Ds (13) sobbing uncontrollably about lack of hobbies and talents - where have gone wrong

[looseddaughter]

Ds1 (13) has just gone to bed after a good 90 mins of ranting and sobbing over his perceived lack of hobbies and talents. He was as upset as I have ever seen him and it was horrible.

It started as I told him he'd had enough laptop for the day when he said he was going to his room and he said there was nothing else to do and it spiralled from there. We have had a pretty shit holiday in the sense that we've been in most days (isolated for a week and then obviously not a lot you can do in tier 4) so I don't know if there's an element of boredom after having been pent up but it did seem deeper.

He keep saying whatever he does there are 'people 10 steps ahead of me,' and 'I just want a hobby I can do that I'm good at and enjoy...a talent.' This was all through sobs. To be honest, it's true that he doesn't really have a hobby. He loves reading but only ever wants to do it just before bed, obviously enjoys his laptop and is a history fanatic so uses it for research, documentaries and history- based computer games. He doesn't do lego, likes the odd boardgame and doesn't do any sport except cricket, which was a nightmare last season as despite doing brilliantly in training he had a few nightmare games and did silly things like running himself out. I know he felt shit at the end of the season.

I think he tends to give up on things as soon as they're difficult. He bought some figures, again, history based, last year that needed painting and after the initial enthusiasm he got fed up of how fiddly it was and left it. Same thing happened with model making a couple of years ago. He got really into cycling last year but then seemed to just go right off it - not really sure why. He just gets these initial bursts of enthusiasm and then everything peters into nothingness. It doesn't help that he seems quite limited socially, even Covid aside, and despite having friends in school and telling me about them he rarely interacts with them outside school. Before lockdown never went out with them unless it was a party and now rarely online with them.

He's academically able and in top sets for everything with a real flair I'd say for English and humanities. I don't know if this is part of the problem as in a lot of things come quite easily to him then when something doesn't he just stops. He plays clarinet but has no real enthusiasm for it and moans endlessly about practising but insists he wants to carry on when I ask. Today he was crying about making no progress in it and I did explain (nicely) that he does the bare minimum practice so what does he expect? I was trying to say people with 'talents' or hobbies are prepared to spend hours on them and that's how they get good, which he doesn't do really, aside from cricket, which still didn't go well. He asked for a guitar last year but again had no interest in it really and it has barely been touched for months.

Earlier we'd watched a French crime drama with subtitles because he loves the genre and I casually suggested it as I like them and he's doing French at school. He's in Y9 and getting what the school call 'grades 7-9', so doing really well. However, he got really upset and said he couldn't hear any of the words he was supposed to know. I tried to explain that was to be expected but he kept saying how hard it was then mentioned a boy in his class who gets full marks every time and has apparently read LOTR in French.

I just don't know how to handle this. On the one hand I obviously don't want to pressure him and don't want him comparing himself to others in an unhealthy way, but on the other hand I kind of do think a hobby would do him good and have often felt he could do with sticking at things a bit more but I don't know how to approach it. Cricket is the thing he has devoted most time and energy to and, as I said, it doesn't really seem to have paid off. I was also trying to get across that hobbies aren't necessarily about excelling at something but are about enjoyment, but I think that's hard for him to get, especially where sport is concerned.

I also feel the usual guilt as his dad and I are divorced and I feel that disadvantages him because of living between two houses etc. Dad is a musician but has never got involved with the music practice and I feel ds is keeping it on to please his dad but also won't ask him for help. I don't really have hobbies, or not ones that are active - just things like reading, watching films, travel... not things where I actually do anything so not a good role model. Don't know - feel we have let him down and really don't know how to help.

It sounds like he is very hard on himself. High achievers can be perfectionists and unfortunately this makes trying new things so difficult and anxiety-inducing. Quitting is preferable to failing in that mindset. I am only recently coming to push through this myself and I am 20 years older than him!

It sounds like he needs his self esteem building up, and to perceive failure in a different way. For example Google the company encourage people to try and fail, as they see failure as completely fundamental to success - and that is why they are so innovative because eventually something sticks. Companies that are afraid to try because they might fail never innovate. So trying, and failing, and trying again IS succeeding.

A tip - I was a French geek at school and with films I always put the French subtitles on if I am listening to the French lang version - it helps you pick the words out and you're fitting the speech to the writing as well so it's really helpful. Of course he will never be as good as someone fluent but that's no reason to give up! It's a great skill.

Rather than learning any new hobby right now it sounds like he needs to learn to be kinder to himself and the rest will come.

Good luck OP and your DS!

@Ihatefish my dd sounds very similar to you with her teenage interests- what did you study at university, if you don’t mind my asking? Dd loves both Classical Studies and Biology atm and has your interest in conspiracy theories and Satanism.

@daisypond if you see I listed numerous activists my children dropped because they were “no good at it” my point was if he hasn’t explored all the avenues available to him, how does he know what he is or is not good at?

Absolutely Daisy. Sorry but that poster will cringe at that when her lads are 13 and 15!

My girls did lots of activities at those ages and I also felt pretty smug. Then the epic battle of the violin when dd1 hit 13 and I gave up. Thankfully they both have one thing they genuinely enjoy and still do as teens but comes from them not me.

He seems not to have much self-discipline. So encourage a hobby that he can do as part of a group, and he will hopefully be carried along by the crowd. If he's musical, find a choir for him to join. You can also help him to jump ahead of his peers in languages by sending him on language exchanges. They encourage independence too.

My dc is same age, and of similar interest, music, sport, language, except for history, and pretty good at it. But he does put so much effort into it. Also we have no screen time limit.
If he is quite able, only thing he needs to do is to put more effort into something he loves? And if that's the reason for him to be on the computer, I would let him.
And cartoon in foreign language is good for children, rather than films, ime.

The OP’s son has tried loads of activities, though. But he’s 13. 13 is the age where children often start dropping activities that they have done quite happily for some time.

Maybe also point out to him that humans aren't really meant to be 'global' beings, anything larger that a village is a lot for a person to compete with.
Of course if he Googles a certain hobby, he will be shown the best of the best from the whole of history.

What would he chose to do, if he knew that nobody would ever see, hear or know about it, it was just for his own joy?

Honestly I think the best thing you can do to help him is to keep discussing with him the fact that people who get really good at stuff are the ones who don't get put off by failures and plateaus.

It sounds like he hasn't yet learned about setting himself small targets to complete or perfect as stages along the way to a bigger goal. Milestones that help him feel good about the progress he is making.

Can you encourage him to do something small and manageable?
Maybe take a look at the history book he started writing, pick out the best section and suggest he works on developing that and submitting it to a history website for young historians, or to a history essay prize. Or fictionalise a section of it and sub it to a young authors' prize.

Or maybe he could do a 3 minute history you tube video.

It is so hard for all our DC right now. Life is so disrupted. My DS2 gets emotional and down on himself like this and I find it soothes him if I say: 'The fact you are so upset is proof that this is something you feel very strongly about. That's a good thing because it gives you a clear idea of what changes you need to make in life to feel happier. Let's look at what you are already good at and see what you could do to develop your existing talents and let's also pick a talent you wish you had and see how you can build up some skills for that. You have to break new skills down into small steps and tick off each newly acquired skill week by week, so that you get pleasure out of your progress not frustration.'

I think we do need to actually explain this stuff to some children. It's not instinctive, especially if they have perfectionist natures.

I love the sound of your DS btw. I have a soft spot for boys who love Humanities subjects. It's not as easy for them to see how to excel early on. My DS2 was so down on himself at that age. But he became a brilliant musician through sheer doggedness and has discovered he's a brilliant editor, so edits several magazines, first at school and now at uni. He really enjoys it and gets a kick out of seeing his name in print as editor of increasingly glossy and impressive publications. He also started a blog which is still going since he left it, and contributes short essays to existing bloggers' sites. Bloggers are always looking for guest bloggers to let them off the hook. So maybe your DS could look up some good young historian blogs and offer to guest for them. He needs to understand that his goal is to approach them, not to get accepted by them. If he researches and approaches a blog a week with a suggested guest blog, that's his goal and he should reward himself (you award him with favourite food, a movie night etc) for having achieved that goal. It is SO important that they realise it's their effort not their attainment that will get them the best long term results.

Oh sorry - I had no idea that was so long!

I do find it slightly 🙄 when parents with younger children come up with these bright ideas regarding parenting teens. See it in my friendship group - the family with an older child having some teen issues and parents of younger children “why don’t you just....” when they have absolutely no idea. I am only interested in views of those who have lived through it!

Bless your boy, OP - it's a bloody nightmare at the moment AND there's adolescence on the horizon too. No wonder he's so wound up.

I confess I haven't RTFT, just the first page and skimmed the rest, but I totally agree with the pps who suggested family history. Loads can be done online, masses of helpful research resources, and if he interviewed and recorded older family members about their memories he'd actually be doing something he might find incredibly valuable in later years - I bet many of us wish we'd done this with our grandparents, for example.

As a variant, how about tracing the history of the area, or (if it has any age) even the house where you live? This is a fascinating topic to me and lots of others, and there are local online blogs in lots of places. He could even start one himself.....

I do second getting out of doors too, however. Nothing competitive, just fresh air. It sounds as though he feels very down about comparing himself to others and perceives himself as a lower achiever, which from your description just isn't true - hugs, OP . He needs to relax and feel it doesn't matter what he does as long as he enjoys what he's doing. It shouldn't have to be a yardstick against others.

@Thingsdogetbetter

I don't think that finding a new hobby is going to be the problem. He's already found loads and given them all up. That giving up is the underlying issue you need to address; the fact he gives up when they become difficult. He's a perfectionist and wants to be 'the best' immediately without the effort. He wants immediate, unrealistic results and when they don't happen he quits and moves on to the next idea. Everytime he isn't brilliant immediately, his confidence takes a bashing. It's a really detrimental (and expensive) pattern to get stuck in.

Look up 'fear of failure' and work on his resilience and perfectionism or he'll spend his life chopping and changing and never working hard enough at anything to be good at it.

(Voice of experienced, underachiever with no resistance here.)

This. I’d also look up locus of control - if he thinks he has the power to control and influence things he will try harder.

With cricket he probably has 4 months before the season starts. So If he went out and hit a delivery just 10 times every day (30 days x 4 (months) = c. 120 days) thats 1,200 practice shots he’s got in over anyone else. He could spend 10m a day reading cricket theory if he’s made silly mistakes and he’d have hours of knowledge by the start of the season. It’s the hard graft that helps in anything and that’s the bit he won’t see. (Also everyone make silly mistakes but you only really tend to overthink your own so there’s nothing to stop him having a great season.)

You could also try adding a date ie ‘I’m not good at this (yet). I’m finding this hard (today), I want to quit (for tonight) - it helps keep things open to moving forward.

There is a lot of pressure on children these days including they must have hobbies. When I was a child I went to Brownies, 7-10. My Dad worked shifts, my DM didn't drive and we lived in a village that offered sod all. My Dad grew vegetables, my DM was a school cook but I don't remember cosy Saturday afternoons making cake together. I had no hobbies, I read a lot and as my DM would say I fiddled and potched with things.

As an adult I make cards, I am a competent cook, I volunteer at Brownies and I have a greenhouse and grow veg.

Explain to children that hobbies and interests grow as we get older and there shouldn't be pressure to do things they perceive their friends do to have a fulfilling life. Hobbies and interests are an extension to life.

Does he like animals OP? Would you have time/space for a dog? They can be great company for the teens I think.
I have DD 13 who can be a bit hormonal and can have outbursts when everything is “the worst in the world “ but then can blow over the next day & she’s back on an even keel . It is such a hard time for them all their normal routine has changed & they are cut off from their friends & can’t enjoy their normal things.
She has a horse which has been a god send as she is still out every day &can see her friends on the yard. Horse riding is still allowed to be open & we’ve seen a lot more kids starting lessons. We’ve also got 2 dogs (a rescue & a lab pup) &both my kids get a lot of pleasure from them & gets us out walks together or individually .
My DS is 16,he loves football & is missing his training . He is a gamer & loves films & box sets on Netflix & i worry. He is in his room a lot, We got him some gym equipment that he likes to use to try & help him keep active. He is also doing an online football coaching course set up by the school.
I’ve also tried a few nights of board games which have actually gone down quite well. They like Cluedo& Stranger things monopoly.

Dreading next week when we go back to remote learning as neither of them do as much as they should so am going to try. & set a specific time for it say 1-3 then let them do other things.

All I was thinking if there are things he likes maybe building on them & if you did think of a dog or a pet then lockdown is actually a good time for settling them in xxx

I was an "Arts and Humanities" teen, and it quite suits flitting about. History at that age isn't so much about BETTER as MORE. There's just so damn much of it. You don't need to be interested in great depth to appreciate the vastness of it.

Watch The History Boys with him - history exists in a thousand gobbets of information, not necessarily devoting yourself to one thing.

I was a gamer too, my parents never put any limits on it, and it has plenty of reward and satisfaction for persisting and achieving goals.

@mumontherun14

Does he like animals OP? Would you have time/space for a dog? They can be great company for the teens I think. I have DD 13 who can be a bit hormonal and can have outbursts when everything is “the worst in the world “ but then can blow over the next day & she’s back on an even keel . It is such a hard time for them all their normal routine has changed & they are cut off from their friends & can’t enjoy their normal things. She has a horse which has been a god send as she is still out every day &can see her friends on the yard. Horse riding is still allowed to be open & we’ve seen a lot more kids starting lessons. We’ve also got 2 dogs (a rescue & a lab pup) &both my kids get a lot of pleasure from them & gets us out walks together or individually . My DS is 16,he loves football & is missing his training . He is a gamer & loves films & box sets on Netflix & i worry. He is in his room a lot, We got him some gym equipment that he likes to use to try & help him keep active. He is also doing an online football coaching course set up by the school. I’ve also tried a few nights of board games which have actually gone down quite well. They like Cluedo& Stranger things monopoly.

Dreading next week when we go back to remote learning as neither of them do as much as they should so am going to try. & set a specific time for it say 1-3 then let them do other things.

All I was thinking if there are things he likes maybe building on them & if you did think of a dog or a pet then lockdown is actually a good time for settling them in xxx

Dogs and horses have been the saviour for 14 year old dd but they are a massive privilege not many people have time or money for them particularly atm

Also I don’t know if he has phone or socIal media but that definitely doesn’t help mine with feelings of inadequacy. We talk about it a lot & I would limit social media time if u can ‘ divert him to other things xxx

Also reading LOTR in frnech is just ridiculous. I hope you laughed that off OP.

Of course but there are ways to help look after animals that don’t cost money. I was just asking if he liked animals? Dog walking for a neighbour? Volunteering at a shelter.

I don't think the issue here is finding him a hobby. It sounds like he is intelligent and interested in the world around him e.g. with his interest in history. The issue is his confidence and he is comparing himself to other kids. Why do you think he is doing that? Does he have high expectations of himself? Where does that come from?

I would think about finding a counsellor or emotional support worker for him to talk to before just signing him up to all kinds of new hobbies. There is a deeper issue there that should be explored now whilst he is still young.

[quote Gentianpurple]@Ihatefish my dd sounds very similar to you with her teenage interests- what did you study at university, if you don’t mind my asking? Dd loves both Classical Studies and Biology atm and has your interest in conspiracy theories and Satanism.[/quote]
Hi, I actually did law, but regretted it but it was the direction people good at humanities were pushed in. In hindsight I wish I had done history, philosophy or religious studies (not theology) or potentially psychology.

Although I wasn’t into “Satanism” per se I found the occult extremely interesting because it provided a different way of looking at things. Levay Satanism ie aesthetic satanism which is usually iME what teenagers mean is very different to theological satanism ;which is what people imagine). The former actively rejects the idea of deities (inc the Christian concept of Satan). Your daughter would love Blake, I’m sure (the marriage of heaven and hell would be a great place to start). The Classics are amazing, challenging to put modern minds as they are not predicated on the more modern concept of good v evil.

If she is both scientifically minded and has a love of challenging concepts in the humanities, she is not alone, Newton spent most of his life (when apples weren’t falling on his head -I bet your DD will see the significance of this) trying to create the philosophers stone, Jung and Freud both dabbled to various degrees with the occult -as did Marie curie. The two things aren’t that removed. a lotof dream interpretations share their basis with the classics. Maybe psychology is worth investigating. Hope she finds something she likes.

One of the best things about having such an independent mindset at such a young age is the ability to critically analyse things has become second nature. It in turns means that there is very little likelihood of being led astray as being authentic overrides the need to fit in.

I’m glad the world is still creating enough room for people like your DD and the OPs son to grow.

If he enjoys history are there any online societies he could join - perhaps research family history and then background of his ancestors - or look into places he might like to visit in future - battlefields, Rome, civil war sites, museums etc - or associated with his curriculum.

How about a local history group? Or researching something in history he is interested in and writing about it, could be the history of his school and if he produces something good the school could publish it on their website. A general interest in history is great but it is a huge subject so focusing on something might help.

A fund raising project can offer lots of opportunities, when my DD was his age she raised money for a specific cause. She wrote to sports team, tv programmes, celebrities and asked for an autograph to auction. She actually got lots of stuff back, books, cds, sports things plus the autographs. She set up a data base of who she had written to, what she got back, how much she sold it for and the costs incurred (postage, e bay fees.) Some well known celebrities made personal contact, she ended up in the national papers and gave a talk to her school. Was a great experience and she has a lovely scrap book about it all.

If he likes walks see if there is a local group like a group working on local paths to keep them open.

My main experience is this is a difficult age and it does get easier.....eventually. Good luck.

Something like hiking is more about stamina , understanding terrain/weather and map reading than specific skill. He could plan walks, perhaps develop it into geocaching, orienteering or hill running. Maybe plan to participate in an organised event longer term.