To think a woman wouldn't be praised for this like a man was

[GlummyMcGlummerson]

Seen this story a few times today about Tom Cruise screaming at crew members on the set of Mission Impossible 7 for not social distancing and threatening to fire them www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/entertainment-arts-55330579

The comments on social media are almost unanimously positive, lots of "good for him" "well done Tom" and "he's gone up in my estimation".

Any time I see something like this I imagine how the reaction would be if it was a story about a woman. If Nicole Kidman had done this I bet my bottom dollar she'd be branded a psycho, hysterical, over emotional, needs to calm down, who does she think she is speaking like that to those poor men etc.

FWIW I think he behaved appallingly if my boss screamed at me at work I'd have something to say about it.

But AIBU to think a woman would have been treated differently for doing the same thing?

She’d 100% be called a “Karen”

Snap! @SherryPalmer

Hang on @BrumBoo.

Women stick up for women. Women can't criticise other women. Women are right at all costs.

Men can't stick up for women cause they're not women and I'm an idiot if I think they would. They can stick up for themselves.

What world are you and glummy heading to? Men Vs women for the rest of time?

I'm not sure if you're being deliberately goady

I love how you know you're being so, and are trying to turn it around on other posters! Very good.

I would never not believe a woman. Ever.

I honestly don't believe you. You're apparently in denial about the fact that false accusations are rare, then you say this. I'm not buying it.

But what I struggle with is people who truly believe men can't support us, be feminists , and that women can only stand by women. And I mean that genuinely glummy.

When have I said men can't support women?

And FWIW, yes you and your kind are a huge part of the problem. I speak to survivors regularly, some have been cast out by their own families - their mothers, siblings, friends - because it's "just another false accusation" and she's "playing the woman card". People like you normalise and perpetuate that, those sayings, those myths. You give merit to misogynists which are just waiting for a woman to say "woman can be liars, what about the falsely accused" to go "yes, see, a woman agrees with me so I'm not a sexist!".

You are part of the problem. I genuinely mean that.

@BrumBoo

I'm not sure if you're being deliberately goady

I love how you know you're being so, and are trying to turn it around on other posters! Very good.

I'm not goady one bit.

Find me anything I said that's goady , and just not against your beliefs and I won't be bullied down. That's not goading.
Trying to claim that we are all claiming misandry when in actual fact no one has said anything of the sort but the word misogyny had been used about 29 times IS goady.

Men can't stick up for women cause they're not women and I'm an idiot if I think they would. They can stick up for themselves.

Men can stick up for women. I cant remember the last time it happened, can you give some solid examples?

They can stick up for themselves though. Perhaps if as a group they stopped perpetuating stereotypes about women (such as the 'Karen' memes), women in general wouldn't feel the need to point out the hypocrisy in male/female societal situations.

@GlummyMcGlummerson

I would never not believe a woman. Ever.

I honestly don't believe you. You're apparently in denial about the fact that false accusations are rare, then you say this. I'm not buying it.

But what I struggle with is people who truly believe men can't support us, be feminists , and that women can only stand by women. And I mean that genuinely glummy.

When have I said men can't support women?

And FWIW, yes you and your kind are a huge part of the problem. I speak to survivors regularly, some have been cast out by their own families - their mothers, siblings, friends - because it's "just another false accusation" and she's "playing the woman card". People like you normalise and perpetuate that, those sayings, those myths. You give merit to misogynists which are just waiting for a woman to say "woman can be liars, what about the falsely accused" to go "yes, see, a woman agrees with me so I'm not a sexist!".

You are part of the problem. I genuinely mean that.

I can't be arsed scrolling back but I think uojl find you said something along the lines of me being an idiot if I think men will back us, no?

As per your second post you are talking absolute nonsense.

Firstly I don't involve myself with people I don't know but I would always believe someone I loved and cared about . Male or female. I don't bog myself down in stats because each and every case is frankly none of my fucking business.

I know some lovely men and some dickhead men. I know some lovely women and some arsehole women. I know women who have hurt women , women who have hurt men , men who have hurt men and men who have hurt women.

Am I getting the point across yet? I'm not sexist. I'm not misogynistic. I take everything as it comes.
And believe what you like at this stage but if it was women getting hammered on here all day every day I'd be saying something there too - I was over on the accidental pregnancy one yesterday sticking up for OP while a host of women told her she was a slapper and it was a mess.

Telling me I can't be a feminist because I don't automatically label all men as bad and see sexism in everything I see (only towards women obviously) is against the very grounds of what feminism should be - I'm with Emma on that one.

What I don't believe is that all men are bad , or that there is sexism to be found in everything and anything.

There's a massive difference glummy. Huge.

@GlummyMcGlummerson , just because I think false accusations happen more than we talk about , doesn't mean I personally would never believe a woman! What a ridiculous link to make!

@BrumBoo

Men can't stick up for women cause they're not women and I'm an idiot if I think they would. They can stick up for themselves.

Men can stick up for women. I cant remember the last time it happened, can you give some solid examples?

They can stick up for themselves though. Perhaps if as a group they stopped perpetuating stereotypes about women (such as the 'Karen' memes), women in general wouldn't feel the need to point out the hypocrisy in male/female societal situations.

Men , known for their massive use of Facebook social media and tagging their pals in funny memes are the only users of Karen memes are they?

Are you wanting an anecdote or some random example of a man sticking up for a woman? i don't believe that you as intelligent as you seem (I mean that ) genuinely have gone through your whole life seeing all men ever refuse to ever stick up for a woman.

@BrumBoo

Men can't stick up for women cause they're not women and I'm an idiot if I think they would. They can stick up for themselves.

Men can stick up for women. I cant remember the last time it happened, can you give some solid examples?

They can stick up for themselves though. Perhaps if as a group they stopped perpetuating stereotypes about women (such as the 'Karen' memes), women in general wouldn't feel the need to point out the hypocrisy in male/female societal situations.

And in this thread alone , we (women if you like) don't perpetuate stereotypes against men?

I know we will never agree , and that's fine. But this theme of labelling any woman who believes that we shouldn't segregate men and women in this way as a misogynist doesnt help the cause one bit. It might make woman stronger a group, but it's making the divide wider.

Men , known for their massive use of Facebook social media and tagging their pals in funny memes are the only users of Karen memes are they?

Men created the 'Karen' meme. No, as evident here women also perpetuate is - often to show how very not 'Karen' they, 'look, we can laugh at women as well, how cool are we' types. Trouble is, at some point they too will be called a 'Karen', it just takes one complaint, one moment of getting angry in the wrong company, one moment of pissing off a man....

Are you wanting an anecdote or some random example of a man sticking up for a woman? i don't believe that you as intelligent as you seem (I mean that ) genuinely have gone through your whole life seeing all men ever refuse to ever stick up for a woman.

If men sticking up for women was actually a thing, female sexism wouldn't be so prevalent in society, would it?

Agree with what he was saying but he needs to jump off his high horse.

He’s so concerned about the welfare of others in a pandemic? I wonder when the last time he saw his daughter was. Can bet your bottom dollar he wasn’t home schooling.

@BrumBoo

Men , known for their massive use of Facebook social media and tagging their pals in funny memes are the only users of Karen memes are they?

Men created the 'Karen' meme. No, as evident here women also perpetuate is - often to show how very not 'Karen' they, 'look, we can laugh at women as well, how cool are we' types. Trouble is, at some point they too will be called a 'Karen', it just takes one complaint, one moment of getting angry in the wrong company, one moment of pissing off a man....

Are you wanting an anecdote or some random example of a man sticking up for a woman? i don't believe that you as intelligent as you seem (I mean that ) genuinely have gone through your whole life seeing all men ever refuse to ever stick up for a woman.

If men sticking up for women was actually a thing, female sexism wouldn't be so prevalent in society, would it?

But that's a swings and roundabouts argument. Men could say exactly the same thing , because your version of feminism is actively forbidding women from sticking up for men.

And in this thread alone , we (women if you like) don't perpetuate stereotypes against men?

Sorry, I've been cooking and eating dinner so I've missed the stereotypes against men on this thread. I'm only replying to what I've been tagged in.

@BrumBoo

And in this thread alone , we (women if you like) don't perpetuate stereotypes against men?

Sorry, I've been cooking and eating dinner so I've missed the stereotypes against men on this thread. I'm only replying to what I've been tagged in.

Brumboo, be that as it may , you know from your activity on these threads that all men are lumped into one 'class'.

because your version of feminism is actively forbidding women from sticking up for men.

And what oppression are men facing in society that needs you sticking up for them? What opportunities are they being denied, what privilege are they missing?

@wheresmykimchi, one class of what?

I'm not a misogynist

You have a heap on internalised misogyny. You really do.

But why don't you tell these women that they must side with their own and air your views about men that you clearly have?

Because my role is to support, listen and signpost. It's not about me in that context.

Did you seriously call someone a poo poo head and write about all the menz? Do you know how hard it is to take someone seriously and give credibility to their posts when they use language like that?

Well the first was clearly a joke and the "menz" refers to when people talk about women's problems and absent minded poster nip on to make it about men. HTH

@BrumBoo

because your version of feminism is actively forbidding women from sticking up for men.

And what oppression are men facing in society that needs you sticking up for them? What opportunities are they being denied, what privilege are they missing?

Thats a separate argument though isn't it (and a waste of time one , really, as you pair would just argue everything I said ).

The point is that you are telling me that I as a woman can never defend a man against other women , or if a woman makes any kind of claim against a man (I mean ridiculous ones like this , not abuse and the like ) then we must unanimously support it , or we are not proper women or feminists.

Even you must see the hypocrisy , irony and sexism in this.

Thanks for taking one for the team @GlummyMcGlummerson and keeping the feminist occupied

This thread feels like the MRA holding pen, but at least while they're shitposting here the other threads are safe

And yes, a woman would have been a "Karen".

Look at the vitriol JKR got for gently pointing out that people who have periods are called women.

@GlummyMcGlummerson

I'm not a misogynist

You have a heap on internalised misogyny. You really do.

But why don't you tell these women that they must side with their own and air your views about men that you clearly have?

Because my role is to support, listen and signpost. It's not about me in that context.

Did you seriously call someone a poo poo head and write about all the menz? Do you know how hard it is to take someone seriously and give credibility to their posts when they use language like that?

Well the first was clearly a joke and the "menz" refers to when people talk about women's problems and absent minded poster nip on to make it about men. HTH

In your opinion.

Right. OK. I can't even be bothered with that , partly because despite you being dismissive of my experience as a domestic abuse survivor I can't bring myself to be dismissive of your rol.

But this isn't a thread about women's problems. Your thread is ABOUT A MAN. You asked if we thought a woman would have the same treatment . We said yes. You didn't like it, because the only acceptable answer is yes.

Thats a separate argument though isn't it (and a waste of time one , really, as you pair would just argue everything I said ).

Its not. You said this thread was actively stopped women sticking up for men, that as a society we are being (for all intent and purpose) oppressive and stereotyping men for our own agenda. I'm asking for examples and how this is affecting men in a wider context. In essence, why do we 'need to stick up for men' - what are the consequences of not doing so, versus the actual effects of society not 'sticking up for women' in the same vein?

@Wheresmykimchi

Oh my god! It's you again!! You were on the drag thread yesterday banging this drum.

What exactly is your agenda? What happened to make you passionate about this issue?

@veeeeh

Search "Karens in the Wild" on youTube. God of almighty, there are either not enough prescribed drugs, or too many street drugs/alcohol.

Sorry as a woman myself I am mortified by their behaviour.

Men usually hit out physically, women verbally. Usually I said.

Search "violent men" - there wouldn't be enough time in your lifetime to Wade through all the horrific crimes they commit.

Yet it's women who've been given a name for their behaviour