On our way to Biden's Inauguration (Trump #119)

[Roussette]

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4128420-Capitol-Hill-and-the-next-2-weeks-Trump-118?watched=1&msgid=103459695#103459695

Here we are on our fast moving theads

www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/dec/31/joe-biden-secret-service-team-trump-loyalty

'Joe Biden is expected to receive Secret Service protection with a new team that is more familiar to him and replacing some agents amid concerns that they may be politically allied with Donald Trump.

In a changing of the guard as well as the man to be guarded at the White House, Biden’s security detail will undergo some staffing changes, the Washington Post reported on Thursday.

Several “senior” Secret Service agents are poised to return to the president-elect’s protection team and Biden knows these agents well because they guarded him and his family during his time as vice-president, according to the article, echoed in a report by CNN, citing a law enforcement source.'

@AskingQuestionsAllTheTime

As I understand it, the man responsible for turning dow more help at the Capitol when it was offered two or three days in advance has resigned -- but I think he still should be prosecuted for that appalling decision.

The police on the ground, one of whom died because of his decision, were not responsible for his behaviour; unless they can be shown as individuals to have colluded in the rioting (as opposed to submitting to overwhelming force while hoping for reinforcement) individual officers should not be held to blame.

You've expressed it far better than I Asking.

What we have seen is radicalisation.

No different to the radicalisation that takes place with other people.

Oregon:

thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/533460-video-surfaces-of-orgeon-gop-rep-holding-capitol-door-open-for?fbclid=IwAR0gTcJJ7HylmN6hsaIMIRnTAX222Al64nwyrvE1Mwd9qRnX8uj6ANabLcs

Interesting thread

twitter.com/sethabramson/status/1347908845281095680?s=21

This is a terrific thread about how to deal with people who have gone over to QAnon or extremist beliefs:

twitter.com/dannagal/status/1347564138738946050

Echoing @PerkingFaintly 's post -- it's not about trying to reason with them using factual sources, they are primed to reject this. You have to try to get to them via emotions and values, using personal connections. It's very hard work.

As for what we can all do -- vote!! Vote in every election, no matter how small or local. Vote for candidates who are committed to anti-racism and anti-extremism.

Follow the news. Be engaged. Look out for local initiatives that you can contribute to.

Keep an eye on what your kids are learning at school. A friend of mine was shocked recently to see her son's school using a textbook that presented Europeans as taking over empty lands in the Americas and Australia. She complained to the school and the publisher and now that textbook will be revised.

It doesn't have to be about grand gestures. Every little thing we do to beat back these horrible ideas counts.

Thank you PerkingFaintly, Igotjelly and dreamingbohemian for your thoughts and for the links which I will have a read through.

The online gaming was interesting as I dabble a bit but it is a scene which has some very toxic and problematic behaviour going on (but also lots of lovely people).

I am very lucky to live in quite a privileged liberal bubble where I wouldn't day that I (currently) know anyone who is at risk of going down the qanon style route and am not directly impacted by racism or antisemitism. But I am also aware it is all too easy to end up just observing and despairing of what is going (as in these threads) without taking action as a result. Particularly as I am a bit afraid of getting caught up in online debate that turns nasty (I have seen how vicious people can get online!). And there are not really any local iniatives to get involved in - I mean there will be in neighbouring towns but they are not communities I am currently part of.

My grandparents were much more political and socially active I am (conscientious objection, cnd, campaigning to join eec, inner city youth work) and I do feel a bit ashamed not to be the same!

@AskingQuestionsAllTheTime

This entertained me:

loweringthebar.net/2021/01/dear-idiots-please-keep-posting-pictures-of-you-committing-federal-crimes.html?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=dear-idiots-please-keep-posting-pictures-of-you-committing-federal-crimes&utm_source=feedblitz&utm_medium=FeedBlitzRss&utm_campaign=loweringthebar

I especially love the idiot Adam Christian Johnson who went home and took the house number off his house, apparently under the impression that if he did that, the FBI would be unable to locate him.

especially love the idiot Adam Christian Johnson who went home and took the house number off his house, apparently under the impression that if he did that, the FBI would be unable to locate him.

I'm sorry, but this really, really made me laugh out loud. I'm remembering one of my sons at about 3 covering their eyes and saying "You can't see me!!!"

Wow you lot don’t half talk!

I do vote though! Even the local elections. I have mainly lived in safe seats for one party or another though so it can be hard to feel it makes much difference.

@terrywynne maybe try googling anti-racism volunteer, and see if there is anything that interests you? A lot of this work is done online. I think there are some specific initiatives for gaming.

Depending how savvy you are with online research, there's a huge crowd-sourced effort right now to track down people at the Capitol but also to keep track of extremists online generally.

If you're on Twitter or social media, share the work that others are doing.

I completely understand that feeling of, well what can I do if I'm not encountering it personally? I think there are a lot of options these days. If I have time later I'll try to post some ideas.

Chapeau to our friends in India. Seems they like a good pun as much as the British and the Americans.

Individual Police Officers who allowed the Capitol to be damaged by lawbreakers
because they personally sympathise with those lawbreakers
ABSOLUTELY deserve to be fired
one by one
publicly

as its the only way to extract right wing extremism from the rank and file of US law enforcement

@ListeningQuietly

Individual Police Officers who allowed the Capitol to be damaged by lawbreakers because they personally sympathise with those lawbreakers ABSOLUTELY deserve to be fired one by one publicly

as its the only way to extract right wing extremism from the rank and file of US law enforcement

Not just fired, but charged with conspiracy. Let them suddenly start shitting their pants for the chance to be imprisoned for something they can try to claim they knew nothing about, if my memory of federal conspiracy charges is correct.

Although it's worth noting that as long as Trump is POTUS he can just issue a broad pardon to "All those people involved in any situation on January 6th in the Capitol building^.

Much as Jimmy Carter issued a pardon for all draft dodgers.

That Twitter thread by Danna Young is excellent, dreamingbohemian.

The bit at the end really resonated:

This isn't easy. It won't happen overnight. And no we don't WANT to do this because it's exhausting and it sucks. I know. But if we throw our hands up, what happens then?

We just watch as these folks drift off into an abyss that has been manufactured to exploit their intuitions and emotions for someone else's power and profit?... in ways that result in harmful/deadly outcomes for THEM and for DEMOCRACY?

I didn't think so.
x0

Reading material like Danna Young and Melissa Ryan has made me reluctantly decide to engage with friends about whom I've been thinking, "You want to go there? You crack on. I'm way too exhausted to stop you shooting yourself in the head."

Jr is back tweeting and trying to sell his book

The world is laughing at America & Mao, Lenin, & Stalin are smiling. Big tech is able to censor the President? Free speech is dead & controlled by leftist overlords.

In case I’m next stay connected by simply signing up now at DONJR.COM
I’ll let u know where I land.

twitter.com/donaldjtrumpjr/status/1347926393871421445?s=21

This won't be forgotten.

Flags, signs and other items left behind in Capitol riot to be preserved as historical artifacts

I would have thought forensic evidence as well, but apparently not.

thehill.com/homenews/news/533475-flags-signs-and-other-items-left-behind-in-capitol-riot-to-be-preserved-as

Apoligies if this has been posted already but worth a read

Trump’s Legacy: Voters Who Reject Democracy and Any Politics but Their Own

<a class="break-all" href="https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/09/us/politics/trump-voters.html#click=t.co/6y97W9aYZY" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">www.nytimes.com/2021/01/09/us/politics/trump-voters.html#click=t.co/6y97W9aYZY

I agree @PerkingFaintly, I think it's some of the best advice I've seen on this.

I do completely respect the decision not to engage directly with people like this though. I have family members I have given up on, I truly believe they are a lost cause. It's not possible to bring everyone back.

But if you think there's still a way to get through to someone, I think her approach sounds like a good one.

@terrywynne

I do vote though! Even the local elections. I have mainly lived in safe seats for one party or another though so it can be hard to feel it makes much difference.

Yes, it can be hard to remember that we DO make a difference. But even those of us like you who live in 'safe seats' or like me who live in 'blue states' matter. Because we are 'the numbers' that they look at. And it's the numbers that matter. It matters that 80 million voted for Biden, even if a large number of those voters live in blue states. It matters that X million voted for your party's candidates across the UK, even if a lot of those votes were from 'safe seats'. Because it means that they SEE us and that we are growing in numbers.

It was voter apathy and smugness that got Scrotus elected in the first place. People thinking their vote didn't matter because they believed no one would ever vote for Scrotus or that 'they were only one person' so their vote didn't count. But their LACK of a vote certainly did! And so here we are.

Never think your vote doesn't matter. Your vote can be the difference between democracy and dictatorship. Between life and death.

Be involved, be educated, and be a voice, even if you think your voice is crying in the wilderness.

From MSNBC
"The president is in a very fragile mental state right now and he's not taking well to what's happening," Philip Rucker says. "He feels betrayed by his VP ... and a lot of admin. officials are very uncertain about what he might do tomorrow."

Like we should sympathise?

Perking what is DannaYoung's twitter handle do you know? Wouldn't mind following her.
Of course she's right but mentally exhausting to try and deprogramme some of these people I would imagine.

On MN there have been a lot of threads where posters have said their DPs have become huge conspiracy theorists, devoted to QAnon, flat earthers or whatever. Often it goes hand in hand with smoking a lot of weed.

I remember a thread not long ago. The poster was probably going to leave her DH because he was neglecting her, their kids and she just could not get through to him whatever she did

Has anyone else noticed that Trump has taken to talking about himself in the first person plural? "We love you" in that calm-it-down speech of his, and "And we become president and you are the happiest people" in his speech before the actual march on the Capitol have rather bounced out at me.

@AskingQuestionsAllTheTime

Has anyone else noticed that Trump has taken to talking about himself in the first person plural? "We love you" in that calm-it-down speech of his, and "And we become president and you are the happiest people" in his speech before the actual march on the Capitol have rather bounced out at me.

I return again to my point about Monarchs.

He thinks he is King Donald. Which may have arisen from a historical mishearing in the 1990s.