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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think a marriage certificate should be addressed to both people?

155 replies

wealllikespuppies · 07/01/2021 10:29

some background, me and my husband got married last week (just before the lockdown).

received our wedding certificate in the post the other day. we live together, but only one name was written on the envelope - my husband's.

i've emailed them querying this, stating that it seems sexist and that a marriage by definition is a union between two people, so surely it seems a bit silly only to address it to one person? i know it's not a big deal in the grand scheme of things, but it also is a big deal in that it's important, and also, the ceremony (the cheapest one available) cost over £150, so i'd expect the small details to be paid attention to.

I've had a reply this morning, with the ultimate fake apology 'I'm sorry you feel that way'. along with a statement that 'there is not enough space on the envelope to include the names of all parties' and that 'we can't assume one person will take the surname of their husband/wife' (which is contradictory with the fact my husband's surname was used on the envelope, so an assumption has clearly been made).

I've replied stating I feel this isn't really an acceptable excuse, and I've encouraged them to consider my feedback in future correspondence with clients.

I know I am being petty over this but would anyone else find it super annoying and demoralising? I'm going to just let it go but it really has peed me off this morning (and on my day off work as well :'( )

OP posts:
Sosigsandwich · 07/01/2021 11:53

Really?! Is that all you have to be bothered about?! I literally couldn't care, surely what is inside that matters..

Finally2021 · 07/01/2021 11:59

Forgot to say, OP YANBU. It should be addressed to both people. If they only have room to write one name, by tradition marriage certificates go to the bride anyway (presuming a heterosexual marriage) so they're not even following some archaic guideline.

uKu89 · 07/01/2021 12:00

They can’t win. I’ve kept my maiden name so if the had addressed me as Mrs “married name” they would have been wrong and I could have got annoyed about that.

WeAllHaveWings · 07/01/2021 12:00

Would you rather they covered all bases and addressed it "to whom it may concern"?

The nationwide document/system/process/compliance changes to deal with the tiny minority who get "demoralised" by something so petty would run into millions.

I could think of many more important things for tax payers money to be spent on. This is a non issue.

annevonkleve · 07/01/2021 12:07

@ReinventingTheSpiel

This really really doesn't matter.
It really does, it's just symptomatic of society thinking the man is more important.
SimonJT · 07/01/2021 12:08

I wonder who they address it to if two men or two women get married.

Phineyj · 07/01/2021 12:13

Regarding the historical reasons, also important to be able to prove children were legitimate, for inheritance reasons.

Newkitchen123 · 07/01/2021 12:13

Couldn't get worked up with this.
My guess is the envelope will have gone in the bin anyway and the certificate will have gone in a file

SpaceOp · 07/01/2021 12:13

In a situation like this, even though I didn't take DH's name, I wouldn't mind if it came to Mr and Mrs DH Name because they may or may not know I've made a different choice and a woman changing her name is culturally normal in the UK. But to simply remove me from the envelope would absolutely annoy me.

I think we all need to notice and correct these small relentless things in which women are excluded/lminimised/forgotten until eventually the language changes. Good for you OP.

On a lighter note, when we did some building work I did all the interaction with builders, council etc. But the bill was, of course, sent just to DH! Sadly we share all finances so I couldn't even tell him he now had to pay to make up for the patriarchy! Grin

And yy to the national trust - they wouldn't even TALK to me when they rang MY phone because DH had happened to be the one to renew it when he turned up and discovered it had expired so paid on the spot so now his name was the first name, even though phone and other details were still me. Oh, and I think they wanted more money from us. Needless to say, that didn't happen.

EagleFlight · 07/01/2021 12:14

Ours had my name written on the envelope. I’m pretty certain my husband couldn’t have cared less.

TheOrigRights · 07/01/2021 12:16

I do try and address casual sexism if I can. I think it's important.

Just because you care about something doesn't mean you don't have concerns in your life that matter more and I find it really rude for people to sneer.

Yes, I care a lot about e.g the increasing number of people relying on food banks, but I also care that every week my bag of rocket is squashed under my other groceries when I click and collect.

I don't think the OP needs to preface her post by listing all the more worthy concerns she has in her life.

Godimabitch · 07/01/2021 12:19

Depends who their primary contact was. Everything for our wedding came to me because it was me who filled everything out. So mine was the name they knew. I'd have thought they've just picked the first name they have on file. I always thought weddings were stereotypically the womans job.

VinylDetective · 07/01/2021 12:24

Most of it is ingrained into reasonable people by a world that defaults to male. If you don't address the latter, nothing will ever change for women

Things have changed massively for women - unless you think the achievements of several waves of feminism over the last century are “nothing”.

Changi · 07/01/2021 12:25

Why can't they send to to Mr Groom name and Ms Bride name? They have both the names there on the certificate, it's not hard is it?

The assumption that my preferred title is Ms would have annoyed me. A strongly worded letter of complaint would have been written.

SoupDragon · 07/01/2021 12:29

It is clearly institutionalised sexism.

It clearly isn't given several females have said that the certificate was addressed to them.

Deadringer · 07/01/2021 12:34

@MadameMonk

It is clearly institutionalised sexism.

That doesn’t make it ‘National Headlines’, but it does make it worthy of pointing out, and pushing until it’s rectified in line with our culture’s modern expectations.

Anyone who notices it, points it out, and tries to effect change (on MN or elsewhere) is to be commended. Not ridiculed or minimised.

Good on you, OP. And congrats twice over!

This
Cadent · 07/01/2021 12:38

The Stepford wives are out in forces! OP, I get it.

The people telling you this is a non-event are resting on the laurels of women who gave a shit and fought patriarchal crap like this.

VinylDetective · 07/01/2021 12:45

@Cadent

The Stepford wives are out in forces! OP, I get it.

The people telling you this is a non-event are resting on the laurels of women who gave a shit and fought patriarchal crap like this.

The women who gave a shit were a bit too busy fighting for the vote, equal pay and maternity rights among other things to bother with bollocks like this.
Newkitchen123 · 07/01/2021 12:48

@Changi

Why can't they send to to Mr Groom name and Ms Bride name? They have both the names there on the certificate, it's not hard is it?

The assumption that my preferred title is Ms would have annoyed me. A strongly worded letter of complaint would have been written.

Wouldn't have bothered me enough to email but I'm not a Ms either.
StCharlotte · 07/01/2021 12:48

[quote Finally2021]@StCharlotte

I'd love to know the history behind that.

'Marriage lines' or marriage certificates were issued from the mid 18th century onwards. Traditionally it was given to the bride because she needed to be able to prove her martial status. She may have no other way of proving she was married which she might need to either avoid gossip and speculation or to pursue support from her husband if he tried to abandon her. This was especially important if she moved away from the parish they married in. Being able to prove marriage was generally socially and legally more important for women than men.[/quote]
Thank you for that and also to Phineyj for adding to it.

Possibly even more important today with many women retaining their maiden names.

Cadent · 07/01/2021 12:51

@VinylDetective

The women who gave a shit were a bit too busy fighting for the vote, equal pay and maternity rights among other things to bother with bollocks like this.

Yeah right, if you were there then you’d have probably said vote, equal pay are bollocks too Hmm

ArnoldBee · 07/01/2021 12:53

I really couldn't care at the moment - over 1000 people died of Covid yesterday. Registration staff have been deployed to other government departments to support the country in this time of crisis so there are many overworked folks trying to keep the wheels turning and you are moaning about an envelope. Now once this crisis is over and things are back to normal then that is the time to have a discussion about a name on an envelope.

Phineyj · 07/01/2021 12:53

Yes and the issues there can be at borders when travelling with DC with different surname. That's basically the one time I use mine (and occasionally for DBS checks).

stackemhigh · 07/01/2021 12:54

@ArnoldBee that’s bullshit, they have managed to find the time to send OP her cert, so they should bloody well send it to both her and her husband

rosepoet · 07/01/2021 12:56

You are NOT being unreasonable! Things change when enough reasonable people decide the status quo stinks!
How DARE they just ignore you.
Sexism like this has to be resisted. Women used to be property, their possessions became their husband's on marriage. That got changed, too!

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