To find drag queens offensive?

[MrsMummy500]

AIBU to find drag queens really bloody offensive?

I hate the term offensive, it’s bandied around far too often at far too insignificant things (am aware this may be one of them). BUT, men dressing up as some fetishised version of a man made ideal of a woman really pisses me off. Hyper hair, max make up, drink in hand, revealing clothes.

I do not know a single woman like that. It riles me and I feel like I’m unable to express it as women have lost so much of their space to LGBTQ+ community (I perceive this, I don’t say it as a fact).
potential bomb drop alert but if white people are taken down (rightly IMO) for ‘blacking up’ should it be acceptable for men to parody women in the form of drag queens.

Ps- I do not buy for one minute that they are celebrating the female form with balloon breasts. It feels more like a piss take.

Maybe it’s cos I don’t offend easily, but every single day without fail, someone is offended by something 😩 it’s getting boring now. I actually read a woman complaining that an elderly man said “hello” to her in the street. That was it. Just “hello”.
One day, no one will be able to breathe without offending someone else.

If your son came out as gay - would you accept him?

Of course - but what has this got to do with drag queens?

If your son wanted to do drag - would you also accept him?

I'll always accept my son but no I wouldn't support his choice

Honestly why does this matter? - can people not just be whoever they want to be anymore?

Seems not

@Emily15

Maybe it’s cos I don’t offend easily, but every single day without fail, someone is offended by something 😩 it’s getting boring now. I actually read a woman complaining that an elderly man said “hello” to her in the street. That was it. Just “hello”. One day, no one will be able to breathe without offending someone else.

Of all the things that didn't happen, this didn't happen the most.

If your son came out as gay - would you accept him? My son is gay - he is not a woman though - he is attracted to men - he doesn't need to stereotype a woman to be gay - we have talked about this and he agrees with my views!

I'll always accept my son but no I wouldn't support his choice

How does that pan out?

How do you accept but won't support? That sounds a bit of an oxymoron

If my uncle didnt get to to do drag they wouldnt be who they are. And that would be sad.

Is it sad when racists don't get to be who they want? If not then it's not ok for men who parody and appropriate women to "be who they want to be". I'm up for gender neutral clothing - bring it on, gendered clothing is bullshit anyway. But men can wear clothes marketed to women without staking a claim on womanhood

@Quaagars

I'll always accept my son but no I wouldn't support his choice

How does that pan out?

How do you accept but won't support? That sounds a bit of an oxymoron

Because I don't have to agree with every choice my children make. It doesn't mean I won't love them, accept them into my life and home, I just won't clap and say "oh that's a wonderful idea I've completely changed my outlook on drag queens now simply because my son is one"

There's clearly no one way to be a woman though

Can you explain this a bit more?

Amazingly you can disagree with what someone does whilst still loving them and accepting them. I know - astonishing isn't it? I can have a heated debate with someone, not take it personally and carry on being friends with them. I know that's a rare talent nowadays.....

Yabu. It's not supposed to be realistic.

Honestly why does this matter? - can people not just be whoever they want to be anymore?

Not if it has negative effects on an already oppressed group of people, in this case women.

I know these people and a lot of you are making assumptions about a person I love. It doesnt make sense to me.

You're not seeing the situation for what it is because your uncle chooses to be involved in a misogynistic lifestyle. Not my problem, doesn't stop it being wrong, as much as if you loved another family memeber who's a racist.

If my uncle didnt get to to do drag they wouldnt be who they are. And that would be sad.

Sad for you. Not for the fight against stereotyping women.

Its not fair to assume that drag is making fun of women. At all.

Its not fair that drag is appropriating what it means to be female. At all.

Can I ask all of you who are soagainstdrag queens

If your son came out as gay - would you accept him?

Of course, that's not a lifeschoice.

If your son wanted to do drag - would you also accept him?

I'd love joy, but I'd not accept this part of his life.

It's 2020

And misogyny is getting worse, positively celebrated. It's fucking embarrassing.

@formerbabe

There's clearly no one way to be a woman though

Can you explain this a bit more?

Yes I'd quite like to find out if I, as a female who has experienced all the oppression, challenges, discrimination and difficulties because of my biology, should "feel" before I get my woman card. Is it dresses and high heels? Or not being able to open jars? I'd love to know if which sexist stereotype I need to adhere to before I can call myself a woman

I'd love to know if which sexist stereotype I need to adhere to before I can call myself a woman

You'd have to ask your uncle that.

@Campervan69

Amazingly you can disagree with what someone does whilst still loving them and accepting them. I know - astonishing isn't it? I can have a heated debate with someone, not take it personally and carry on being friends with them. I know that's a rare talent nowadays.....

Oh thank god, I was worried that my kids were gonna be white supremacists and having to jump on board with it so ridiculous some people think "accept" means "agree with everything your child says and does". That's actually quite shitty parent IMO, never challenging their views and telling them they're always right

@BrumBoo

I'd love to know if which sexist stereotype I need to adhere to before I can call myself a woman

You'd have to ask your uncle that.

Wrong poster @BrumBoo although my uncle can't hear the word "period" without running out the room all flushed so I might just ask him the question for my own amusement

@BrumBoo

Honestly why does this matter? - can people not just be whoever they want to be anymore?

Not if it has negative effects on an already oppressed group of people, in this case women.

I know these people and a lot of you are making assumptions about a person I love. It doesnt make sense to me.

You're not seeing the situation for what it is because your uncle chooses to be involved in a misogynistic lifestyle. Not my problem, doesn't stop it being wrong, as much as if you loved another family memeber who's a racist.

If my uncle didnt get to to do drag they wouldnt be who they are. And that would be sad.

Sad for you. Not for the fight against stereotyping women.

Its not fair to assume that drag is making fun of women. At all.

Its not fair that drag is appropriating what it means to be female. At all.

Can I ask all of you who are soagainstdrag queens

If your son came out as gay - would you accept him?

Of course, that's not a lifeschoice.

If your son wanted to do drag - would you also accept him?

I'd love joy, but I'd not accept this part of his life.

It's 2020

And misogyny is getting worse, positively celebrated. It's fucking embarrassing.

I think I love you @BrumBoo this was an excellent response

@GlummyMcGlummerson ah my bad! No idea what happened there

@GlummyMcGlummerson thank you, nice to know I'm loved by someone on this thread

There's clearly no one way to be a woman though

Can you explain this a bit more?

As in, we're all individuals, we all have different opinions
As in, whether you are a woman who likes to dress in lots of make up, high heels, short skirts and low tops, or whether you're one who wears no make up, boots, more "blokey" clothes etc
You're still a woman whatever.
Whereas if you're black, Asian, Jew, etc or straight, gay, lesbian, bi, pan, whatever there's only one way to be that.
Because you just are!
Whereas being a woman is being an individual.
I don't buy all this "but you're brainwashed if you think like that", "women can't hold that opinion as choice doesn't exist in a vacuum" or whatever, or get on board with the whole telling other women what they should be doing to make themselves feel more confident like upthread. They take make up tips from people you (general you) don't approve of?
So what?
So much for people being allowed their own opinion.
Women are either allowed an opinion of their own or they aren't.

I’m part of the LGBTQ+ community, and I don’t have a problem with anyone who chooses to do drag and I even enjoy watching things like Ru Paul’s drag race, etc.

But I do think you have a valid point that should be looked at, I’m a woman and it’s my sexuality that makes me part of the community. I fully endorse androgyny and bio drag queens, anything you can think of, I wouldn’t tell someone who they could or couldn’t be. But I really do feel that you’ve pointed something out that should be addressed.

It’s way above my intelligence level to try and hold an argument on the subject, but I hope there’s a way to let them be themselves and do what they love whilst also respecting women. I try to be body positive and don’t like that an “ideal” woman in a mans eyes is like a caricature of one.

I think if we can make adjustments to things like pronouns (rightfully so) then there must be some small measures we could take to all feel respected 🤞🏻

As in, whether you are a woman who likes to dress in lots of make up, high heels, short skirts and low tops, or whether you're one who wears no make up, boots, more "blokey" clothes etc
You're still a woman whatever.
Whereas if you're black, Asian, Jew, etc or straight, gay, lesbian, bi, pan, whatever there's only one way to be that.
Because you just are!

So I was right then - womanhood is about clothes.

How utterly fucking depressing.

FYI there's no one way to be a woman - because you just are. And that's based in biology, not clothing.

I fucking HATE it.

It's so retrograde, sort of 'end of the pier 1975' type humour. Can't believe the mainstream media are in thrall to it so much. Its everywhere on netflix, BBC... I was at the till in tesco yesterday and saw a drag queen on the cover of Cosmo. I mean, jesus.

It makes my skin crawl in the same way that Jim Davidson and Jimmy Saville era comedy makes my skin crawl. And I'm sick of hearing it defended by Bromentum, Guardianista types. Fuck off.

Whereas being a woman is being an individual

I have no idea what this means.

Whereas if you're black, Asian, Jew, etc or straight, gay, lesbian, bi, pan, whatever there's only one way to be that

I don't understand this either. I'm Jewish, I'm not practising, in fact I consider myself agnostic but culturally Jewish. Lots of Jewish people do practice the faith and some are orthodox/reform/Hasidic. Some people are born Jewish and some convert.

So I'm completely confused as to how there's only one way to be Jewish but multiple ways to be a,woman.

A man who has been born male - and studies show male and female babies are treated differently from day one (screaming girls are trying to get attention, screaming boys have 'a good set of lungs') - has benefitted from male privilege. Even if you think that, the minute he becomes a TW, the male privilege stops - he still has a good number of years under his belt. He cannot "be" a woman based on a list of stereotypes he thinks "make" him a woman. That's not how it works. To claim is does is utterly, utterly regressive and sexist