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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think this is unacceptable?

386 replies

flaviaritt · 14/12/2020 08:07

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9048759/Family-kicked-United-flight-New-Jersey-toddler-refused-wear-mask.html

This family were forced to leave a flight home because their two year old wouldn’t ‘comply’ with mask-wearing.

She’s 2.

Has the world gone mad? Surely it’s common sense that a young child should not be forced into a mask? Surely it’s a violation of the rights of the child to insist upon this?

OP posts:
NewMum0305 · 14/12/2020 10:05

From the WHO:

In general, children aged 5 years and under should not be required to wear masks. This advice is based on the safety and overall interest of the child and the capacity to appropriately use a mask with minimal assistance. There may be local requirements for children aged 5 years and under to wear masks, or specific needs in some settings, such as being physically close to someone who is ill. In these circumstances, if the child wears a mask, a parent or other guardian should be within direct line of sight to supervise the safe use of the mask.

Original poster
flaviaritt · 14/12/2020 10:06

The 2 yo policy is backed up by the CDC and is commonplace in the US seemingly. So no, their policy is not unreasonable. We don't get to enforce our policies and ideals on a different nation just because we feel morally superior to them

I get to say something is disgusting whenever I want to.

OP posts:
Sweetmotherofallthatisholyabov · 14/12/2020 10:06

They also have a policy that insists 2 year olds are physically restrained in their seats..... they're literally tied to the seat

FestiveChristmasLights · 14/12/2020 10:06

I don’t agree with the policy of making a two year old wear a mask but that is the policy and it’s their responsibility to both know that and prepare their child for the flight.

It’s a non essential journey in the middle of a pandemic, so it’s hard for me to have too much sympathy under the circumstances.

17days · 14/12/2020 10:07

I'd imagine they're gonna backtrack and/or change things now because this looks awful for them. But they've had numerous issues like this in recent years (people getting removed for absurd reasons) and it never seems to affect them.

Remember that old man they forcibly removed a few years ago because they had overbooked the plane, and he didn't want to be the one getting off so they got security to break his nose and pull him off? They paid him $140 million dollars in a settlement, apparently. Do you think it affect their bottom line in the long term, though? Doubtful.

SleepingStandingUp · 14/12/2020 10:08

@Sweetmotherofallthatisholyabov

They also have a policy that insists 2 year olds are physically restrained in their seats..... they're literally tied to the seat
Yes @flaviaritt why aren't you up in arms about this?
Original poster
flaviaritt · 14/12/2020 10:10

SleepingStandingUp

Because restraining a child painlessly for their own safety isn’t abusive and putting a mask over their mouth and nose is.

OP posts:
OchonAgusOchonO · 14/12/2020 10:13

Loads of countries require mask wearing at a young age. My niece lives in spain and has sent photos of her 2 year old wearing masks without any issues. If something is required, you obviously need to spend time normalising it for your child if there could potentially be an issue. These parents didn't and, I suspect, decided to make a deliberate point of it.

Sure, some 2 year olds will object, the same way some will object to being put in a car seat or having the seat belt put on in the plane. As a parent, you then need to decide what is the best approach. Should you choose another method of transport? Should you practise with them in advance to normalise it? You don't just decide Feck it, I don't like the rule so I'll ignore it.

One of mine absolutely hated being in a car seat, even at that age. That was not an option so, despite many tears, we persisted. I expect most parents are the same and if they're not, they should be.

Moondust001 · 14/12/2020 10:16

@flaviaritt

I agree they shouldn’t be travelling by air unnecessarily, but the airline has no idea why they’re travelling so that’s not a lot to do with this. Most people seem to agree that it’s wrong to force a 2 year old into a mask. Good, I thought so.
I'm not remotely in the Covid hysteria camp, and I would agree that 2 years old is young to be able to enforce masks. But "most people" need to understand that these are the rules that Delta enforce and widely publicised to the US public; and those rules are following the guidance set down by the CDC. In other words, is everyone also ok with, for example, British Airways or Easy Jet deciding that they won't follow the safety guidance set down by SAGE, the government or Public Health England? And I would also point out that the male in the video was also not wearing his mask correctly in a public place, and wasn't covering his nose. Is he also 2?

I suspect that what you are seeing here is a set up scene deliberately engineered for their own purposes.

KihoBebiluPute · 14/12/2020 10:16

You are right that it is unreasonable to force a 2 year old to wear a mask. The people who were being unreasonable were the parents, who put the family in that position unnecessarily. There is no situation where a 2 year old has to be on a commercial airline flight, so this situation was totally avoidable if the parents made better decisions. The airline was perfectly reasonable to behave as they did.

OchonAgusOchonO · 14/12/2020 10:18

@flaviaritt

SleepingStandingUp

Because restraining a child painlessly for their own safety isn’t abusive and putting a mask over their mouth and nose is.

So we can see your agenda quite clearly here.

Mask wearing protects others and provides a level of protection to the wearer. Seat belt wearing protects the wearer and others. No difference. And if you think forcing a child who objects to wear a seat belt is painless, you've never had a child who hates it.

Original poster
flaviaritt · 14/12/2020 10:18

The airline was perfectly reasonable to behave as they did.

Their behaviour is separate to that of the parents. They insist on 2 year olds wearing masks. They don’t have to do that. So they are accountable for the harm it causes.

OP posts:
Original poster
flaviaritt · 14/12/2020 10:18

So we can see your agenda quite clearly here.

Which means?

OP posts:
emilyfrost · 14/12/2020 10:20

YABU. They knew the policy and knew they were wanting to fly beforehand, so they had two choices: build up until he could wear a mask on the flight, or don’t fly at all.

That’s the policy; if you don’t like it, you don’t choose to fly with them.

KatherineJaneway · 14/12/2020 10:21

Why bother posting in AIBU? You clearly think you're right.

kirinm · 14/12/2020 10:22

@Marmite27

A) They knew the policy when they booked. B) Did it not occur to them to practice putting it on before the flight? We have kids masks here with characters on, I’m sure they do in America.

Of course it’s not ‘violence’ that their policy includes 2 year olds. I have a 2 year old and she’s quite happy wearing a mask on the odd occasion. We have them in the dressing up box, originally for the dr and vet set, but they now get used when they play shops.

Yeah, that's not weird at all is it. I'm hoping my two year old doesn't remember a time when adults wore masks and were terrified of speaking to other people.
RainingBatsAndFrogs · 14/12/2020 10:22

I wouldn’t have relished putting a mask on my two year olds. But then insisting on a seat belt for take off and landing was also tricky.

There are choices of airline on US domestic flights.

As an adult I might choose a ‘mask only’ airline. I don’t want to catch COVID from a 2 year old any more than I want to catch it from anyone else.

ScalpHelp · 14/12/2020 10:22

I don’t get the outrage, 2 or not, the toddler can still be a vector of the disease

kirinm · 14/12/2020 10:23

@flaviaritt

So we can see your agenda quite clearly here.

Which means?

I think it means you must be a covid-denier or something because you have the audacity to suggest making a toddler wear a mask is not actually a good thing. Forcing a small child to normalise wearing a mask is not a good thing.
ChardonnaysPetDragon · 14/12/2020 10:23

But surely it’s the family who ultimately are responsible. They know the rules and they choose to fly with that airline. They don’t need to, they can choose a different airlift they can choose to drive.

ScalpHelp · 14/12/2020 10:23

Jesus Christ. Wearing a face covering doesn’t amount to abuse.

Original poster
flaviaritt · 14/12/2020 10:25

ScalpHelp

And if the 2 year old puts the mask on themselves and is happy, that’s right. If you’re forcing them into it despite their distress, of course it does, and it’s shocking any adult would think otherwise.

OP posts:
Original poster
flaviaritt · 14/12/2020 10:25

I think it means you must be a covid-denier or something because you have the audacity to suggest making a toddler wear a mask is not actually a good thing

You think wrong. And I think the audacity is in suggesting it’s not abusive to forcibly mask up confused little children.

OP posts:
lomojojo · 14/12/2020 10:26

United is infamous in the US for its crazy bad service. A few years ago they knocked a doctor out and dragged him off a plane because they wanted to give his (paid for) seat to a staff member getting a ride.

Original poster
flaviaritt · 14/12/2020 10:26

Yeah, that's not weird at all is it. I'm hoping my two year old doesn't remember a time when adults wore masks and were terrified of speaking to other people.

My child will probably remember masks. What she will never remember is the distress of her mother pushing her face into one.

OP posts: