Are people right to be worried about the vaccine?

[CutToChase]

I had a "good tempered" argument with DP last night. He says theres no way hes putting something in his body that hasnt undergone all the checks and tests and says that normally vaccines take 20 years to approve.

I think that when I have a choice between a known negative (covid) and an unknown (vaccine) I will always take the unknown.

In response he says people have forgotten a minuscule proportion of people actually suffer from covid. He says this is all about money (however he is a conspiracy theorist...)

What do you think about the vaccine and the speed of it?

Also vote:
YABU = I will not be getting the vaccine
YANBU = I will be getting the vaccine

What is your proposed route for how a strand of mRNA coding for a modified viral spike proteins could be suspected (no data) or being likely to cause (male or female?) infertility? Making sperm cells express the protein andntherefor be too big and heavy to swim optimally? My understanding is this is optimised for take up by muscle cells in the arm and isn't going to make it much further into the body?

Any drug/vaccine/food COULD affect fertility not course. Things like alcohol & smoking are far more likely to affect it and known to be damaging to sperm, yet most people TTC don't give up drinking (although my DH had to for a time ...)

It's weird how people are worried about the coronavirus vaccine causing infertility but not the virus itself.

...the virus itself causing infertility, obviously a lot of people dont really have to worry about catching COVID.

This above is incorrect. It was NOT thrown out.

Yes it was.

Vaccine studies for SARS-CoV-1 were started and tested in animal models. An inactivated whole virus was used in ferrets, nonhuman primates and mice. All of the vaccines resulted in protective immunity, but there were complications; the vaccines resulted in an immune disease in animals.

theconversation.com/the-mysterious-disappearance-of-the-first-sars-virus-and-why-we-need-a-vaccine-for-the-current-one-but-didnt-for-the-other-137583

The previous SARS was not as virulent, there wasn't the same number of cases and deaths, therefore there was not the same pressure to continue with the trials and studies.

That may be true, but my comment was in response to “It is based on the vaccine for previous SARS.” That vaccine developed problems when tested on animals and was abandoned.

@Porcupineinwaiting

...the virus itself causing infertility, obviously a lot of people dont really have to worry about catching COVID.

I’ve not seen this evidence and would want to investigate further. I’d express doubts because of a lack of longitudinal data.

Infertility in whom? Menopausal women?

@millymollymoomoo

I won’t be getting it and neither will my children Not be because I’m anti vaccine but because we are not in any higher risk categories and are fit and healthy. I know there is always a chance we could be the outliers and still get hit with COVID but on a weigh up of risks and the fact we don’t know what any possible long term side effects are I’ll pass I just don’t think we need it

Why do you think they need it less than the MMR? Or meningitis vaccine? Or polio and diphtheria?

^Also some people will be of the opinion that if they didnt watchthe.newsthey wouldn't know there was a pandemic. I work in a hospital and I only know 2 people who have had it, neither seriously^

That sounds wildly unlikely unless you live in the back of beyond and don't know many people. Without trying very hard, I can think of eleven people I know who have had it, one of them very seriously.

I dont live in the back of beyond. And I do know a few people who have worked on COVID wards. I'm not lying, as you seem to be implying. I am just saying what my experience is

@flaviaritt

You can only take judicial review proceedings against public bodies. Neither airlines nor restaurants are public bodies. They are perfectly free to decide who they do or do not want on their premises or inside their planes.

That’s a slightly different point. The government might actually have to pass laws disallowing this. But I doubt it. Airlines and restaurants want to make money like everyone else.

Absolutely. So if Airline A is seen to be safe than Airline B because it won't let unvaccinated people on its planes, (except perhaps isolated cases of people with genuine medical reasons for not being vaccinated around whom stringent safeguards are placed) which one is more likely to make money?

Australia has suspended vaccines due to covid vaccine containing AIDS virus......

Total bollocks.

Why isn’t this on mainstream tv news?

Is the BBC mainstream enough for you?

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-australia-55269381

Note the part where it says HIV wasn't there.

Why do we have to find things out online

By all means find things out online, but look at reputable sites as well as conspiracy theories.

The Australian vaccine trials were suspended as for some participants it produced a false positive for HIV. At no point did these people develop or contract HIV. It was felt that public confidence would not be high enough so it was stopped and Australia are looking towards the other vaccines.

There have been many vaccination research programmes taking place as is always the case with drug development.

There’s no big secret over the Australian vaccine HIV thing. Nobody is trying to hide it.

Bottom line: nobody is safe until everyone is safe

We need a very high percentage of the population vaccinated before the virus stops spreading ie. to prevent severe illness and death in many.

I don’t understand why, if people want this COVID pandemic to end, why they won’t have an approved vaccine. Are people happy to go on with masks, distancing, no hugging indefinitely? That’s the alternative.

The trust issue appears to be a big issue.
Why do people think that the best interests of populations are not paramount to scientists/medics?
Why do people not believe the Regulatory Bodies?
I really don’t understand the lack of trust.

milou it’s not a lack of trust. It’s an acknowledgment that these companies and indeed government operate for the benefit of the overall country and its population rather than individuals.

So a few odd adverse events - even if catastrophic - are worth it if most people are ok. Whereas as individuals and particularly parents, we tend to put the the interests of the individual first

So there is a clash of interests.

Do I think the vaccine will be ok? Yes, probably with the usual exceptions/odd reactions. Will I have it? No and neither do I have the flu vaccine

Whilst I am not anti vaccinations I do believe they are given sole credit for the reduction of illnesses such as diptheria, polio etc when just as much credit should be given to improved sanitation, improved housing, diets and general health. I don't think either would have achieved the reduction on their own.

The covid vaccine is not going to stop people getting the virus in the same way that the flu vaccine doesn't stop people getting the flu. It will just mean that people who are vulnerable won't be as ill and therefore may not need hospitalisation. It won't stop people carrying it and therefore spreading it asymptomatically which is the reason most of the world population has been subjected to national lockdowns of one sort or another.

What is the point in a normally healthy person with a robust immune system having the vaccine ? **ps I don't believe it contains a microchip or alters the DNA !

HibouMilou

So, those not prepared to be vaccinated are:

1. Prepared to benefit from the vaccination at a population level (if enough individuals take it up for it to be effective)
2. Are not prepared to be individuals (who make up the population) who take the vaccine to ensure this benefit is achieved for all.

If too many people have this attitude, we will all be locked down, wearing masks and socially distancing for everyone.

????
I really hope the scientific efforts/ money aren’t wasted because of this attitude.
I believe that this thread is probably not helping the global pandemic.

Please read the evidence from good sources.

@Blobby10

Whilst I am not anti vaccinations I do believe they are given sole credit for the reduction of illnesses such as diptheria, polio etc when just as much credit should be given to improved sanitation, improved housing, diets and general health. I don't think either would have achieved the reduction on their own.

The covid vaccine is not going to stop people getting the virus in the same way that the flu vaccine doesn't stop people getting the flu. It will just mean that people who are vulnerable won't be as ill and therefore may not need hospitalisation. It won't stop people carrying it and therefore spreading it asymptomatically which is the reason most of the world population has been subjected to national lockdowns of one sort or another.

What is the point in a normally healthy person with a robust immune system having the vaccine ? **ps I don't believe it contains a microchip or alters the DNA !

Because your bodies reaction to covid is completely unknown. Just ask the people who are 20-45 suffering from long covid including Olympic team rowers probably in the top 5% for health.

I've had friends (all in early 30s one used to be a marathon runner) with long covid it took them over 6 months to get back to work and unfortunately there doesn't seem to be any link to why someone develops long covid and others don't at the moment.

Mimishimi what a lot of tosh.

What does it mean on a practical level if one person in a couple gets the vaccine and the other doesnt?

well, it means your partner is still at risk from getting seriously ill from Covid. Even with a vaccine, you are still likely capable of passing the virus on to him if you come into contact with it... so, its hard to say at this stage what life will look like later in 2021 or 2022, but I'd hazard a guess to say that if your partner refuses the vaccine, he should be prepared to continue with personal limits and restrictions on doing things and seeing people for a much much longer time (and you too as presumably you would want to protect his health). Doesn't sound good to me

Also I think plenty of people have showed you how wrong his understanding and information is but I do find it funny that people worry about 'putting something into their body' that has been so rigorously tested for safety but probably eat fast-food/ processed food, drink alcohol or smoke cigarettes and do other things we KNOW to have harmful effects on our bodies, and are not constantly campaigning for better air quality/less pollution etc.... (or maybe your partner does already treat his body as a sacrosanct temple and you both live off grid with all natural products)

I’m not going to get it because I’m hoping to get pregnant in the next three months or shortly thereafter (and the government advice is not to get pregnant for 3 months after you have it).

I’ll get it afterwards though.

Why do you think they need it less than the MMR? Or meningitis vaccine? Or polio and diphtheria?

I’m not the poster you were responding to, but I expect because measles, mumps, rubella, meningitis, polio and diphtheria are all much more dangerous to children and young people. And they’re childhood vaccines - while the Covid vaccine isn’t being offered to children. Measles has a 30% death rate in the under 5s in some parts of the world I think?

Not necessarily my view, but I can see why people might feel differently about being vaccinated against measles and diphtheria etc vs. Covid.

@Blobby10

Whilst I am not anti vaccinations I do believe they are given sole credit for the reduction of illnesses such as diptheria, polio etc when just as much credit should be given to improved sanitation, improved housing, diets and general health. I don't think either would have achieved the reduction on their own.

The covid vaccine is not going to stop people getting the virus in the same way that the flu vaccine doesn't stop people getting the flu. It will just mean that people who are vulnerable won't be as ill and therefore may not need hospitalisation. It won't stop people carrying it and therefore spreading it asymptomatically which is the reason most of the world population has been subjected to national lockdowns of one sort or another.

What is the point in a normally healthy person with a robust immune system having the vaccine ? **ps I don't believe it contains a microchip or alters the DNA !

My friend's dad was a seemingly 'normally healthy person'. He was not particularly old (48) and had no health problems, was considered pretty healthy.

He died from Covid.