have the virus quite likely quite mild. With it ... same. No need of bed most likely.

So whilst i agree those that are older or have got health conditions should have it soon I don’t agree they should jump the queue over those who might need a bed in hospital that could be used for cancer / heart attacks / accidents etc

This has to be about more than death statistics though. It has to.

I could understand the argument if we knew the vaccine prevented transmission of Covid. But we don't.

Therefore whether a teacher is vaccinated or not, if the vaccine doesn't actually stop them being able to get and pass on Covid, it won't make any difference to school openings, closures, transmission to family members etc...

The whole point right now is getting the strain off the NHS. The only way to do that is to vaccinate those people most likely to need a hospital. It won't stop them getting Covid, but it will stop them needing treatment for it.

It's not about your level of exposure. It's about how severe your symptoms are statistically likely to be should you get it. No matter what your profession, teacher, police, shop worker, bus driver etc... if you are not in a vulnerable category then you are not statistically likely to get Covid severely enough to require hospital treatment. I don't get what's so difficult to understand about that personally.

Remember the priority list is there for a good reason. Even if you don't agree with or trust our government look other countries and their priority lists. They have similar lists to us.

(Poland has vaccinated lots of politicians and famous people before their vulnerable. Much to the horror of other EU countries. We could be doing that!)

This has to be about more than death statistics though. It has to

It's not though? It's about the NHS and reducing the number of people in hospitals and saving lives. That is absolutely the most important thing right now.