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AIBU?

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Original poster

To find drag queens offensive?

999 replies

MrsMummy500 · 12/12/2020 18:39

AIBU to find drag queens really bloody offensive?

I hate the term offensive, it’s bandied around far too often at far too insignificant things (am aware this may be one of them). BUT, men dressing up as some fetishised version of a man made ideal of a woman really pisses me off. Hyper hair, max make up, drink in hand, revealing clothes.

I do not know a single woman like that. It riles me and I feel like I’m unable to express it as women have lost so much of their space to LGBTQ+ community (I perceive this, I don’t say it as a fact).
potential bomb drop alert but if white people are taken down (rightly IMO) for ‘blacking up’ should it be acceptable for men to parody women in the form of drag queens.

Ps- I do not buy for one minute that they are celebrating the female form with balloon breasts. It feels more like a piss take.

OP posts:
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GlummyMcGlummerson · 13/12/2020 23:20

And I don't have a problem with male gender expression - I think what Harry Styles is doing right now is brilliant and progressive. Simply because he refuses to be confined by male expectations and stereotypes - and he's managed to do this without claiming he's a woman. Harry recognises dressing in skirts does not make you female

Quaagars · 13/12/2020 23:21

Me - You're still a woman whatever

You - FYI there's no one way to be a woman - because you just are

How exactly are we disagreeing?!

I'm not the one who originally brought bloody clothes into it.

I was merely referring to a comment where someone had.
I'm a woman because I AM a woman, not because of how I choose to dress.
Hence my "you're still a woman whatever" comment

BrumBoo · 13/12/2020 23:21

As in, we're all individuals, we all have different opinions
As in, whether you are a woman who likes to dress in lots of make up, high heels, short skirts and low tops, or whether you're one who wears no make up, boots, more "blokey" clothes etc
You're still a woman whatever.
Whereas if you're black, Asian, Jew, etc or straight, gay, lesbian, bi, pan, whatever there's only one way to be that.
Because you just are!

And here, ladies and any gentlemen reading, is the very clearest post on internalised misogyny yet. Being a woman is down to your personality, whilst your race or sexuality is something inherently built into you. Its not like there's any built in factors to being a woman, like... oh I dont know XX chromosomes? No, that, unlike race or sexuality, can be completely ignored for how you feel in your head. Only when it involves your sex though, that's important to remember. Your label as a race or sexuality isn't interchangeable, but being a woman 100% is. Because that makes total sense.

2020 everyone, what a wonderful time to live in.

GlummyMcGlummerson · 13/12/2020 23:22

How exactly are we disagreeing?!

Because you've based your definition of "woman" on clothing choices whereas I've based it on biology

GlummyMcGlummerson · 13/12/2020 23:24

@Quaagars you think there's more than one way to be a woman - I think there's only one way to be a woman. Which is An adult human female (biologically and chromosomally)

Yokey · 13/12/2020 23:24

I think I love you@BrumBoothis was an excellent response

Me too 😍

Quaagars · 13/12/2020 23:24

That was a cross post ladies and gentlemen reading, as I'm sure the poster will soon realise soon enough for themselves

Being a woman is down to your personality, whilst your race or sexuality is something inherently built into you

Never said anything of the sort. Or the rest of your post.

BrumBoo · 13/12/2020 23:24

@GlummyMcGlummerson

And I don't have a problem with male gender expression - I think what Harry Styles is doing right now is brilliant and progressive. Simply because he refuses to be confined by male expectations and stereotypes - and he's managed to do this without claiming he's a woman. Harry recognises dressing in skirts does not make you female
Absolutely, I think this evey time I see or hear about him. I truly hope he doesn't go down the gender label route because what he's doing right now is fucking perfect as it is. Just being him, a man who dresses and does as he pleases because that's who he is. He's one of the few truly inspirational people around in terms of breaking the gender wheel.
Quaagars · 13/12/2020 23:25

Because you've based your definition of "woman" on clothing choices whereas I've based it on biology

No I haven't, have you missed where I was quoting someone else going on about clothes?!

GlummyMcGlummerson · 13/12/2020 23:26

I agree @BrumBoo he's inspirational. There was some bearded prick a while ago who donned a skirt and said he was "widening the bandwidth of what it means to be a woman". I wondered why he was widening the bandwidth of what it means to be a man. Harry is doing that, and with style, and I too hope he doesn't go down the gender route as it really does just seem to be about clothes for him.

GlummyMcGlummerson · 13/12/2020 23:27

@Quaagars

Because you've based your definition of "woman" on clothing choices whereas I've based it on biology

No I haven't, have you missed where I was quoting someone else going on about clothes?!

Well whatever ere you expecting people to take from your comment when you said there's only one way to be your race/religion/sexuality but tbh eyes lots of ways to be a woman because you could wear dresses/man clothes/heels etc. How did you think a comment like that came across?
Quaagars · 13/12/2020 23:30

I think there's only one way to be a woman. Which is An adult human female (biologically and chromosomally)

We're trying to bring it round to trans issues again, aren't we?!
Actually try and read my posts.
People are talking about how women should dress, what women should or shouldn't wear make up wise, what they should be thinking.
I'm merely saying that there is no way to be a woman as we are all different.
I never even mentioned trans.
I did mention clothing but only because someone else brought it up first and I was replying.

formerbabe · 13/12/2020 23:31

Well whatever ere you expecting people to take from your comment when you said there's only one way to be your race/religion/sexuality but tbh eyes lots of ways to be a woman because you could wear dresses/man clothes/heels etc. How did you think a comment like that came across

So I'm definitely Jewish because there's only one way to be that apparently? I was always confident I was a,woman but apparently there's loads of ways to be a woman and now I'm not sure I'm doing it right...

GlummyMcGlummerson · 13/12/2020 23:31

@Quaagars not bringing it round to trans issues at all. But my point still stands - there's only one way to be a woman. The rest is just about personality. Drag queens think having a "female" personality, or knack or performing a stereotype of one, allows them caricature women

GlummyMcGlummerson · 13/12/2020 23:32

@formerbabe

Well whatever ere you expecting people to take from your comment when you said there's only one way to be your race/religion/sexuality but tbh eyes lots of ways to be a woman because you could wear dresses/man clothes/heels etc. How did you think a comment like that came across

So I'm definitely Jewish because there's only one way to be that apparently? I was always confident I was a,woman but apparently there's loads of ways to be a woman and now I'm not sure I'm doing it right...

Also I'm pretty sure you could stop being Jewish if you wanted to.
formerbabe · 13/12/2020 23:33

I'm merely saying that there is no way to be a woman as we are all different

Different in what way?

BrumBoo · 13/12/2020 23:34

I'm merely saying that there is no way to be a woman as we are all different.

You are confusing what it is to have a personality and what it is to be a woman. You said that you are inherently a race or sexuality but being a woman is something that is not set. Well it is, it's just you're taking 'personality' and replacing it with gender. Its not about the trans issue, its about saying there is a clear definition of woman, and that is by the XX chromosome and biology. You're talking about the choice of being any woman you want to be, but what you actually mean is 'you have have any personality you want but I believe personality can have feminine and masculine elements depending on the person'.

GlummyMcGlummerson · 13/12/2020 23:36

I think @Quaagars may be saying that for women, there's no right or wrong way to behave.

Which I agree with if that's what you meant?

But my point was that drag queens are not women therefore don't have the right to decide that they're "womaning" - just because "there's no right or wrong way to be a woman" it doesn't mean that sentiment applies to men.

GlummyMcGlummerson · 13/12/2020 23:39

@BrumBoo

I'm merely saying that there is no way to be a woman as we are all different.

You are confusing what it is to have a personality and what it is to be a woman. You said that you are inherently a race or sexuality but being a woman is something that is not set. Well it is, it's just you're taking 'personality' and replacing it with gender. Its not about the trans issue, its about saying there is a clear definition of woman, and that is by the XX chromosome and biology. You're talking about the choice of being any woman you want to be, but what you actually mean is 'you have have any personality you want but I believe personality can have feminine and masculine elements depending on the person'.

Yes, and I think what Quaagars is touching in is interesting. Male entitlement means men think they have the right to dominate everything, but especially women. They hear "there's no right or wrong way to be a woman" - and they don't think "Oh, of course, and that only applies to actual women". They think "that means I can be a woman then!". They are physically and figuratively barging their way into our world
BrumBoo · 13/12/2020 23:39

@GlummyMcGlummerson

I think *@Quaagars* may be saying that for women, there's no right or wrong way to behave.

Which I agree with if that's what you meant?

But my point was that drag queens are not women therefore don't have the right to decide that they're "womaning" - just because "there's no right or wrong way to be a woman" it doesn't mean that sentiment applies to men.

Mmm, I can agree with your first part. However the poster in question evidently believes men can think their way into 'womening'. On some level they evidently do think that ladybrain is an actual thing.
Quaagars · 13/12/2020 23:40

I think @Quaagars may be saying that for women, there's no right or wrong way to behave

Which I agree with if that's what you meant?

Yes.

Smallgoon · 13/12/2020 23:41

I dont know any women who like drag or seek it out. We just treat it like a bad smell and try to avoid. We are very aware just by being women living in this society that men try to demean us by shite like this.

I don't know a single female who takes offense to it tbf.

Smallgoon · 13/12/2020 23:43

I resent the BBC force feeding this freakery onto us.

Wow. Transphobic MN strikes again.

Quaagars · 13/12/2020 23:43

I don't know a single female who takes offense to it tbf

I've only come across offence taken on MN and was genuinely Confused when first heard the blackface comparison.
Only ever heard it or objections to drag on here.

GlummyMcGlummerson · 13/12/2020 23:43

@Smallgoon trans people are not drag queens. Who's the transphobe again?

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