3 yo wakes for the day at 2/3 am. Fucking hate my life

[HateLife21]

DC3 has ASD. Always been a shit sleeper. Only sleeps for 6-7 hours max per night. Doesn't nap. Last few weeks has been exhausted and asleep by 7.30. Then wide awake by 2.15 am. Might go back to sleep after 6 until about 8.30. That's it. We co-sleep as they get so distressed about being alone they vomit. Tonight has been violently rocking on the bed since 3am. (Gave Calpol and milk at 2.30 in the hope they'd settle).

I can't do this anymore. I hate my life. I really resent DC. Biggest regret of my life having them.

Not sure what my AIBU is, sorry. Just can't go on.

Not a long term solution but would circumstances allow you to go to bed with him for a week or so? Just to reset you and relieve some of the torture of not sleeping? Even if you got 7-1 ish. Not ideal I know. Totally understand your DPs frustration at insomnia having had it before. However again if he's awake could he have DC early hours and you could let him go back to bed in day?

Op I'm sorry your feeling like shit.
My now 10 year old didn't sleep more than few hours a night till she was around 5

Looking bak I don't actually know how the frig we got thru it.

The crippling exhaustion and having to get up and do it all again every single day nearly broke me.

We tried all the things your doing including later evenings walks in the warmer weather but it just resulted in a screaming exhausted child after 3pm making life hell.

We changed eating times etc etc to fill her up and we did give on advice from gp piriton on occasion but it only helped a little and we didn't want to make it normal.

It's so friggin hard.

My dc now sleep and I'm awake most mornings from 3 am regardless of how late I go to bed.

I swing from that to literally being up all night and missing a whole nights sleep. It's knackering

for you

I appreciate as your son has autism it may not help, but would he listen to a story? We have lots of Julia donaldsons on I dunno, audible, or books app & they’re allowed to choose one. No ASD but a 3yo who frequently gets up at 3am this stops them shouting & often sends them back off, altho getting the volume right is key.

Sleep deprivation turns you into a complete wreck. Calpol isn't a sleeping remedy unless your child is actually in pain.

Do you work in the daytime OP or is your DD in daycare? I just wondered what is happening in the daytime. What routine changes have you tried?

In my family, sometimes my DC are weary from.being awake but NOT tired properly. Some kids really need hours and hours of proper exercise to make them tired enough to sleep a sensible night.

If by some miraculous chance your DP are a SAHP, and you have not already tried this, my best suggestion is to try HUGE amounts of daytime fresh air and exercise. My DS is 23 months, and on days he walks and runs at least 3 miles, I get a better night out of him. The more exercise the better, and it HAS to be outdoors where he can run and get sunlight and fresh air. Otherwise he bounces out of bed at 4am.

Also my DS needs 4 meals a day not three. He has a snack at teatime and another meal when his dad comes home from work, just before (or sometimes just after, not ideal) DS' bathtime.

Also consider food intake - he could have a food sensitivity, maybe to food colourings, making him over active.

I agree with splitting the dose. The natural melatonin spike is late afternoon so giving it more in keeping with usual physiological spike is worth a try.

Silly I do think time outdoors makes a slight difference and we've been cooped up lately as the weather has been so awful. DC won't walk or run around really but does love the swings at the pArk and we have a trampoline in the garden (although it is snow covered right now). Will make a big effort to spend some time outdoors today

Lots of children on the spectrum really struggle to to sleep. This is a really hard situation and you have my sympathies. Could you be referred to the Early Help Hub? The Council has a new Children's Wellbeing Service in some areas, and Barnardo's offers support to families with children on the spectrum. You could also ask to be referred to a paediatrician for help with sleep. Also, are you getting adequate down time? Best of luck.

I really feel for you, I've been there with the ASD toddler seemingly never needing to sleep. It's absolute torture and it's no wonder you're hating things right now.

If you just wanted to vent then please ignore the next bit. If you're interested in some ideas to help, then carry on.

Can I ask how long DC naps for during the day? With a wake up that early it seems like they might be better off not napping at all to add those hours onto the night.

I had a similar problem and the first thing that I did was to ban naps. It was really awful for about a week but then they got used to it. So at danger times I would make sure that we were out, stimulating environment etc. If they looked like they were drifting off in the buggy I would insist that they got out and walked. It sounds mean but it's better for both you and them to solve this problem so that they've got a better rested parent who can do more with them rather than a sleep deprived zombie.

After they got used to the no nap situation I gradually (10-15 minutes at a time) pushed back bedtime so as to extend the sleep at the other end of the night.

It might also be worth thinking about what actually wakes them up at that time. Are they cold? Need a wee? Bad dream? Hungry? If you can work it out then you might be able to remove the waking trigger. I realised that my little one was waking when he did a wee in his nappy, so I was able to limit liquids before bed and dream wee him, which let him sleep longer.

I had some limited success with the Wake to Sleep method too, it's worth a quick internet search.

Sorry for the essay, but I've spent way too long optimising sleep, as you can probably tell.

And my DC is now 5. He still wakes early but it's 5.30am rather than 4am and these days he takes himself downstairs for a bit of quiet screen time rather than waking me some days! It will get easier (eventually).

Your 3yo has probably reached the stage of being too old to nap but too young to stay up long enough to go to bed at 7. It is a difficult age even for NT kids.

Do you get any respite, do they go to nursery etc? Or are you at work during this time?

Cross post with NYC

I used to do the same with dd. She had this default that if she woke up from a nap, she wouldn’t go to sleep again until 4 hours after she awoke, whatever time she napped. So I tried very very hard to keep her awake.

We had this with our son who was diagnosed with autism as a teen. It was hell, so I can sympathize. He hasn't lasted forever and whilst he now still doesn't sleep much, he c

I have 3DC, two of whom have ASD. Sending you a hug. It's really hard.

CBeebies radio on BBC Sounds is good for occupying non sleepers who can't use screens while you snooze. Using an iPad/tv for those that do is absolutely ok in my book and I do this often. Agree with others on time outside and gradually keeping him up a little later with soothing activities such as long baths, long story times, familiar films etc. If he likes stories, reading out loud from a book that you also like is a good choice. My littlest ones want to hear my voice and experience 'story time' in the night and it can be good to read a book suitable for older kids. No distracting pictures and slightly less horrific for you - Harry Potter, Dragons etc.

You cannot pour from an empty cup...

I know it's not ideal but can you change your sleep pattern to match theirs so that you are getting more rest? I know it means no child free evenings for you but it might get you some time to sleep in the short term.

What you do to help yourself cope with this? For me it's also daily time outside and daily excersize. A daily run/walk helps me deal with stress and be much calmer and more fun with the children. It also gives me a tiny bit of a break away from them which is good for all of us.

You DH needs a talking to. In the short term, he has to take turns with you doing the night shift and in the longer term to help you figure out an answer to the problem. He needs to do some daytime childcare so that you can rest. You know all this I'm sure.

Put a tv in their room? Literally do anything to make your life easier here. Go in, turn it on and leave? Biscuits and milk?

Anything you can so you can go back to sleep.

Sorry...he now sorts himself out. He used to get up and play or watch TV whilst one of us dozed on the sofa. I tried fighting it at the time but it didn't work, he would not go back to sleep! So I just wanted to reassure you that it will get better with your son too, it isn't forever. Honestly though, I used to have some terrible thoughts about my son when we were in the thick of it. It is a case of giving in and working out coping strategies.

Hello op, I totally feel for you. My first child is now almost 8 and about to finally get his asd diagnosis. He has always been just like you describe, since the actual day he was born. His consultant has made us fill in a sleep diary and she is going to prescribe Melatonin. Apparently kids with asd struggle falling asleep and this is because they lack melatonin. I'm hoping it will be life changing. Definitely ask about it.

Sorry just read your update.

Have you had a social care assessment? It should have been done automatically under section 17 Children Act 1989. You could try asking for respite care.

I will add that my youngest had a phase of sleeping terribly when she had trouble with her ears and my gp told me to give her piriton, he did say he wouldn't prescribe it as it was not supposed to be for sleep but he said she was fine to take it and might reset us all. It did and she slept so well, after a few nights stopped and she was sleeping better. Have a word with your gp it sounds like you're desperate.

Sorry about this OP.

I agree with JacktomyDaniel you and DH could split the hours between you.
One parent gets the same sleep as DC3, and will be able to get up with them in the early morning.
The other parent looks after the other children in the evening, does agreed housework, and sleeps until a normal get-up time.

We did this for nearly a year as our youngest DS got up at 4.30 every morning. I went to bed at 8pm with him and got up early (quietly) and was in charge of mornings and school run. DH would get up at 8.30 am and go to work, and be in charge of the children in the evening and not wake me up. It worked for us.
But before we worked this out we were desperate and I couldn't believe there was no-one to help... I sometimes felt like running away or throwing the children out the window when they woke me AGAIN.

Soon you will be able to explain to DC3 that they need to occupy themself and play quietly if awake while everyone is asleep. They will be able to use the iPad or read books independently as time goes on.

Work out a plan with your DH before you both implode

for you

OP I sympathise with you. It's hellish. Our DS2 had ASD undiagnosed and never slept. We existed on 1-3 unbroken hours' sleep a night for years and years. It broke my spirit, changed my personality. It's used as torture for a reason.

If I had my time again I would take it more seriously and not endure it. It might be worth going to the GP. Really overstate the trauma of sleep deprivation and ask if they can prescribe melatonin or another safe sleep medication for use 3-4 times a week so you get a few unbroken nights. Or you and your partner can take it in turns to sleep with your DC and the other one sleep in the child's bedroom, having taken Nytol or similar. Daytime is so much more bearable if you've had unbroken sleep.

Eventually I said to DS - as soon as he was old enough to understand: You are awake but I am not. I get very very grumpy if I don't get enough sleep. I need sleep. You must not wake me up until my alarm goes off. I used to set up something for him to play with by low lamplight ( he loved duplo and plasticene with all the mechanical machines you can mash it through) along with a snack (usually untouched - he hated eating!) and a drink. It didn't give me a big break but maybe an extra 30-40 minutes in the night.

PP's idea of a weighted blanket is good. Wish I had tried that.

@HateLife21

We've been prescribed melatonin but it only helps with the initial falling asleep which isn't a problem as DC is exhausted. So it's no use whatsoever.

Have told GP in the past how much I'm struggling. He just said he really sympathised but there's not much out there in terms of support

Oh bloody hell.

I really , really sympathise.

You have to get sleep...As others have said, sleep deprivation is a form of torture.

You desperately need help, if you do something drastic, it won't help your children at all.

It must be wretched and utter hell.

There must be something that can be done?

Even respite care? Just so you can get some much needed sleep??

Is there no relatively safe sedative drug that can be prescribed to make a child sleep?.Even short term so you can get some healing sleep?

OP, please talk to your GP about Melatonin. My DS used to be the same. Now he has a dose of Melatonin at night and sleeps through until 7 am the next day when I wake him up.

It was a life-saver for us. And it’s completely natural.

My DC is the same, a lot older than yours but never slept longer than 3 hours a night. Trust me as they get older it gets easier , there is other medication other than melatonin you have to really really really push for it.

@EdwardCullensBiteOnTheSide

I will add that my youngest had a phase of sleeping terribly when she had trouble with her ears and my gp told me to give her piriton, he did say he wouldn't prescribe it as it was not supposed to be for sleep but he said she was fine to take it and might reset us all. It did and she slept so well, after a few nights stopped and she was sleeping better. Have a word with your gp it sounds like you're desperate.

Phenergan was used by my family for travel sickness. It had a calming effect, too.

I just googled 'Phenergan' and it is an anti histamine {!} .It used to be in syrup form.

It worked for car sickness. Maybe as we were asleep!

OP, I really feel for you! I have been there. My DS was the same and I didn’t think I was going to survive it. He is 13 now and it turns out he has severe ADHD. Our GP prescribed melatonin and phenergan syrup. Changed our life! The melatonin helped him fall asleep, the phenergan kept him asleep. It was a total game changer. Phenergan is just an over the counter antihistamine and he was only on it for a few weeks, it somehow reset his clock and he was soon able to sleep through without it. We still have phases where he has sleep issues and we always have a bit of phenergan in the cupboard to help him sleep if and when he needs it. The melatonin doesn’t keep them asleep unfortunately, it just helps them fall asleep. Chat to your GP about phenergan. As I said, it is available over the counter but as your little one is so young it would be a good idea to discuss it with a Doctor first. Really hope this helps you! It changed our lives. Mine and my son’s. The lack of sleep was hurting him as much as it was hurting me.