To think it's OK to be a teen mum?

[veganmegan]

NC. I rarely start threads on here but I have a question (hope that's OK). My little sister is seventeen and she welcomed into the world a lovely little boy in November. Since announcing his birth on social media, she received a handful of messages from former "friends" saying "Always knew you were a slag, you'll never get a proper job now, do you even know who the father is" (or words to that effect).

So really fucking abusive bullying behaviour. They also said something about her now having to move to a council estate (?) and about "babies shouldn't have babies" (which I guarantee is just a direct quote from someone's judgemental parent).

They're also teenagers so I'm not necessarily holding it entirely against them (as you say all sorts of silly stuff when you're young) but given they're pretty middle class kids who I don't think have even met someone from a council estate, or a teen mum other than my sis, I'm wondering where all of these preconceived stereotypes come from.

She's decided to block them now after my convincing so hopefully there won't be any more online bullying, but I'm wondering who thinks these things? Where does this idea come from? Is this an idea you instil in your own kids, if you're a parent?

I just really feel for her if I'm honest. She's so happy to have her wee baby, but people continuously perceive her as a "slag" solely because she had a baby young. I don't even really know how to support her, just really pisses me off and simultaneously upsets me on her behalf.

Support yes, enable no.

What does "enabling" mean to you?

Wheresmykimchi To the letter, not entirely probably but girls were in established relationships before they slept with their partners. They’re with them still. The older one is marrying him when Covid19 allows.
Our son joined the forces and has perhaps had more peer pressure from 18. He’s into long term relationship and commitment too though and engaged to be married. I wouldn’t think he’d been saintly but a romantic, long term partner at heart.
Yes they knew about contraception and the girls were on the pill from a young age for period control. They knew where to seek support and MAP, if ever needed from a GP friend they trust. I hope they’d have told me; they said they would have done. We’ve always been very open and firm in our expectations around education and attainment and not been disappointed.
They agree with our stance on casual sex, promiscuity and feckless parenting. Definitely all of a view that every child deserves to be planned and wanted.

Biologically it is a good age to reproduce - nice fresh eggs, energy and strength for nurturing, wider family still young enough to support her.

She may be free of children by the time she is mid-30s and that is a good time to pick up her education and enjoy decades of career, if that is what she wants.

The fact that the pendulum has swung in the direction of delaying children till education completed and career established does not alter the fact that biologically it makes no sense at all: tired old eggs, reduced fertility, emotionally torn between children and career.

Maybe your dear sister has got it right!

They agree with our stance on casual sex, promiscuity and feckless parenting.

So I agree with not having children in circumstances where you can't support them (e.g. financially, emotionally etc) but your views on promiscuity seem harmful to me, if I'm honest. I don't think young people should be pushed into conforming to any sexual expectation, whether that's having a ton of sexual partners or none.

Maybe your dear sister has got it right!

She'd like to think so

I'm not really sure how her age and becoming pregnant can then make her branded as a slag! So nasty. I was young too, she is going to be just fine I am sure of it. It is so sad that people can happily be so rude and cruel to others. In a few years time when she is making friends with other mums and enjoying her little darling she will be confused why these people ever bothered her. She seems to have a great sister looking out for her too!

My MIL was 17 when she had my partner, she now has two grandchildren at the age of 46 and loving it!!

**Also I have a question -- for those who said they would be devastated (or words to that effect) by their child becoming a teen parent, what would your actual practical actions be?

I would tell my daughter what it’s like honestly. I would ask if she thinks she can do it, tell her how much strength it takes and how you struggle to find work as a teenager with no work experience and a baby you need to work around.

If she then wanted to keep a baby I would support her but I wouldn’t be raising a child for her, I would expect her to raise her baby like I did. I would be upset because I think you miss out on things. I know people can say you can still travel/get educated later but it’s more the carefree and selfish attitude you can never get back. Travel, education, recreation - it all comes second to my kids, and has done my entire adult life. That’s how it is if you’re a mum, I think. But I’d like my kids to have a chance to do things totally for themselves before they think about settling down to a family.

YANBU I have never understood why younger mums get such a hard time.

If DD had a baby in her late teens I would be nothing but happy for her and totally supportive.

I hope it is OP.
I was a teen mum - very young. I was pregnant at 14, and had my first son when I was 15.
Got married at 16, and had 3 children before I was 20.

22 years later, I am still married to the most amazing man. We have 6 lovely children.

I did a degree with the OU, completed my PGCE and am in my second year of teaching.

Good luck to your sister

@CherryRoulade

Wheresmykimchi To the letter, not entirely probably but girls were in established relationships before they slept with their partners. They’re with them still. The older one is marrying him when Covid19 allows. Our son joined the forces and has perhaps had more peer pressure from 18. He’s into long term relationship and commitment too though and engaged to be married. I wouldn’t think he’d been saintly but a romantic, long term partner at heart. Yes they knew about contraception and the girls were on the pill from a young age for period control. They knew where to seek support and MAP, if ever needed from a GP friend they trust. I hope they’d have told me; they said they would have done. We’ve always been very open and firm in our expectations around education and attainment and not been disappointed. They agree with our stance on casual sex, promiscuity and feckless parenting. Definitely all of a view that every child deserves to be planned and wanted.

I like the fact that they knew they could come to you.

can I just say: puberty and menopause: not a good idea to have at the same time. not a problem if you are a yonger mum. also you will have more energy, and potentially have a younger grandparent. (kids gran is 90 this year. they are still teen/preteen. their great gran was a victorian, the lad she was keen on died in WW1, three generations having children in mid to late thirties, though not through choosing to wait)

@BlackeyedSusan

can I just say: puberty and menopause: not a good idea to have at the same time. not a problem if you are a yonger mum. also you will have more energy, and potentially have a younger grandparent. (kids gran is 90 this year. they are still teen/preteen. their great gran was a victorian, the lad she was keen on died in WW1, three generations having children in mid to late thirties, though not through choosing to wait)

You can also not synchronise puberty and menopause by choosing to have a child older — I will be through with menopause by the time DS hits puberty.

And I can’t feel that closely-packed generations are necessarily a good thing — DH had living great-grandparents well into adulthood because three impoverished generations had large numbers of children very young, largely because of lack of available contraception.

YANBU I have never understood why younger mums get such a hard time.

I think in a number of cases it's because they're not in a financial position to support themselves. They haven't built a career...they haven't finished their education and babies have needs that they're not able to provide. They haven't lived life, before they have the responsibility of a life.

It's also because they will not have support in many cases and I know this can be the case with older mums, but they're better placed to deal with it emotionally and are more mature.

We see how young mums have their lives change so much, yet the young dads carry on as normal...nights our...continuing with their education....no ties...no restrictions.

Girls OTOH are quite literally left holding the baby.

Way back when I was younger a friend got pregnant...as a teen and her mum was distraught to the point she spoke of taking her own life...but there were also cultural/community issues here.

It wasn't so much that sge was a teenager...but that she wasn't married...as she was of a legal age to be married without parental consent.

I got pregnant at 17 and had only slept with one guy, my long term boyfriend at the time. I was called all sorts of things hoare slut slag etc . Strange though as most of the people calling me those names were have sex with multiple partners a week, unprotected. Yet it was me that was deemed the slut I hasten to add that I don't think having multiple sexual partners is wrong it's just that at the time I couldn't understand why I was treated that way and their behavior didn't even raise an eyebrow

My sister got pregnant at 17 by the same boy she's been with for 5 years and is still with to this day they have a beautiful 2 year old daughter who is probably the best thing to happen to this family.

I got pregnant at 19 I am now 20 with a 5 week old little girl and she is my world and I love her so much

There's nothing wrong with being a young mum and people shouldn't be judged for it. Unless obviously there like 14 15

For me I'd feel devastated if my DD thought the best she could do for herself at 17 was tie herself down with a baby. There's a whole world out there and so many better things for a 17 year old to be doing with their youth.

So to sum up, being a teen Mum is OK for some girls. It’s not OK for others. Kind of like anything in life. I suspect we all know which category would be right for ourselves and/or our DDs.

Nobody should be trolling or hurling abuse.

Veganmegan Our views on promiscuity are that it is high risk for individuals and for society. We raised our children with no wishes washy ‘whatever’ notion on this.
Far too many young women have died of cervical and other cancers spread through HPV transmission.
Far too many women have become infertile due to STDs going untreated.
Far too many women have been assaulted and raped when placing themselves in vulnerable positions.
Far too many young men find themselves on sexual assault charges because they are confused when lying in bed with a naked girl stroking them but can’t see that isn’t isn’t her giving consent.
Far too many young girls under the influence of alcohol wander off up alleys, in parks or cars for ‘a cuddle’ that then goes too far against their will.
Far too many pregnancies from immature or non existent relationships that leave children vulnerable and disadvantaged.

Yes, promiscuity has a price that is usually paid by women and children. It’s not a price we wanted our daughters to pay.

@CherryRoulade

Veganmegan Our views on promiscuity are that it is high risk for individuals and for society. We raised our children with no wishes washy ‘whatever’ notion on this. Far too many young women have died of cervical and other cancers spread through HPV transmission. Far too many women have become infertile due to STDs going untreated. Far too many women have been assaulted and raped when placing themselves in vulnerable positions. Far too many young men find themselves on sexual assault charges because they are confused when lying in bed with a naked girl stroking them but can’t see that isn’t isn’t her giving consent. Far too many young girls under the influence of alcohol wander off up alleys, in parks or cars for ‘a cuddle’ that then goes too far against their will. Far too many pregnancies from immature or non existent relationships that leave children vulnerable and disadvantaged.

Yes, promiscuity has a price that is usually paid by women and children. It’s not a price we wanted our daughters to pay.

Your stance on this is worrying.

All of these situations where women are raped involve the women being to blame in some form or another or a man being 'confused'.

@CherryRoulade

Veganmegan Our views on promiscuity are that it is high risk for individuals and for society. We raised our children with no wishes washy ‘whatever’ notion on this. Far too many young women have died of cervical and other cancers spread through HPV transmission. Far too many women have become infertile due to STDs going untreated. Far too many women have been assaulted and raped when placing themselves in vulnerable positions. Far too many young men find themselves on sexual assault charges because they are confused when lying in bed with a naked girl stroking them but can’t see that isn’t isn’t her giving consent. Far too many young girls under the influence of alcohol wander off up alleys, in parks or cars for ‘a cuddle’ that then goes too far against their will. Far too many pregnancies from immature or non existent relationships that leave children vulnerable and disadvantaged.

Yes, promiscuity has a price that is usually paid by women and children. It’s not a price we wanted our daughters to pay.

I totally agree, the cervical cancer thing is so played down and the HPV virus transmits so easily, not pleasant when treatment is needed.

CherryRoulade

I don’t think a lot of the teen moms are promiscuous. I would suggest the ones who have ONS are not the ones who end up having babies in their teens.

I would think the ones who go on to have babies as teens are the ones who have long term partners/bfs or are married

Who has the energy once you have a baby😊

Far too many young men find themselves on sexual assault charges because they are confused when lying in bed with a naked girl stroking them but can’t see that isn’t isn’t her giving consent.

This is victim blaming. You need to understand consent and communication prior to having sex, or you are sexually abusive - "being confused" isn't an excuse.

People make all sorts of assumptions. I'd be 'devastated' if my DC became a terrorist or a serial killer. Or even a judgeypants hurling online abuse at random strangers for their life choices.
Teen mum? Not so much.

@CherryRoulade

Veganmegan Our views on promiscuity are that it is high risk for individuals and for society. We raised our children with no wishes washy ‘whatever’ notion on this. Far too many young women have died of cervical and other cancers spread through HPV transmission. Far too many women have become infertile due to STDs going untreated. Far too many women have been assaulted and raped when placing themselves in vulnerable positions. Far too many young men find themselves on sexual assault charges because they are confused when lying in bed with a naked girl stroking them but can’t see that isn’t isn’t her giving consent. Far too many young girls under the influence of alcohol wander off up alleys, in parks or cars for ‘a cuddle’ that then goes too far against their will. Far too many pregnancies from immature or non existent relationships that leave children vulnerable and disadvantaged.

Yes, promiscuity has a price that is usually paid by women and children. It’s not a price we wanted our daughters to pay.

This is an extremely dangerous attitude. Sorry but it has to be said. Men on sexual assault charges because they were confused? You haven't a clue, sorry. And victim blaming girls for their assaults? You really should be ashamed at yourself.

@veganmegan

Far too many young men find themselves on sexual assault charges because they are confused when lying in bed with a naked girl stroking them but can’t see that isn’t isn’t her giving consent.

This is victim blaming. You need to understand consent and communication prior to having sex, or you are sexually abusive - "being confused" isn't an excuse.

Quite.

And drunk girls 'wandering up the alley' .