To think that families who construct their lifestyle around two incomes are living very precariously?

[Circumlocutious]

I’m talking situations where the two incomes are absolutely essential to paying the mortgage and bills. A situation where there is no ‘give’, no flexibility: what if there is a chronic illness in the family, one person can no longer work, school closures (well, you’re seeing it now)? Isn’t this a precarious way to live?

I get that sometimes there may be no other choice, especially when saving up for mortgage. But often it seems like people’s lifestyle - the house they choose to buy, the size of their mortgage, the area they live in, their cars, the schools they pay to send their children to - have adapted to fit around two full incomes, even when they could have made different choices. Many people live fancy lifestyles with no room for error. They can’t scale back their spending without making major changes, eg moving house, which are harder to do once you’re used to your current lifestyle.

AIBU to say that more couples should aim to contain family spending to the level of one earning partner? Is this unrealistic?

We have two incomes but I have a chronic illness that could go tits up at any time. We’ve chosen to keep the smaller house in a crapper area to ensure we could service the mortgage if (when) I can’t work. I’d love to tell you that we’ve saved all the rest but actually we just go on shit loads of holidays in normal times. But those could be trimmed and we could still afford the house if it had to happen. Is that sort of what you mean?

I know what you mean op, everyone wants the best they can afford and we are encouraged by mortgage lenders to borrow what we can and get the best property without our reach.

However, when the chips are down, most of us are also able to respond in a practical manner.

When I lost my job we downsized our mortgage by moving, sold our car and halved monthly out-goings...

I think most people now can't afford property on a single wage anyway so it isn't a choice.

@Hoppinggreen

If you have a choice it’s ideal to base things on one income, we do, everything I earn is a bonus. However, it’s not possible for everyone to do the same

Is everything your partner earns a bonus compared to your income too? If not surely you're not much less precarious as you'd be ok if you lost your job but still screwed if he lost his.

Most families I know do need both incomes to live even a modest lifestyle (I do live in the south east though). They would have to live a very meagre lifestyle indeed to live on one income (all one income families I personally know also recieve benefit top ups as they couldn't manage alone)

My in laws relied on one person to provide all the money with my fil working 3 jobs at times. At 75 he is done, can't walked between rooms without a stick (compared to mil who hasn't worked since she was 29 and is fit as a fiddle.

No thanks, we will share the burden of financing our family and lifestyle.

On the contrary - being dependent on one income to prevent destitution is reckless!

Why should people not have the things they want if the income is available?

I do see where you're coming from OP. When we bought our house we could have bought something much nicer, however as it stands we could easily afford the mortgage on one person's income. It gives me peace of mind that we wouldn't have to move house if one of us was out of work.

Damn. I’m a single parent. There’s only me. That’s something else I’m failing at. Well fuck.

Ok so if you’re saying it’s preferable to live within your means and not stretch finances for unnecessary lifestyle choices when it would put you in a risk situation if anything should happen - then no YANBU but in real life people simply cannot scale their lives back to the point where it fits within one wage.

What about those who live in areas with high property prices? Is their only option to move away to be able to comfortably afford a mortgage on one wage?

I think you have a genuine thought process in saying sometimes people stretch themselves so far for unnecessary lifestyle choices and it becomes very precarious - but the reality is most people aren’t stretching themselves for designer bags and luxury cars, they are stretching because life is bloody expensive. Property is expensive - utilities, food...

Budgeting is always a good idea and cutting your cloth to suit is of course preferable but believing people always have this choice is pretty entitled and short sighted sorry

I personally don’t under families who are on joint incomes of 60k or 70k per year but still say they struggle.
They must live beyond their means. A family should comfortably live on 4K per month net pay.
My family isn’t on anything like that.

OP makes no sense. We have two incomes so if anything happens to one of us, we still have one earner and we can live off one income if needed. Also pensions, paying for children through uni, etc

I dont get your question. If there is "no give" situation then that dual income family wont be doing it in order to have a fancy lifestyle?

Both parties would have worked individually before starting a family. Many pool resources so that they can have a child, extra room, garden etc.

Well I live alone so clearly I'm screwed! Should that mean I never buy a house (I did), have a car, go on holiday?

We both don't earn enough on our own to support a household. I like to have food and clothes and heating.

By your logic then isn’t it foolish for you both to only work part time when you could have full time jobs and more security??

I’d love to be able to live off one income. Sadly life doesn’t always work the way you want it.
YANBU for saying people should spend within their means, YABVU thinking that one income alone is sufficient for most to live on. Have you seen house prices lately?

I'm single. Should I be trying to live on half my salary, then? I'm sure we don't really need to eat every day.

I'll join the pp in the failure section!

YABU. We both work full time in NHS - 30 years plus each, several post grad qualifications- so good wages (50 - 60k) but not millionaires. Great Ts & Cs - sick pay, no chance of being paid off (I wish!!). We’ve worked hard for it and DC are now young adults. Mortgage paid off in 11 months then hopefully semi retirement. We’ve never had any debts except mortgage and one car loan because we spend our money wisely and live within our (comfortable) means. I know we are fortunate but as I say, we’ve both worked incredibly hard for it.

This is not a stealth boast - the point I’m making is it depends on people’s circumstances. Things would’ve been different if we’d had jobs without good sick pay, pension etc. So you can’t make sweeping judgements about 2 income families. Also, you do realise that some families have two adults out of work.

You never know what's round the corner so it's best to be prepared... we could just about live on one salary ( we earn roughly the same amount). We'd have to scale back on a few things like large internet package, Spotify, prime, Netflix, takeaways. There would not be enough left to save much/cover for any emergencies but doable. We have life and critical illness cover if it was long term.. yes we could have a bigger house, newer cars, holidays every year but would prefer the peace of mind on not relying on 2 salaries to survive.

I agree with you OP. During the first lockdown, I had many friends freaking out because they weren’t getting their usual income and saying ‘we have a HUGE mortgage.’

One of my best friends lives in a very very large house and her mortgage is 7k a month. Not to mention the cars, maintaining said house, and the monthly Next bill (no joke, she buys all the designer gear from Next because of next day delivery!). Her husband was made redundant a few years ago and they were panicking because they could only keep afloat for a few months before the cards came tumbling down.

I think a lot of it is keeping up with the Jones. I’m also guilty of it. We value possessions so much as a society. When I was a child, we had one landline, one tv, one car, one computer etc what was considered luxury is now necessity and both adults in a relationship work for the ‘basics’.

I’ll never be able to buy a house. I’m a council house. Guess I’m failing double style.

I meant to add - I really don’t like my current job but will stick it out until mortgage paid off so I can then go part time in a different role. People do what they need to - in my case - what I am willing to put up with for a short period of time.

I read an interesting book a few years ago, on this subject called The Two Income Trap. It explored the trappings of having two incomes (or rather, being reliant on two incomes). With only one income, if that income provides enough wealth for housing and living costs, as incomes did 40-50 years ago, families can actually have more flexibility. Where jobs were 'for life' or at least more permanent than they are now, the job losses/life crises would be fewer. And if they happened, the second partner (ok, the woman) could go to work. This was actualised in my DH's family when my FIL lost his job in heavy industry in the early 80s and my MIL went to work in early years education and picked up the bills for a couple of years.

We could live without DHs salary, but would be screwed without mine. As a result we have savings, pensions and life insurance to cover the unexpected. These things were less of a priority for my ILs in the 80s.