To think that many people don't realise the Christmas bubbles of 3 households have to be the same for each of the 3 households?

[Planetzog]

From conversations I've had, and from what I've read on here, I think there's still loads of (understandable) confusion around the Christmas bubble concept. So household A might be meeting 2 other households between 23rd and 27th, perhaps lunch with household B on Christmas day, then drinks with household C on Boxing Day. But while households B and C both count A as one of their households, they don't know each other and have a different third household each - D and E. Sorry, complicated but can't think of a clearer way of describing what I mean.
Anyway, my point is that the repercussions of Christmas could end up being worse than expected as even more households get together over Christmas as they don't understand that the 3 households should be fixed? I've looked up the gov guidelines and they are not clear at all.

YABU - Everyone understands that Christmas bubbles are fixed with the same 3 households.

YANBU - People are choosing their own differing bubbles as described above.

It does seem a bit stupid to me that there's no cap on the total number of people who can meet at once though. People could potentially be crammed in like sardines.

Yanbu. Other countries like Germany keep it simple by saying you can have x number of extra people in our house at Christmas.

If my household decided to bubble with my MIL and my aunt and uncle, that would be 3 households. But my MIL would also want to bubble with my BIL and SIL and my SIL would want to bubble with her own family members.

@Theterrorrun

I think the roles are not unclear, but the reality of interconnected human relationships is such that working out how it applies in your circumstances can be complex and confusing. Many people are genuinely getting muddled and others are suiting themselves. If we did what we normally do, the chain would amount to at least 16 households and probably nearly as many again from interactions from other people within those households (obviously we are not doing anything remotely like that and have made quite big sacrifices to stay within the rules).

Exactly, hence my venn diagram that I have just posted.

Even if these people will be mixing with one extra family over Xmas, it'll still be less of a mix than what is going on schools so this spike people keep talking about .... won't happen

Yet another Covid Police thread though. Surely MN should move every single one of these to the Covid board so the rest of us don't have to keep suffering them

@WillSantaBeComingToTown

Just bore off

This is yesterdays news

If you want to be the self righteous covid police then fine with you own family but I am sick to detha of people who think that it is their mission in life to inform the ignorant because they are superior.

Why not concentrate on your own life?

Attention seeking through public information threads to make you feel above everyone else is unnecessary.

Ah - the typical cry of the Lockdown-Extender.

With this virus, my actions affect you and vice versa. So the OP is absolutely entitled to point out something that many either don’t understand or who are wilfully ignoring as “they are applying their own judgement”

This utterly appalling government should absolutely be held to account for their incompetence in managing this situation, but even if they had played a blinder and done it all right, in the case of a virus, individual responsibility is essential too. Many are choosing to ignore this either complaining that government are controlling (where something is made illegal) or by not following guidance (as it’s not the law)

This attitude will dramatically worsen this crisis by increasing cases and deaths which will result in more lockdowns and the economy will be even more screwed.

I therefor feel absolutely entitled to judge you, and those with a similar attitude to you, severely.

I agree OP that there will be some who don't understand, then there are some who claim not to but perfectly well do, and then those who read detail (none in the cabinet it seems).

I have wondered why three was chosen. Kind interpretation is a family plus both sets of parents, unkind one is there are only three families who Mr Johnson has that he acknowledges.

@plannit

I think that if households A, B and C are a bubble for household A but they see those households at different times say Christmas for B and Boxing Day for C - B can then have a household D after they've seen A as they never mixed with B!

It's complicated but not increasing their risk surely?

No! That’s definitely not allowed. It’s three households in a bubble, not difficult to understand. It increases the risk of community spread, even if not the individual risk. If one of the households has it, and a fourth household gets involved after the initial meeting it has the opportunity to spread to four households, not three. Please stick to the actual rules and be thankful they didn’t cancel it altogether!

@Theterrorrun

It does seem a bit stupid to me that there's no cap on the total number of people who can meet at once though. People could potentially be crammed in like sardines.

Yes, it’s complete madness. You could have 12-15 people crammed into a small dining room.

The advice should have been to stick to your existing bubble unless it was to avoid leaving someone on their own or for other special circumstances such as terminal illness.

I think people are wilfully misunderstanding because they have every intention of doing whatever suits them, but would rather criticise the rules than own their choice to break them

FearlessGreatExpanse

If only you knew what I did for a living!

It is not about the rules. It is about the self righteous who think that they are superior and need to explain to the poor thick people.

Think about what people did under Enver Hoxha, it seems unbelievable to us now until we read some of the threads on here.

People have lost a sense of reality.

Many (most?) people are interpreting the rules to suit themselves, or if they can’t make that ‘work’, are just openly disregarding them. I can’t legislate for others behaviour, that’s on them. I think relaxing rules for a virus that doesn’t know or care about is crazy. We are exercising common sense and not seeing anyone - fairer and easier than picking and choosing. January and February are going to be a nightmare.

'Its confusing' is code for 'I'm going to do what I want but absolve myself of responsibility' on the whole, I do agree the odd person may find it harder to understand but the general population should easily get it

@WillSantaBeComingToTown

FearlessGreatExpanse

If only you knew what I did for a living!

It is not about the rules. It is about the self righteous who think that they are superior and need to explain to the poor thick people.

Think about what people did under Enver Hoxha, it seems unbelievable to us now until we read some of the threads on here.

People have lost a sense of reality.

Will Santa be coming to town? No, but COVID probably will.

Yes agree there is some confusion
Eg my sister could see us and her in laws, but not if her in laws also want to see their other offspring, and not if we wanted to also see my mum for example

I find the rules are clear but, as a PP stated, many don't seem to have any idea what 2 metres looks like.
Is it a sign that the education system is stuffed?

People don't give a fuck and will do what they want.
Thankfully, I live in tier 3 now so people can't also meet their Mates in the pub over Christmas "relaxation", as I know a lot were planning.

@Diddlysquatty

Yes agree there is some confusion
Eg my sister could see us and her in laws, but not if her in laws also want to see their other offspring, and not if we wanted to also see my mum for example
Well you aren't confused.You understand it perfectly.

I thought the tiers were disbanded for the 5 days over xmas? Aren't we all tier0 or somesuch?

Ok @TeenPlusTwenties you're right. I obviously can't get my head round it either!

I'll just be seeing my mum who is also a bubble with us anyway as a single person and my sister so I never gave it much thought before. Just for a few hours in Christmas Day.

The rules are very clear three households can form a bubble. No-one can meet anyone outside of the bubble.
But unfortunately 50% of the population is below average intelligence so it's not surprising some can't work it out.

@RememberSelfCompassion

I thought the tiers were disbanded for the 5 days over xmas? Aren't we all tier0 or somesuch?

No.

I'm not planning to see anyone. My parents will be on their own.

My sister will spend Christmas with her PIL and her SIL's family, which seemed fine, but I'll admit it hadn't occurred to me that she should also find out if SIL is planning to see her in laws.

My Mum said it was ok to come to us for Xmas Day breakfast and the DBro’s for lunch as that made 3 families in all.
I pointed out that sils mum would be there and then my nephew would probably bring his gf so that was around 5
Some people ARE confused, some are trying to bend the rules and some are willingly ignoring them

@Theterrorrun

It does seem a bit stupid to me that there's no cap on the total number of people who can meet at once though. People could potentially be crammed in like sardines.

Scotland has said a maximum of 8 people over the 3 households but children under 12 don't count in the 8.

People are choosing there own risk levels as adults I would assume. I hate all these Covid police threads!